5 ms·

Cover 1-2% of the Earth's surface with solar panels and you have so much spare energy that you can do all kinds of crazy stuff, like sucking carbon dioxide out

Cover 1-2% of the Earth's surface with solar panels and you have so much spare energy that you can do all kinds of crazy stuff, like sucking carbon dioxide out of the air and turning it to diamonds for fun.

ahoka 3y ago
Whatever you we use that energy on will probably create heat though.
troyvit 3y ago
Seriously. 1-2% of Earth's surface is a _lot_ of surface.
- tromp 3y ago
  Indeed; at 9.2 trillion m^2, the Sahara desert sits right in that range at 1.8% of Earth's 510 trillion m^2.
- euroderf 3y ago
  Cover that much of the Earth and you've got a good start on making a Trantor.
  - tomcam 3y ago
    Deep cut
- morsch 3y ago
  As a term of comparison, here's a back of the envelope calculation estimating that 0.18% of the surface is covered by roads and parking areas. https://www.reddit.com/r/theydidthemath/comments/zwni88/request_how_much_of_earths_surface_area_is/ https://www.reddit.com/r/theydidthemath/comments/zwni88/requ... Approximately 1% is covered by any kind of construction: https://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-Earths-land-is-used-for-infrastructure-like-roads-buildings-all-pavement-etc https://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-Earths-land-is-used... Almost 15% of land area (not total surface) has been "modified" by humans: https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/10/human-impact-earth-planet-change-development/ https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/10/human-impact-earth-pl... This includes agriculture, mining and, somehow, pollution.
Qwertious 3y ago
Solar panels are limited by cost. If this cooling ceramic is a better version of the barium sulfate thing (i.e. just an extremely cheap-to-produce material that's very white) then this is viable because it doesn't cost hundreds of dollars per square metre to manufacture. Its main limitation would likely be construction costs, which is a problem solar panels are already starting to run into. Although construction of solar requires setting up cables and not e.g. accidentally snapping hundred-dollar solar panels in half (which would be a non-issue for barium sulfate, since it's dirt-cheap and basically just white paint anyway).
- guerby 3y ago
  "hundreds of dollars per square meter" not true anymore. https://allo.solar/panneau-solaire-410w-noir-mono-p-type-tw-solar.html https://allo.solar/panneau-solaire-410w-noir-mono-p-type-tw-... 104.08 EUR tax (20%) included for 410Wp gives 0.254 EUR/Wp 1722 x 1134 x 30 mm = 1.92 square meter gives 53.38 EUR/m2. Some wooden floor are more expensive than PV per square meter. People forget that PV, battey, wind costs are still decreasing.
  - esperent 3y ago
    A quick calculation on Wolfram Alpha: to cover 2% of the world's surface at 50EUR/m2 would cost roughly 540 trillion euros, or 5.5 years of current world GDP.
    - marcosdumay 3y ago
      Quoting the GP: > People forget that PV, battey, wind costs are still decreasing. Some insist on forgetting it. And the decrease has been exponential, with no reason to believe it will stop at the next order of magnitude. Anyway, covering 2% of the world with anything is a huge undertaking.
    - guerby 3y ago
      If I'm not mistaken 510 millions square kilometer earth surface, 2% of that 10 millions square kilometer, at 200 Wp/m2 gives 2 PW peak. Current peak electricity production capacity is about 7.5 TW according to: https://www.statista.com/statistics/267358/world-installed-power-capacity/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/267358/world-installed-p...
mrshadowgoose 3y ago
Yup. We have more than enough harnessable solar power to allow every single person a clean energy budget higher than a typical American, offset all other industrial carbon production, and start to unwind the last century of humanity's carbon impact. But instead of working towards that end-state, a lot of people (even people on this site) seem to be more interested in shaming others into using less energy, and attacking others for "immoral" uses of energy.
- peterashford 3y ago
  Using less energy makes perfect sense until we achieve this desirable future state of abundant excess energy. That state is not right now, however.
  - mrshadowgoose 3y ago
    Nope, because all the carbon production until that point can be unwound. The shitty uncomfortable life that the "use less" camp wants me to live, cannot.
    - benj111 3y ago
      But currently we aren't on a course to actually unwind that carbon production in time. It's like saying there's an oasis 2 days walk from here, so don't worry about having a shower and possibly using all your drinkable water. You still need to save enough water to actually get to the oasis, and at the moment, we're kinda sorta having a conversation about whose job it is to actually make the trek, so in reality it's going to be at least another day before everyone decides that they need to start marching, and as we only currently have 2.5 days of drinking water. That shower is really irresponsible.
    - pjc50 3y ago
      "can be" is very far from "is going to be" and even further from "is going to be paid for". Also, we have a lot of solar energy .. during the day. The storage/transmission problem is solvable but not solved.
    - 3y ago

ahoka 3y ago

Whatever you we use that energy on will probably create heat though.

troyvit 3y ago

Seriously. 1-2% of Earth's surface is a _lot_ of surface.

tromp 3y ago
Indeed; at 9.2 trillion m^2, the Sahara desert sits right in that range at 1.8% of Earth's 510 trillion m^2.
euroderf 3y ago
Cover that much of the Earth and you've got a good start on making a Trantor.
- tomcam 3y ago
  Deep cut
morsch 3y ago
As a term of comparison, here's a back of the envelope calculation estimating that 0.18% of the surface is covered by roads and parking areas. https://www.reddit.com/r/theydidthemath/comments/zwni88/request_how_much_of_earths_surface_area_is/ https://www.reddit.com/r/theydidthemath/comments/zwni88/requ... Approximately 1% is covered by any kind of construction: https://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-Earths-land-is-used-for-infrastructure-like-roads-buildings-all-pavement-etc https://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-Earths-land-is-used... Almost 15% of land area (not total surface) has been "modified" by humans: https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/10/human-impact-earth-planet-change-development/ https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2021/10/human-impact-earth-pl... This includes agriculture, mining and, somehow, pollution.

Qwertious 3y ago

Solar panels are limited by cost. If this cooling ceramic is a better version of the barium sulfate thing (i.e. just an extremely cheap-to-produce material that's very white) then this is viable because it doesn't cost hundreds of dollars per square metre to manufacture. Its main limitation would likely be construction costs, which is a problem solar panels are already starting to run into. Although construction of solar requires setting up cables and not e.g. accidentally snapping hundred-dollar solar panels in half (which would be a non-issue for barium sulfate, since it's dirt-cheap and basically just white paint anyway).

guerby 3y ago
"hundreds of dollars per square meter" not true anymore. https://allo.solar/panneau-solaire-410w-noir-mono-p-type-tw-solar.html https://allo.solar/panneau-solaire-410w-noir-mono-p-type-tw-... 104.08 EUR tax (20%) included for 410Wp gives 0.254 EUR/Wp 1722 x 1134 x 30 mm = 1.92 square meter gives 53.38 EUR/m2. Some wooden floor are more expensive than PV per square meter. People forget that PV, battey, wind costs are still decreasing.
- esperent 3y ago
  A quick calculation on Wolfram Alpha: to cover 2% of the world's surface at 50EUR/m2 would cost roughly 540 trillion euros, or 5.5 years of current world GDP.
  - marcosdumay 3y ago
    Quoting the GP: > People forget that PV, battey, wind costs are still decreasing. Some insist on forgetting it. And the decrease has been exponential, with no reason to believe it will stop at the next order of magnitude. Anyway, covering 2% of the world with anything is a huge undertaking.
  - guerby 3y ago
    If I'm not mistaken 510 millions square kilometer earth surface, 2% of that 10 millions square kilometer, at 200 Wp/m2 gives 2 PW peak. Current peak electricity production capacity is about 7.5 TW according to: https://www.statista.com/statistics/267358/world-installed-power-capacity/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/267358/world-installed-p...

mrshadowgoose 3y ago

Yup. We have more than enough harnessable solar power to allow every single person a clean energy budget higher than a typical American, offset all other industrial carbon production, and start to unwind the last century of humanity's carbon impact. But instead of working towards that end-state, a lot of people (even people on this site) seem to be more interested in shaming others into using less energy, and attacking others for "immoral" uses of energy.

peterashford 3y ago
Using less energy makes perfect sense until we achieve this desirable future state of abundant excess energy. That state is not right now, however.
- mrshadowgoose 3y ago
  Nope, because all the carbon production until that point can be unwound. The shitty uncomfortable life that the "use less" camp wants me to live, cannot.
  - benj111 3y ago
    But currently we aren't on a course to actually unwind that carbon production in time. It's like saying there's an oasis 2 days walk from here, so don't worry about having a shower and possibly using all your drinkable water. You still need to save enough water to actually get to the oasis, and at the moment, we're kinda sorta having a conversation about whose job it is to actually make the trek, so in reality it's going to be at least another day before everyone decides that they need to start marching, and as we only currently have 2.5 days of drinking water. That shower is really irresponsible.
  - pjc50 3y ago
    "can be" is very far from "is going to be" and even further from "is going to be paid for". Also, we have a lot of solar energy .. during the day. The storage/transmission problem is solvable but not solved.
  - 3y ago