5 ms·

I don't say this to sound dismissive, which I think is all too common in discussions like this. If we're talking about aerobic exercise, you don't need to "for

by pc86 3y ago

I don't say this to sound dismissive, which I think is all too common in discussions like this. If we're talking about aerobic exercise, you don't need to "form" anything. It's a monostructural movement. Buy a treadmill and jog on it for 20 minutes when you wake up. Buy a rower and do 5k every morning, or evening, or over lunch. Get a stationary bike and do 10 minutes on that whenever you remember to do it. This isn't strength training which benefits from having an actual program to follow put together by someone who knows what they're doing. Just pick a thing that you can do for 20 minutes without wanting to kill yourself, and do that thing for 20 minutes a few times a week. The most important part (in what the kids today would call "my lived experience") is to push yourself hard, sweat a lot, and do it at least 3 or 4 times a week. More is going to be better, especially at the beginning to build a habit, but twice a week is just sporadic enough where it's too easy to miss one and 2 becomes 1 becomes "once every 4 weeks." "Stable" also doesn't need to be the same amount of time at the same time of day on the same days every week.

ethanbond 3y ago
You are describing forming a stable routine I don't think GP meant "routine" as in an elaborate set of exercises, but rather the daily/weekly routine of doing any exercise at all.
- pc86 3y ago
  Maybe. I'm more describing making this important enough to you that you start looking for places to slot it into your day. Yes, a routine will likely form out of that but I think it's secondary to getting you to want to do the thing, which is harder (at least for me).
  - phatskat 3y ago
    > I'm more describing making this important enough to you that you start looking for places to slot it into your day I get where you’re coming from, and I think you’re missing the point. Executive dysfunction (for me at least) means I can “want to do the thing” a LOT, heck I can even have the motivation, but getting my brain and body to actually do the damn thing can feel insurmountable. There are certainly ways to work with and around executive dysfunction, it’s just difficult that one of the key aspects of it is that it makes the act of executing feel incredibly difficult.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - agbrrw 3y ago
      I am the same kind of person, and believe me, it's a lost battle to try to explain how impossible it is to get to do something every day. People who are normal in that sense will never understand. Their concept of laziness or of that "ah, it's going to be hard to get on that treadmill today" feeling is completely different from ours. Their brains are wired differently. Just read the answer below > The only thing ever stopping you from going out the door and running is putting on shoes and shorts, its easy to form a habit! For people like us, this is akin to "if you are depressed, just cheer up!". It's ridiculous, bordering on the offensive.
      - phatskat 3y ago
        Yep I replied to that one too lol. My roommate and I listened to a podcast episode the other day about the challenges of executive dysfunction and ADHD and it was validating to say the least. The podcast is called Struggle Care with KC Davis
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
    - metabagel 3y ago
      One approach is to put your body on auto-pilot. Just do the thing for 5 minutes or whatever, without consideration for whether you want to or not. The desire and will will typically develop over time. Get an easy win.
      - phatskat 3y ago
        If I could put my body on auto pilot in the way that I want to I’d be golden. Do I sit in front of my computer for hours at a time rewriting code I don’t need to rewrite? Sure. Do I knit and listen to the same podcast until I’m falling asleep? Yep. Can I autopilot myself into walking once a day? Nahhhh. I do get out to walk occasionally, and I absolutely love it, and nothing about that makes it “easy” to turn into a habit. I’m working on it, but it’s a slow process. The thing with executive dysfunction is that the desire and will are often there, they just aren’t making the call.
dymk 3y ago
This is a misunderstanding of what executive dysfunction means; somebody with executive function problems is not going to buy a treadmill much less use it every day.
- 1123581321 3y ago
  How about a walk around the block once a month? I struggle with executive dysfunction; when people describe a more aggressive routine than I could manage, I just mentally translate the numbers and level of consistency into what's achievable rather than berate them. Their point was: start with what's possible for you and go from there, because you don't need to achieve a certain threshold of activity or knowledge for the exercise to benefit you.
  - dymk 3y ago
    Executive dysfunction is different for everybody. I'm sure GP's comment is well intended, but advice in the form of "Just go DO the thing even if it's small" is about as helpful as telling a depressed person "Have you tried smiling?".
    - 1123581321 3y ago
      Because it varies, there’s even less reason to be upset. You know there are people whose dysfunction looks more like perfectionism or overplanning and the advice is meant for them. You understand that variance in individual cases means that not every general discussion will match yours.
    - sn9 3y ago
      I mean it can be as simple as playing Pokemon Go. Anything that gets your activity up will help. Lots of low intensity stuff is probably even more valuable than 20 minutes of moderate effort.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
bittercynic 3y ago
I tried a rower for the first time a couple days ago, and found immediate relief from ADHD-like symptoms that lasts a few hours. I'm not diagnosed, but have pretty severe trouble getting into a task-oriented mode, so much that dishes go unwashed, and my home is a mess. I feel the mess wearing away at me, but just can't deal with it. I'm not overly busy or tired, just procrastinating. After 5 minutes on the rower my mood drastically improved and I was much more productive than usual, and the effect lasted about 3 hours. I've had a few more sessions since then with similar effects. Also, it's a little spooky how often a subject comes on my radar, and then a few days later the subject surfaces on HN. Feels too frequent for it to be a coincidence.
- kortex 3y ago
  Exercise definitely helps my symptoms, but it's an absolute roll of the dice whether it's immediate and significant, or just tires me out. Really I need to keep up with a few times a week for at least a month to reap the benefits.
sn9 3y ago
> The most important part (in what the kids today would call "my lived experience") is to push yourself hard, sweat a lot, and do it at least 3 or 4 times a week. I wouldn't even say you need to push yourself hard. Getting yourself into 120-150 bpm for 30-60 minutes 3x per week will get you most of the benefits.
kortex 3y ago
> Buy a treadmill Have one. Plus chin up bar, and there's always bodyweight. > and jog on it for 20 minutes when you wake up. That's a routine. > Whenever you remember to do it. That's more akin to how my brain functions. But "when I remember" (/ have energy/motivation) is a huuge variable I struggle with. I understand you mean well but this is a thing I've struggled with for years. It tends to be boom or bust. I can go months with going to the gym regularly and it helps, then things get chaotic and it all falls apart, and it's exceptionally hard to restart, probably because of exactly such an executive deficit such exercise would help with.

by pc86 3y ago

ethanbond 3y ago

You are describing forming a stable routine I don't think GP meant "routine" as in an elaborate set of exercises, but rather the daily/weekly routine of doing any exercise at all.

pc86 3y ago
Maybe. I'm more describing making this important enough to you that you start looking for places to slot it into your day. Yes, a routine will likely form out of that but I think it's secondary to getting you to want to do the thing, which is harder (at least for me).
- phatskat 3y ago
  > I'm more describing making this important enough to you that you start looking for places to slot it into your day I get where you’re coming from, and I think you’re missing the point. Executive dysfunction (for me at least) means I can “want to do the thing” a LOT, heck I can even have the motivation, but getting my brain and body to actually do the damn thing can feel insurmountable. There are certainly ways to work with and around executive dysfunction, it’s just difficult that one of the key aspects of it is that it makes the act of executing feel incredibly difficult.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - agbrrw 3y ago
    I am the same kind of person, and believe me, it's a lost battle to try to explain how impossible it is to get to do something every day. People who are normal in that sense will never understand. Their concept of laziness or of that "ah, it's going to be hard to get on that treadmill today" feeling is completely different from ours. Their brains are wired differently. Just read the answer below > The only thing ever stopping you from going out the door and running is putting on shoes and shorts, its easy to form a habit! For people like us, this is akin to "if you are depressed, just cheer up!". It's ridiculous, bordering on the offensive.
    - phatskat 3y ago
      Yep I replied to that one too lol. My roommate and I listened to a podcast episode the other day about the challenges of executive dysfunction and ADHD and it was validating to say the least. The podcast is called Struggle Care with KC Davis
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
  - metabagel 3y ago
    One approach is to put your body on auto-pilot. Just do the thing for 5 minutes or whatever, without consideration for whether you want to or not. The desire and will will typically develop over time. Get an easy win.
    - phatskat 3y ago
      If I could put my body on auto pilot in the way that I want to I’d be golden. Do I sit in front of my computer for hours at a time rewriting code I don’t need to rewrite? Sure. Do I knit and listen to the same podcast until I’m falling asleep? Yep. Can I autopilot myself into walking once a day? Nahhhh. I do get out to walk occasionally, and I absolutely love it, and nothing about that makes it “easy” to turn into a habit. I’m working on it, but it’s a slow process. The thing with executive dysfunction is that the desire and will are often there, they just aren’t making the call.

dymk 3y ago

This is a misunderstanding of what executive dysfunction means; somebody with executive function problems is not going to buy a treadmill much less use it every day.

1123581321 3y ago
How about a walk around the block once a month? I struggle with executive dysfunction; when people describe a more aggressive routine than I could manage, I just mentally translate the numbers and level of consistency into what's achievable rather than berate them. Their point was: start with what's possible for you and go from there, because you don't need to achieve a certain threshold of activity or knowledge for the exercise to benefit you.
- dymk 3y ago
  Executive dysfunction is different for everybody. I'm sure GP's comment is well intended, but advice in the form of "Just go DO the thing even if it's small" is about as helpful as telling a depressed person "Have you tried smiling?".
  - 1123581321 3y ago
    Because it varies, there’s even less reason to be upset. You know there are people whose dysfunction looks more like perfectionism or overplanning and the advice is meant for them. You understand that variance in individual cases means that not every general discussion will match yours.
  - sn9 3y ago
    I mean it can be as simple as playing Pokemon Go. Anything that gets your activity up will help. Lots of low intensity stuff is probably even more valuable than 20 minutes of moderate effort.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

bittercynic 3y ago

I tried a rower for the first time a couple days ago, and found immediate relief from ADHD-like symptoms that lasts a few hours. I'm not diagnosed, but have pretty severe trouble getting into a task-oriented mode, so much that dishes go unwashed, and my home is a mess. I feel the mess wearing away at me, but just can't deal with it. I'm not overly busy or tired, just procrastinating. After 5 minutes on the rower my mood drastically improved and I was much more productive than usual, and the effect lasted about 3 hours. I've had a few more sessions since then with similar effects. Also, it's a little spooky how often a subject comes on my radar, and then a few days later the subject surfaces on HN. Feels too frequent for it to be a coincidence.

kortex 3y ago
Exercise definitely helps my symptoms, but it's an absolute roll of the dice whether it's immediate and significant, or just tires me out. Really I need to keep up with a few times a week for at least a month to reap the benefits.

sn9 3y ago

> The most important part (in what the kids today would call "my lived experience") is to push yourself hard, sweat a lot, and do it at least 3 or 4 times a week. I wouldn't even say you need to push yourself hard. Getting yourself into 120-150 bpm for 30-60 minutes 3x per week will get you most of the benefits.

kortex 3y ago

> Buy a treadmill Have one. Plus chin up bar, and there's always bodyweight. > and jog on it for 20 minutes when you wake up. That's a routine. > Whenever you remember to do it. That's more akin to how my brain functions. But "when I remember" (/ have energy/motivation) is a huuge variable I struggle with. I understand you mean well but this is a thing I've struggled with for years. It tends to be boom or bust. I can go months with going to the gym regularly and it helps, then things get chaotic and it all falls apart, and it's exceptionally hard to restart, probably because of exactly such an executive deficit such exercise would help with.