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It's amazing that the move of RISC-V Foundation to Switzerland (as RISC-V International) was actually called for. Even more amazing is US lawmakers continuing

It's amazing that the move of RISC-V Foundation to Switzerland (as RISC-V International) was actually called for. Even more amazing is US lawmakers continuing to try & shoot the US in the foot. RISC-V is now globally developed, that ship has sailed. Same for products based on it. The US can't prevent its 'proliferation'. Only reduce the degree to which US entities are part of, and profit from that. Are US lawmakers that dumb? (ok I guess that's a rhetorical question).

andrewflnr 3y ago
The practical question is, do US lawmakers believe their voters are that dumb? (Mostly yes)
- dmvdoug 3y ago
  Nah, they really are this uninformed for the most part (there are notable exceptions of course). Story time! I went to law school in DC. One of my classmates worked as a staffer in the office of a prominent (leadership-level) congressperson (she was from his district). She had also done an internship with the UN. This congressperson had made public statements about defunding the UN and blah blah blah. He took her out to lunch one day and asked her to explain what the UN was and how it worked in the 30 minutes they had so he could field questions he was getting about his public statements.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- bluGill 3y ago
  You don't have to fall back to that. It isn't possible to know all the issues facing national attention. Someone puts in a good/scary story about something and it is really hard to see why that story is wrong. Often the story isn't even wrong, it is just not the complete picture and the evils of what the story misses out on are even worse. There are a bit over 500 people with power in DC, they cannot possibly debate all the possible issues that come up. China learning from US contributions to Risc-v are not a good thing. However the obvious proposed solution wouldn't stop China from learning (it might delay them a few months, but they have plenty of smart engineers who can figure this out), and so will harm the US more.
- FpUser 3y ago
  1) - US lawmakers believe 2) - Mostly yes 3) - both Which one of 3?
- yieldcrv 3y ago
  The US has no direct referendums at the national level so it doesnt matter what voters think in the near term, or long term for that matter
deleted 3y ago
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DangitBobby 3y ago
US lawmakers are just a mouthpiece for whoever is paying them.
- beebmam 3y ago
  I think this discounts the genuine political opinions that many elected officials in the US government have, especially about the new cold war with China. It's worth noting that China spends more money lobbying the US government than any other country on earth: https://www.opensecrets.org/fara/countries https://www.opensecrets.org/fara/countries
  - DangitBobby 3y ago
    My trust in US lawmakers practically no longer exists. Now whenever they make a questionable decision, the first thing I try to understand is who stands to make money off of it. If lawmakers have genuine policy opinions that's wonderful, but they have a big PR problem from decades of corruption to address.
lolinder 3y ago
> Are US lawmakers that dumb? I posted the numbers as a top level comment here [0], but the short version is that a lot of the signatories of this letter received (small) donations from Intel in the last election cycle. My best guess is that Intel is actively lobbying against RISC-V using China as the boogeyman, and that these lawmakers were persuaded (sincerely or otherwise) to treat RISC-V as a threat. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38166311 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38166311
- addicted 3y ago
  I think the donations part of it isn’t even that important. If you think about how legislation does (and can) work, lawmakers, even if they were the most gifted people on the planet, obviously are not experts on everything. As a result they have to rely on others. But who should those others be? When it comes to something like chip manufacturing, you’re down to essentially 1 major U.S. company in this area that can provide guidance. One could argue they could go to academics, but a single academic is good for going deep into a specific area and not so good at cross concerns. And bringing together all those people is effort. On the other hand you have Intel that’s got scores of researchers, marketing experts, and lobbyists who are basically giving you high quality data and information for free. Even without money and therefore outright corruption playing any role, companies like these have an outsized influence on lawmakers for absolutely practical reasons.
  - lolinder 3y ago
    Yes, while political donations in general are a concern to me, I think in this case the donations themselves are fairly innocuous. What the donations tell me is not that Intel bribed these representatives, it's that Intel identified these representatives as ones that would be particularly pliable to their legal persuasion efforts. It's true that Intel has a lot of natural strengths for its lobbying efforts, but some representatives are going to be easier to persuade than others.
    - trimethylpurine 3y ago
      I think you'd be pressed to find a representative who didn't receive donations from Intel. Why would they gamble and guess on which ones will win next election or which ones will help them push their agenda?
darklycan51 3y ago
It's so beyond dumb that they think this in any way is related to national security, this has the potential very literally create some huge troubles for the US in the future...
deleted 3y ago
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andrewflnr 3y ago

The practical question is, do US lawmakers believe their voters are that dumb? (Mostly yes)

dmvdoug 3y ago
Nah, they really are this uninformed for the most part (there are notable exceptions of course). Story time! I went to law school in DC. One of my classmates worked as a staffer in the office of a prominent (leadership-level) congressperson (she was from his district). She had also done an internship with the UN. This congressperson had made public statements about defunding the UN and blah blah blah. He took her out to lunch one day and asked her to explain what the UN was and how it worked in the 30 minutes they had so he could field questions he was getting about his public statements.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
bluGill 3y ago
You don't have to fall back to that. It isn't possible to know all the issues facing national attention. Someone puts in a good/scary story about something and it is really hard to see why that story is wrong. Often the story isn't even wrong, it is just not the complete picture and the evils of what the story misses out on are even worse. There are a bit over 500 people with power in DC, they cannot possibly debate all the possible issues that come up. China learning from US contributions to Risc-v are not a good thing. However the obvious proposed solution wouldn't stop China from learning (it might delay them a few months, but they have plenty of smart engineers who can figure this out), and so will harm the US more.
FpUser 3y ago
1) - US lawmakers believe 2) - Mostly yes 3) - both Which one of 3?
yieldcrv 3y ago
The US has no direct referendums at the national level so it doesnt matter what voters think in the near term, or long term for that matter

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

DangitBobby 3y ago

US lawmakers are just a mouthpiece for whoever is paying them.

beebmam 3y ago
I think this discounts the genuine political opinions that many elected officials in the US government have, especially about the new cold war with China. It's worth noting that China spends more money lobbying the US government than any other country on earth: https://www.opensecrets.org/fara/countries https://www.opensecrets.org/fara/countries
- DangitBobby 3y ago
  My trust in US lawmakers practically no longer exists. Now whenever they make a questionable decision, the first thing I try to understand is who stands to make money off of it. If lawmakers have genuine policy opinions that's wonderful, but they have a big PR problem from decades of corruption to address.

lolinder 3y ago

> Are US lawmakers that dumb? I posted the numbers as a top level comment here [0], but the short version is that a lot of the signatories of this letter received (small) donations from Intel in the last election cycle. My best guess is that Intel is actively lobbying against RISC-V using China as the boogeyman, and that these lawmakers were persuaded (sincerely or otherwise) to treat RISC-V as a threat. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38166311 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38166311

addicted 3y ago
I think the donations part of it isn’t even that important. If you think about how legislation does (and can) work, lawmakers, even if they were the most gifted people on the planet, obviously are not experts on everything. As a result they have to rely on others. But who should those others be? When it comes to something like chip manufacturing, you’re down to essentially 1 major U.S. company in this area that can provide guidance. One could argue they could go to academics, but a single academic is good for going deep into a specific area and not so good at cross concerns. And bringing together all those people is effort. On the other hand you have Intel that’s got scores of researchers, marketing experts, and lobbyists who are basically giving you high quality data and information for free. Even without money and therefore outright corruption playing any role, companies like these have an outsized influence on lawmakers for absolutely practical reasons.
- lolinder 3y ago
  Yes, while political donations in general are a concern to me, I think in this case the donations themselves are fairly innocuous. What the donations tell me is not that Intel bribed these representatives, it's that Intel identified these representatives as ones that would be particularly pliable to their legal persuasion efforts. It's true that Intel has a lot of natural strengths for its lobbying efforts, but some representatives are going to be easier to persuade than others.
  - trimethylpurine 3y ago
    I think you'd be pressed to find a representative who didn't receive donations from Intel. Why would they gamble and guess on which ones will win next election or which ones will help them push their agenda?

darklycan51 3y ago

It's so beyond dumb that they think this in any way is related to national security, this has the potential very literally create some huge troubles for the US in the future...

deleted 3y ago

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