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You say "The attacks also proved that Israel's "containment" strategy has a massive flaw." ... and then go on to describe the containment strategy that they've

You say "The attacks also proved that Israel's "containment" strategy has a massive flaw." ... and then go on to describe the containment strategy that they've tried since 2005. The reality is that after Hamas' declaration of war, war was a terrible necessity. The extent of that necessity will be debated until the end of time, but I haven't seen the large public outrage that you describe. Yes, there's plenty of it, but as a whole just as much understanding of Israel's position and why so many civilians in Gaza died in the bombings.

parl_match 3y ago
The reality is that 3000 innocent children are dead. The reality is that many more innocent adults are dead. The reality is that almost a third of Palestinian housing is unlivable. The reality is that 2,000,000 people are now in a humanitarian crisis, due to IDF attacks. You can waffle about if it was or wasn't necessary, but the end result is that Israel is, if nothing else, facing a massive blow to public and western support as a result of their response - a response which seems more punitive than effective. This is incredibly dangerous for Israel, and what they've done may have hurt them in the long term more than help them. The American invasion of Iraq or Afghanistan has some parallels.... I don't have all the answers, I just call it like I see it.
- ashirusnw 3y ago
  I'm not sure what you've added to your original comment
  - parl_match 3y ago
    I don't think there was much more to add, tbh.
- Aeolun 3y ago
  I dunno, in the end the solution to a lot of people hurt certainly isn’t a lot more people hurt. Which seems to be what is happening now.
- anon291 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - arp242 3y ago
    "Israel should forever exercise military control over millions of non-citizens who have no democratic control over anything, for their own good of course." This is literally what you're saying... And with rhetoric like this you wonder why people call Israel an apartheid state... You literally are proposing that here. And what happened to "give me liberty or give me death", "you will not tread on me", "no taxation without representation", and all of that stuff so popular in the US? Guess that doesn't apply to the Arab...
    - anon291 3y ago
      Most of the world is run without democratic control. I mean, I hate the CCP, but given that there is no other government that is going to be able to keep any part of China running, is it so wrong to say that overthrowing the CCP by assassinating key leaders is a rash decision? Perfect should not be the enemy of good enough. > And what happened to "give me liberty or give me death", "you will not tread on me", "no taxation without representation", and all of that stuff so popular in the US? Guess that doesn't apply to the Arab... Americans culturally would not tolerate any of that. I think it would be good for Gazans to fight Israel for its independence on proper terms. Perhaps that would lead to a proper state instead of this barbarity. At what point did the continental army decide to kidnap children and rape women instead of engaging the British directly? But like I said before, perfect should not be the enemy of good. I have traveled extensively. Americans have a very unique culture. Most people around the world value order, while Americans mainly value the ability to run their own affairs at the local level. The Gazans have shown no interest in American-style democracy. Fine. This is not hypocrisy. The flags say 'Don't tread on me', not 'don't tread on them'.
    - phpisthebest 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - 3y ago
- xdennis 3y ago
  > The reality is that 3000 innocent children are dead. The reality is that many more innocent adults are dead. The reality is that almost a third of Palestinian housing is unlivable. The reality is that 2,000,000 people are now in a humanitarian crisis, due to IDF attacks. Do to Hamas attacks. If the IDF could avoid killing a single civilian they would, but we've seen how Hamas hides in schools, hospitals, and civilian housing. What other country builds tunnels under hospitals and transports anti-tank missiles in a baby stroller? Google it!
  - DangitBobby 3y ago
    So who is worse, the person that hides behind the innocent or the person that shoots through the innocent to kill them?
    - selestify 3y ago
      Obviously the person that hides behind the innocent. Are you supposed to not shoot at someone who’s shooting at you? No competent army on earth would make that choice.
      - DangitBobby 3y ago
        No, it's not obvious at all.
  - parl_match 3y ago
    I can think of a few ways they could have avoided, including a slower pace and more targeted strikes. But they didn't. And here's the thing: it kind of seems like the whole thing was a sick trap on the part of Hamas. >What other country builds tunnels under hospitals and transports anti-tank missiles in a baby stroller? Google it! It doesn't matter. More than twice the number of victims on 10/7 have died in Gaza, and they're all children. Four times if you include adults. The best you can accuse Israel of with those kind of numbers is _incompetence_. Like I said, a sick trap. And it looks like Israel fell for it. And now Israel, the dominant power in this conflict, gets to pay the price.

parl_match 3y ago

The reality is that 3000 innocent children are dead. The reality is that many more innocent adults are dead. The reality is that almost a third of Palestinian housing is unlivable. The reality is that 2,000,000 people are now in a humanitarian crisis, due to IDF attacks. You can waffle about if it was or wasn't necessary, but the end result is that Israel is, if nothing else, facing a massive blow to public and western support as a result of their response - a response which seems more punitive than effective. This is incredibly dangerous for Israel, and what they've done may have hurt them in the long term more than help them. The American invasion of Iraq or Afghanistan has some parallels.... I don't have all the answers, I just call it like I see it.

ashirusnw 3y ago
I'm not sure what you've added to your original comment
- parl_match 3y ago
  I don't think there was much more to add, tbh.
Aeolun 3y ago
I dunno, in the end the solution to a lot of people hurt certainly isn’t a lot more people hurt. Which seems to be what is happening now.
anon291 3y ago
[flagged]
- arp242 3y ago
  "Israel should forever exercise military control over millions of non-citizens who have no democratic control over anything, for their own good of course." This is literally what you're saying... And with rhetoric like this you wonder why people call Israel an apartheid state... You literally are proposing that here. And what happened to "give me liberty or give me death", "you will not tread on me", "no taxation without representation", and all of that stuff so popular in the US? Guess that doesn't apply to the Arab...
  - anon291 3y ago
    Most of the world is run without democratic control. I mean, I hate the CCP, but given that there is no other government that is going to be able to keep any part of China running, is it so wrong to say that overthrowing the CCP by assassinating key leaders is a rash decision? Perfect should not be the enemy of good enough. > And what happened to "give me liberty or give me death", "you will not tread on me", "no taxation without representation", and all of that stuff so popular in the US? Guess that doesn't apply to the Arab... Americans culturally would not tolerate any of that. I think it would be good for Gazans to fight Israel for its independence on proper terms. Perhaps that would lead to a proper state instead of this barbarity. At what point did the continental army decide to kidnap children and rape women instead of engaging the British directly? But like I said before, perfect should not be the enemy of good. I have traveled extensively. Americans have a very unique culture. Most people around the world value order, while Americans mainly value the ability to run their own affairs at the local level. The Gazans have shown no interest in American-style democracy. Fine. This is not hypocrisy. The flags say 'Don't tread on me', not 'don't tread on them'.
  - phpisthebest 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - 3y ago
xdennis 3y ago
> The reality is that 3000 innocent children are dead. The reality is that many more innocent adults are dead. The reality is that almost a third of Palestinian housing is unlivable. The reality is that 2,000,000 people are now in a humanitarian crisis, due to IDF attacks. Do to Hamas attacks. If the IDF could avoid killing a single civilian they would, but we've seen how Hamas hides in schools, hospitals, and civilian housing. What other country builds tunnels under hospitals and transports anti-tank missiles in a baby stroller? Google it!
- DangitBobby 3y ago
  So who is worse, the person that hides behind the innocent or the person that shoots through the innocent to kill them?
  - selestify 3y ago
    Obviously the person that hides behind the innocent. Are you supposed to not shoot at someone who’s shooting at you? No competent army on earth would make that choice.
    - DangitBobby 3y ago
      No, it's not obvious at all.
- parl_match 3y ago
  I can think of a few ways they could have avoided, including a slower pace and more targeted strikes. But they didn't. And here's the thing: it kind of seems like the whole thing was a sick trap on the part of Hamas. >What other country builds tunnels under hospitals and transports anti-tank missiles in a baby stroller? Google it! It doesn't matter. More than twice the number of victims on 10/7 have died in Gaza, and they're all children. Four times if you include adults. The best you can accuse Israel of with those kind of numbers is _incompetence_. Like I said, a sick trap. And it looks like Israel fell for it. And now Israel, the dominant power in this conflict, gets to pay the price.