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Soda additive linked to thyroid toxicity may finally get banned by FDA
- ipnon 3y agoIt just seems insane to me to ingest any bromine molecule and not expect it to react or oxidize in some fashion eventually.
- CamperBob2 3y agoGot some bad news for you about chlorine.
- exmadscientist 3y agoHalogens that are already tightly bound will not suddenly unbind and go off causing trouble. This is why, in general, bromine is more trouble than chlorine is more trouble than fluorine: bromine can't bind as tightly to begin with, so it gets loose more easily. Fluorine is so reactive that elemental fluorine is just not a problem unless something has gone Truly Wrong. It can't be used as a chemical weapon in the same way chlorine can, for example.
- Scoundreller 3y agoI think the chlorine added to water will react with anything organic. Depends how much organic stuff (including the micro-organisms you're trying to inactivate in the first place) you have in the source water. At least some water systems are moving towards ozone treatment instead of chlorination.
- sokoloff 3y agoI assumed GP was referring to the high levels of chlorine humans add to our food and that we’re taught readily dissociate in water. Most households have a chlorine shaker on the table and many takeaway places offer packets of the stuff for free.
- jdjdjdhhd 3y agoThat's why I don't drink city water...
- keep_reading 3y agoI hope you don't drink bottled water... it's just tap water from some exploited municipality
- jdjdjdhhd 3y agoI have a well with reverse osmosis filtration system... I could do the same with city water but I would not call that city water
- keep_reading 3y agoRO is great, I wish I had that at home. I have a feeling we'll see larger scale RO systems being installed especially due to PFAS, etc. The Florida Keys muni water is all RO now, for example.
- narrator 3y agoSynthroid, synthetic thyroid horomone, is the 2nd most prescribed drug in the U.S [2]. Like all other drastically rising health problems in the United States, it happened all by itself, doctors are mystified, anyone with an explanation is criticized as an opportunist. [1] https://www.healthgrades.com/right-care/patient-advocate/the-top-50-drugs-prescribed-in-the-united-states https://www.healthgrades.com/right-care/patient-advocate/the...
- refurb 3y agoIt's been one of the most prescribed drugs for decades.
- bsder 3y agoIn what way is that an issue? Practically everything on that list is associated with diseases that become more prevalent with age. Hypothyroidism is no exception: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK279005/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK279005/ So, basically, because fewer people drop dead in their 50s due to heart disease or cancer, we see way more prescriptions for chronic, systemic diseases from later in life. There is a high probability that anyone taking one of those drugs on the list is probably taking multiple drugs on that list. I don't see a problem here. If you want to claim a chemical basis, you're going to need to prove a much stronger correlation in the younger age cohorts. Since different places banned this at different times, you should see hypothyroidism drop at different times. Has that happened?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- Llamamoe 3y agoThis is a really weak and dismissive explanation. The rates of chronic illness - especially if we include mental illness, have been steadily going up in all age cohorts.
- sokoloff 3y agoThat’s also what I’d expect to see in any successful and continually advancing system of biological understanding and medical treatment.
- demondemidi 3y agoCan't believe people still drink soda, or let their kids drink that shit.
- throwaway743950 3y ago[flagged]
- beretguy 3y agoWhich drinks have dhmo?
- throwaway743950 3y agoThe majority. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dihydrogen_monoxide_parody https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dihydrogen_monoxide_parody Jokes aside, soda is typically loaded with sugar, but diet sodas don't seem as bad.
- swader999 3y agoAspartame though.
- PeterHolzwarth 3y agoAspartame is profoundly safe and there is no mechanism through which it could be unsafe in the human body.
- RadixDLT 3y agostevia is the safest
- PeterHolzwarth 3y agoWhere has that been demonstrated? Aspartame is one of the most ridiculously well-studied food additives known to humankind.
- pkaye 3y agoI believe the major brands like Coke and Pepsi have already removed it. Mostly some smaller brands remaining. There is already an alternate emulsifier called glycerol ester of wood rosin.
- lazide 3y agoLooking forward to the articles on that in 20 years. Wood rosin comes from turpentine. [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosin#Production https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosin#Production] I’m frankly a bit shocked it’s considered food safe.
- dzdt 3y agoThe crazy thing about the process is even when there is a strong suspicion the chemical is NOT safe companies still were allowed to sell products with it for decades, until it was PROVEN to be not safe. One can imagine a system where it was required to prove safety before use instead of the other way round, but that is not what we have.
- RajT88 3y agoGRAS certification offers some clues on how this happened. https://www.fda.gov/food/food-ingredients-packaging/generally-recognized-safe-gras https://www.fda.gov/food/food-ingredients-packaging/generall...
- brutusborn 3y agoApologies for being pedantic, but you can’t prove safety in the same way that you can’t prove any hypothesis. I agree that new chemicals should undergo better safety screenings, but we must be honest with ourselves: a screening does not “prove” something is safe, it merely reduces the uncertainty that it is safe. As such, we must balance the costs and benefits of such testing regimes.
- colordrops 3y agoI'm reading the GP as not meaning "prove" as in a mathematical proof with absolute certainty, but rather that a rigorous process is followed to allow a new chemical in food, similar to vaccines and medicine.
- nickserv 3y agoYes, but how rigorous? Some chemicals are only toxic when combined with others. Some may require years or even decades of exposure to show signs of toxicity. Some only affect a percentage of the population. Etc etc. The reality is that it's basically impossible to prove absolute safety. Perhaps it's better to assume there is always a risk, and to only a chemical if there is a really important reason for it, even if tested. So something like non-stick pans would be out.
- canucker2016 3y agoOver ten year fight is almost over - at least in the USA. Pepsico was the first to remove BVO from their Gatorade beverages. see https://www.today.com/health/teen-wins-battle-against-gatorade-bvo-ingredient-1B8180751 https://www.today.com/health/teen-wins-battle-against-gatora... from 2012 Dec. 18, Toronto Star, https://www.thestar.com/news/world/brominated-vegetable-oil-pepsico-and-coca-cola-not-removing-chemical-from-canadian-drinks/article_45ef7237-5cf6-53d3-9b86-087aab4e8249.html https://www.thestar.com/news/world/brominated-vegetable-oil-...: "Brominated vegetable oil: PepsiCo and Coca-Cola not removing chemical from Canadian drinks Major soft drink-makers and Health Canada say the use of brominated vegetable oil in Canadian beverages is safe, despite a growing movement elsewhere to ban its use. ..."
- toasted-subs 3y agonice!
- nielsbot 3y agothe additive is brominated vegetable oil (or BVO) can we change the headline to be less clickbait?
- bdcravens 3y agoI don't see how "brominated vegetable oil linked to thyroid toxicity may finally get banned by FDA" is much different than "Soda additive linked to thyroid toxicity may finally get banned by FDA"; the original title seems to provide more context. Surely you're not saying the "linked to thyroid toxicity" is clickbait, as that's reflected by 50 years of science.
- adhesive_wombat 3y agoIt's classic clickbait because it makes you click to find out what the one weird trick, sorry, one common toxin added to food is.
- ce4 3y agoExactly. I just came here to confirm my suspicion (already thought about the toxin being BVO)
- supertimor 3y agoExcept most people wouldn’t really know what BVO is (or what it is used for), so soda additive is actually informative here.
- adhesive_wombat 3y agoThen they can literally write "Soda additive BVO linked..." and the headline has the same meaning. Everyone who knows what BVO is can decide for themselves if they're interested, everyone who didn't can still click to find out what this mysterious "BVO" is. There room for 3 characters and a space in that headline. The only reason not to do that is to get clicks from people who wouldn't click if they knew what the article was actually about. It's clickbait. Doubly so because it's not like BVO is the only dodgy chemical in soft drinks. Aspartame even is suspected of being related to thyroid wierdness.
- willywanker 3y agoBeen banned in India since 1990.
- streaming 3y agoMost people are deficient in iodine. We don't eat a lot of iodine rich foods, and commercial farming techniques have depleted soils of many minerals and elements. Tissues in the body that should be absorbing and storing iodine, which is an essential element for thyroid hormone, will preferentially store bromine. Bromine has also been used to make flame retardant fabrics, carpet, furniture, etc. Avoid it.
- galangalalgol 3y agoI have read that for the same reasons we preferentially uptake flourine from toothpaste and water. It does prevent cavities though.
- streaming 3y agoTrue. Fluoridated water does more harm than good.
- TheCleric 3y ago> Bromine has also been used to make flame retardant fabrics, carpet, furniture, etc. While this argument feels right, chemically it makes no sense. You can do this with any element. It’s the same as saying you shouldn’t drink water because it has hydrogen and oxygen which are used as rocket fuel.
- streaming 3y agoNo, it's not the same. Molecules act very differently than the individual elements that make the molecule. Water does not behave similarly to hydrogen or oxygen, and humans aren't plants, which can break water into component elements. What happens to the bromine when humans ingest brominated vegetable oil? Something very different than what happens when we ingest water, which always stays stable as a water molecule.
- scentoni 3y agoWater famously does not always stay stable as a water molecule and in fact has extremely complex behavior. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-ionization_of_water https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-ionization_of_water
- userbinator 3y agoIn a 2014 review of BVO, the FDA recognized the "unresolved safety questions" and designed rodent studies [...]The studies did show toxicity. Where are all the "in mice!" comments?
- 0x69420 3y agowhat possesses someone to read "brominated" and think "safe" is anywhere in the realm of possibility?
- sokoloff 3y agoReplace with “fluoridated” or “chlorinated” and we pipe it into houses and give it to everyone in the household by the glassful. Our table salt is “iodized”. It doesn’t seem so strange that people (including the experts involved in food and food safety) might find it possibly safe.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- mschuster91 3y ago> Replace with “fluoridated” or “chlorinated” and we pipe it into houses and give it to everyone in the household by the glassful. Y'all are ... weird in that regard by European standards. Our tap water is pure as it comes from the groundwater, spring or whatever other water source; adding chlorine is unheard of outside of short-term contamination issues, and flouride and iodide are generally added into table salt and that's enough. We also don't chlorine wash our chickens or our eggs. In the end I think the difference boils down to the US using chlorine to "mask" the negative effects of penny-pinching (e.g. properly maintaining water mains, not letting farm animals practically live inside their feces, and following GMP standards in slaughterhouses), while European culture and legislation is proactive instead of reactive.
- Aldipower 3y agoBanned in most European countries since the seventies.
- chiefalchemist 3y agoWhat telling is how silently this additive was removed from the big-name beverages. What else does the FDA need to know?
- jvanderbot 3y agoIn case you're curious like I was, BVO (the additive in question) is commonly found in off-brand, citrusy sodas. My dear diet coke is safe, and PepsiCo apparently doesn't use it at all, at least in the US. (This is all on the second paragraph) This article has a list, it claims https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/nutrition/the-full-list-of-food-products-containing-brominated-vegetable-oil-which-the-fda-wants-to-ban/ar-AA1jlwFX https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/nutrition/the-full-list-of-... Though it borders on chum bucket ad quality. Proceed at your own risk.
- footlose_3815 3y agoIf you got to the list, you would see that Mountain Dew is on the list. I don’t think PepsiCo is any less culpable.
- wyldfire 3y agoIIRC this was in Mountain Dew for a very long time but removed in the last couple of years.
- ceautery 3y agoBVO has other consequences not mentioned in this article. I consumed Mountain Dew daily from ages 15 - 35, and quit cold-turkey after I learned about BVO's link to memory loss, since I had started to struggle with remembering words I didn't use frequently. The effects lasted for about a decade, and I still occasionally have to do an association memory exercise to pluck out a word. It's rare now, and normally only happens when I'm sleepy or I've been drinking. Pepsico poisoned me, happily filling their drinks with chemicals that have been banned in Europe for my entire life. But boy they had some fun commercials.