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> People with wives should tie their own happiness to their wife's, shouldn't they? I think it's more that the expectation that husbands exist to serve their

> People with wives should tie their own happiness to their wife's, shouldn't they? I think it's more that the expectation that husbands exist to serve their wives is harmful. Be honest, do you really think a phrase meaning "keeping your husband happy and satisfied would make your life better" is not harmful?

philwelch 3y ago
> Be honest, do you really think a phrase meaning "keeping your husband happy and satisfied would make your life better" is not harmful? No, why would it be harmful? The whole point of loving someone is caring about them and wanting them to be happy.
JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> it's more that the expectation that husbands exist to serve their wives We have no precedent for this in modern times. Instead, diamond coöpted the dowry’s role in assuring a bride’s family stability in a world that diminished women. > do you really think a phrase meaning "keeping your husband happy and satisfied would make your life better" is not harmful? No. Making my friends, colleagues, co-workers and life partner happy makes me happy. If it doesn’t, they shouldn’t be in my life, or I need to adjust my relationship to civilisation. With complete honesty, the best money I have spent has been experiences with close friends.
klyrs 3y ago
The happiest relationships result from both partners putting the other first. This forum is predominantly men. As a woman, I see variations on that "keep the hubby happy" phrase all over womens' spaces. So yeah. Some equality here is a little refreshing.
- oezi 3y ago
  I would strongly object that both putting the other person first is a surefire way for happiness. Putting the other person first at your own detriment can easily lead to destruction.
  - klyrs 3y ago
    Key point, the effort must be mutual. Putting your partner first at your detriment should be an intolerable proposition to your partner. In all things, moderation.
- svnt 3y ago
  I am getting tired of this default perspective that “it’s about time men got around to this.” Anecdotally I’ve never read or heard the male term IRL so I decided to check the phrases on Google trends. Direct comparison of both full phrases shows that “keep the hubby happy” essentially doesn’t exist: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=keep%20the%20hubby%20happy,happy%20wife%20happy%20life&hl=en-US https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=k...
  - klyrs 3y ago
    Funny that you cherrypick a single phrase that I actually made up, because I was generalizing, and use its unpopularity to insinuate that sexism never existed. https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=happy%20husband,happy%20wife&hl=en-US https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=h... Above I'm comparing "happy husband" to "happy wife" because it includes searches for the phrase "happy wife happy life" and I don't know of a similar rhyming phrase involving husband and I want the comparison to be apples-to-apples.
    - svnt 3y ago
      I didn’t insinuate anything about sexism never existing. I also didn’t cherry-pick anything, I used the exact phrase you said you’d heard all over women’s spaces. The data you show are based on broad terms that would be difficult to ascribe to any causes or uses as they could just as likely be a reflection of men’s increasingly poor mental health — “why isn’t my husband happy” or the increase in relative participation of wives in Google searches. Sexism is rampant. I had just hoped the incoming matriarchy would be more compassionate than the previous patriarchy. It isn’t looking good so far.
em-bee 3y ago
it's both actually. it is each partners responsibility to make the other happy. so thinking that it is not your responsibility to make your partner happy is the harmful part.
jonkho 3y ago
The reality is the person with lower leverage in the relationship does the keeping of the one with higher leverage happy. In marriages men have the lower leverage due to various reasons. One of which is favorable treatment of women in the family courts.
- peddling-brink 3y ago
  If your wife is using that as leverage over you, your marriage is already done for.
  - jonkho 3y ago
    At 50% rate, it’s not a tail risk! Not to mention the men that “stay in it. Cuz cheaper to keep her”!
- c0pium 3y ago
  If you’re thinking about marriage in terms of leverage you’ve guaranteed you’re going to find out about those courts.
  - zlg_codes 3y ago
    Given that marriage is a business decision, it's absolutely important to be aware of the positions you could possibly end up in, and which situations each of you has society's favor in should a conflict arise. (hint: men are disfavored in family court by default) It's not always happier ever after. We should not normalize people making rash decisions and chaining themselves to someone to fulfill cultural fantasies about romance. Don't marry someone you're not willing to walk to the grave with.
  - lelanthran 3y ago
    > If you’re thinking about marriage in terms of leverage you’ve guaranteed you’re going to find out about those courts. The reality is that in every relationship (whether marriage, business, friend, sibling, whatever) one person will have more leverage than the other. That's not the problem. The problem is when the party with the leverage uses it! The phrase "happy wife, happy life" is problematic because it normalises the usage of this leverage. (And if you think women have all the leverage in the average relationship, just wait till you get to over 45 and the kids are all old enough).
Exoristos 3y ago
"Be honest, do you really think a phrase meaning 'keeping your husband happy and satisfied would make your life better' is not harmful?" It's one of the oldest and best pieces of relationship advice in human history. What the heck is wrong with it?
Zpalmtree 3y ago
what the heck is harmful about that?

philwelch 3y ago

> Be honest, do you really think a phrase meaning "keeping your husband happy and satisfied would make your life better" is not harmful? No, why would it be harmful? The whole point of loving someone is caring about them and wanting them to be happy.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago

> it's more that the expectation that husbands exist to serve their wives We have no precedent for this in modern times. Instead, diamond coöpted the dowry’s role in assuring a bride’s family stability in a world that diminished women. > do you really think a phrase meaning "keeping your husband happy and satisfied would make your life better" is not harmful? No. Making my friends, colleagues, co-workers and life partner happy makes me happy. If it doesn’t, they shouldn’t be in my life, or I need to adjust my relationship to civilisation. With complete honesty, the best money I have spent has been experiences with close friends.

klyrs 3y ago

The happiest relationships result from both partners putting the other first. This forum is predominantly men. As a woman, I see variations on that "keep the hubby happy" phrase all over womens' spaces. So yeah. Some equality here is a little refreshing.

oezi 3y ago
I would strongly object that both putting the other person first is a surefire way for happiness. Putting the other person first at your own detriment can easily lead to destruction.
- klyrs 3y ago
  Key point, the effort must be mutual. Putting your partner first at your detriment should be an intolerable proposition to your partner. In all things, moderation.
svnt 3y ago
I am getting tired of this default perspective that “it’s about time men got around to this.” Anecdotally I’ve never read or heard the male term IRL so I decided to check the phrases on Google trends. Direct comparison of both full phrases shows that “keep the hubby happy” essentially doesn’t exist: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=keep%20the%20hubby%20happy,happy%20wife%20happy%20life&hl=en-US https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=k...
- klyrs 3y ago
  Funny that you cherrypick a single phrase that I actually made up, because I was generalizing, and use its unpopularity to insinuate that sexism never existed. https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=happy%20husband,happy%20wife&hl=en-US https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=h... Above I'm comparing "happy husband" to "happy wife" because it includes searches for the phrase "happy wife happy life" and I don't know of a similar rhyming phrase involving husband and I want the comparison to be apples-to-apples.
  - svnt 3y ago
    I didn’t insinuate anything about sexism never existing. I also didn’t cherry-pick anything, I used the exact phrase you said you’d heard all over women’s spaces. The data you show are based on broad terms that would be difficult to ascribe to any causes or uses as they could just as likely be a reflection of men’s increasingly poor mental health — “why isn’t my husband happy” or the increase in relative participation of wives in Google searches. Sexism is rampant. I had just hoped the incoming matriarchy would be more compassionate than the previous patriarchy. It isn’t looking good so far.

em-bee 3y ago

it's both actually. it is each partners responsibility to make the other happy. so thinking that it is not your responsibility to make your partner happy is the harmful part.

jonkho 3y ago

The reality is the person with lower leverage in the relationship does the keeping of the one with higher leverage happy. In marriages men have the lower leverage due to various reasons. One of which is favorable treatment of women in the family courts.

peddling-brink 3y ago
If your wife is using that as leverage over you, your marriage is already done for.
- jonkho 3y ago
  At 50% rate, it’s not a tail risk! Not to mention the men that “stay in it. Cuz cheaper to keep her”!
c0pium 3y ago
If you’re thinking about marriage in terms of leverage you’ve guaranteed you’re going to find out about those courts.
- zlg_codes 3y ago
  Given that marriage is a business decision, it's absolutely important to be aware of the positions you could possibly end up in, and which situations each of you has society's favor in should a conflict arise. (hint: men are disfavored in family court by default) It's not always happier ever after. We should not normalize people making rash decisions and chaining themselves to someone to fulfill cultural fantasies about romance. Don't marry someone you're not willing to walk to the grave with.
- lelanthran 3y ago
  > If you’re thinking about marriage in terms of leverage you’ve guaranteed you’re going to find out about those courts. The reality is that in every relationship (whether marriage, business, friend, sibling, whatever) one person will have more leverage than the other. That's not the problem. The problem is when the party with the leverage uses it! The phrase "happy wife, happy life" is problematic because it normalises the usage of this leverage. (And if you think women have all the leverage in the average relationship, just wait till you get to over 45 and the kids are all old enough).

Exoristos 3y ago

"Be honest, do you really think a phrase meaning 'keeping your husband happy and satisfied would make your life better' is not harmful?" It's one of the oldest and best pieces of relationship advice in human history. What the heck is wrong with it?

Zpalmtree 3y ago

what the heck is harmful about that?