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Rare earth refining traditionally generates a lot of toxic waste of various sorts. This could likely be mitigated but it would raise the cost of the finished p

Rare earth refining traditionally generates a lot of toxic waste of various sorts. This could likely be mitigated but it would raise the cost of the finished product well above current market norms, so unless universal standards were applied, it would become unprofitable relative to China. There's a good overview of the difficulties involved (and some alternative approaches and replacement materials) here: https://news.climate.columbia.edu/2023/04/05/the-energy-transition-will-need-more-rare-earth-elements-can-we-secure-them-sustainably/ https://news.climate.columbia.edu/2023/04/05/the-energy-tran...

gustavus 3y ago
I don't think competing with China will be a major concern domestically in the US in a few years as I anticipate a renewal and resurgence of the trade war.
chii 3y ago
> well above current market norms which just indicates that the cost is externalized, and the current market price is too low. But it would take international cooperation to force such externalized costs back into the supply chain, and no gov't wants to do if not doing so is advantageous geopolitically and economically.
jeff_carr 3y ago
> Rare earth refining traditionally generates a lot of toxic waste of various sorts. Could someone explain why? It certainly seems obviously easier than radioactive waste. All that has to happen is a stable solid. Why are there liquids?
- defrost 3y ago
  > All that has to happen is a stable solid. What does that mean? Rare earths are "rare" for two reasons - they are spread about and don't appear in high concentrartions - at least one is "as common" in the crust as copper but it doesn't form in massive lumps of "quite a lot together" in the manner of copper (which forms in several types of clumps, eg [1]). The other reason they are rare is that they are mostly geochemically bound to other things in the way that silver and gold are not - a strong chemically reaction is required to free them and make them appear - that's a lot of wetwork with acids | reactive gases | etc [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porphyry_copper_deposit https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porphyry_copper_deposit [2] https://www.britannica.com/science/rare-earth-element/Processing-ores https://www.britannica.com/science/rare-earth-element/Proces... Additionally (each ~ an hour) The Chemistry and Geology of the Clay Rare Earths: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFwrg4wWsm4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFwrg4wWsm4 Options for the separation of Rare Earth Elements: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMbsOjj_hls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMbsOjj_hls (or search and find a lecture | paper of your preference)

gustavus 3y ago

I don't think competing with China will be a major concern domestically in the US in a few years as I anticipate a renewal and resurgence of the trade war.

chii 3y ago

> well above current market norms which just indicates that the cost is externalized, and the current market price is too low. But it would take international cooperation to force such externalized costs back into the supply chain, and no gov't wants to do if not doing so is advantageous geopolitically and economically.

jeff_carr 3y ago

> Rare earth refining traditionally generates a lot of toxic waste of various sorts. Could someone explain why? It certainly seems obviously easier than radioactive waste. All that has to happen is a stable solid. Why are there liquids?

defrost 3y ago
> All that has to happen is a stable solid. What does that mean? Rare earths are "rare" for two reasons - they are spread about and don't appear in high concentrartions - at least one is "as common" in the crust as copper but it doesn't form in massive lumps of "quite a lot together" in the manner of copper (which forms in several types of clumps, eg [1]). The other reason they are rare is that they are mostly geochemically bound to other things in the way that silver and gold are not - a strong chemically reaction is required to free them and make them appear - that's a lot of wetwork with acids | reactive gases | etc [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porphyry_copper_deposit https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porphyry_copper_deposit [2] https://www.britannica.com/science/rare-earth-element/Processing-ores https://www.britannica.com/science/rare-earth-element/Proces... Additionally (each ~ an hour) The Chemistry and Geology of the Clay Rare Earths: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFwrg4wWsm4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFwrg4wWsm4 Options for the separation of Rare Earth Elements: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMbsOjj_hls https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMbsOjj_hls (or search and find a lecture | paper of your preference)