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You said they were wrong about getting a larger slice of the pie. Do you have any sources for this? Interested in learning more.

ceejayoz 3y ago
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/09/business/media/disney-earnings.html https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/09/business/media/disney-ear... > Disney’s streaming operation lost $512 million in the most-recent quarter, the company said, bringing total streaming losses since 2019, when Disney+ was introduced, to more than $11 billion. Disney+ lost roughly 11.7 million subscribers worldwide in the three months that ended July 1, for a new total of 146.1 million. It seems unlikely they were losing money on the Netflix licensing deals.
- i_am_jl 3y ago
  I'm intensely curious about how Disney has lost $7.5 million per day running Disney+. Could that be a real number? Surely there have to be accounting shenanigans at play... right? I mean, if they're really losing half of a billion dollars per quarter, they'd need to do something like doubling their subscriber count to even approach breaking even. Is that really the case?
- ethbr1 3y ago
  That's including platform capex against ARR though...
- jerf 3y ago
  Yes, this is the sort of thing I'm referring to. It looks like maybe WB is doing OK: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/warner-bros-discovery-revenues-1235640322/ https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/war... But in general, Netflix was in a broad Silicon Valley sense profitable at the time (in that I don't recall and I'm not going to dig it out, but if they weren't profitable, they were in a growth mode and definitely pulling in revenue and choosing debt-for-growth, which isn't really the exact same thing as straight-up losing money), and the competition is losing billions at a time. That's not a "larger slice of the pie". Maybe they'll make up for it later, but at the moment I wouldn't bet on all of them managing it. I actually think the recent Hollywood strikes were darkly funny; the writers were striking because they want a bigger slice of what they perceive to be that sweet, sweet streaming money, whereas almost all of the news about the actual streaming services is them losing billions. When the real numbers come out we'll probably hear accusations of more Hollywood accounting, and while there will be some truth to that (inevitably), Hollywood is already reporting huge streaming losses when it is actually against their interests to do so.
onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
Afaik, Disney+ is somehow still not profitable: https://www.wired.com/story/disney-plus-streaming-profitability-hulu/ https://www.wired.com/story/disney-plus-streaming-profitabil... Though, I suspect this is Hollywood accounting so that they can avoid paying royalties.
- jerf 3y ago
  At the moment, it is against Disney's interests to admit to losing that much on streaming. The primary effect it has is to tank their stock price. Once they have to pay out more people based on streaming success, their incentives become more mixed. But at the moment, if anything I'd say their motivation would be to minimize their streaming losses.
geodel 3y ago
See how Disney and other pulled their content away from Netflix. Considering Netflix as existential threat to them, they thought its better to have their own streaming service. And now Disney of all is pulling their content away from their Disney+ because.. wait for it... it is too expensive to put their own content there. Whereas with Netflix they could have gotten nice stack of money which they forgo dreaming about their own service ruling streaming.

ceejayoz 3y ago

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/09/business/media/disney-earnings.html https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/09/business/media/disney-ear... > Disney’s streaming operation lost $512 million in the most-recent quarter, the company said, bringing total streaming losses since 2019, when Disney+ was introduced, to more than $11 billion. Disney+ lost roughly 11.7 million subscribers worldwide in the three months that ended July 1, for a new total of 146.1 million. It seems unlikely they were losing money on the Netflix licensing deals.

i_am_jl 3y ago
I'm intensely curious about how Disney has lost $7.5 million per day running Disney+. Could that be a real number? Surely there have to be accounting shenanigans at play... right? I mean, if they're really losing half of a billion dollars per quarter, they'd need to do something like doubling their subscriber count to even approach breaking even. Is that really the case?
ethbr1 3y ago
That's including platform capex against ARR though...
jerf 3y ago
Yes, this is the sort of thing I'm referring to. It looks like maybe WB is doing OK: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/warner-bros-discovery-revenues-1235640322/ https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/war... But in general, Netflix was in a broad Silicon Valley sense profitable at the time (in that I don't recall and I'm not going to dig it out, but if they weren't profitable, they were in a growth mode and definitely pulling in revenue and choosing debt-for-growth, which isn't really the exact same thing as straight-up losing money), and the competition is losing billions at a time. That's not a "larger slice of the pie". Maybe they'll make up for it later, but at the moment I wouldn't bet on all of them managing it. I actually think the recent Hollywood strikes were darkly funny; the writers were striking because they want a bigger slice of what they perceive to be that sweet, sweet streaming money, whereas almost all of the news about the actual streaming services is them losing billions. When the real numbers come out we'll probably hear accusations of more Hollywood accounting, and while there will be some truth to that (inevitably), Hollywood is already reporting huge streaming losses when it is actually against their interests to do so.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago

Afaik, Disney+ is somehow still not profitable: https://www.wired.com/story/disney-plus-streaming-profitability-hulu/ https://www.wired.com/story/disney-plus-streaming-profitabil... Though, I suspect this is Hollywood accounting so that they can avoid paying royalties.

jerf 3y ago
At the moment, it is against Disney's interests to admit to losing that much on streaming. The primary effect it has is to tank their stock price. Once they have to pay out more people based on streaming success, their incentives become more mixed. But at the moment, if anything I'd say their motivation would be to minimize their streaming losses.

geodel 3y ago

See how Disney and other pulled their content away from Netflix. Considering Netflix as existential threat to them, they thought its better to have their own streaming service. And now Disney of all is pulling their content away from their Disney+ because.. wait for it... it is too expensive to put their own content there. Whereas with Netflix they could have gotten nice stack of money which they forgo dreaming about their own service ruling streaming.