5 ms·
I'm surprised the government of Sweden allows a labor union to decide what passes through the country's ports.
by starbase 3y ago
I'm surprised the government of Sweden allows a labor union to decide what passes through the country's ports.
- pests 3y agoYou gonna hold a gun to their heads if they refuse?
- c0nducktr 3y agoWhoa hold on, don't want some pinkertons to get all excited.
- alphanullmeric 3y ago[flagged]
- fallingknife 3y agoThis is how all governments enforce all laws so not sure why it wouldn't apply here
- rsynnott 3y agoBecause there’s no law against striking.
- HDThoreaun 3y agoThe US at least has many laws against striking. It's absolutely not a free for all.
- rsynnott 3y agoPlease note that Sweden is not in the US.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- surgical_fire 3y agoIt is indeed unusual that a government might support its citizens instead of a corporation that would exploit them.
- postmeta 3y agousually governments just tax or tariff the corporations directly instead of relying on their citizens to extort them physically
- Apocryphon 3y agoWhat if there are countries where the governments are the people
- toomuchtodo 3y agoIt’s rare, which is why this audience likely doesn’t understand it vs “you’re not allowed to do that!” You absolutely can do whatever citizens collectively decide, including a general strike or blocking ports. Not every country has elected to be a slave to rugged capitalism. A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one.
- mensetmanusman 3y agoThe employees of companies are also people.
- Apocryphon 3y agoIndeed they are.
- arghwhat 3y agoThe unions negotiate fair indutry-wide rates and conditions for the members, not taxes. Think of it like people having talked about their salary in advance so when they walk into a negotiation and hear a number that's lower than their peers, they can call bullshit and make a take it or leave it counter. Companies get upset about unions because they're not paying fair pay right now and know it, and if everyone in a trade demands the same minimum rate then they have to accept it.
- permo-w 3y agowho runs the ports? labour
- seanmcdirmid 3y agoLongshoreman unions have an infamous history throughout the world. Even in the USA they have lots of leverage to dictate against things like too much automation.
- permo-w 3y agothe point I'm making is that the people on the ground making these places operate are the people that should have that power, and the idea that the government - supposedly the collective of all people in a country - would stand in the way of that for the sake of some capital holders is bizarre
- seanmcdirmid 3y agoPeople should have rights sure, but letting unions run ports to the contrary interests of everyone else is not that. I don’t want longshoremen unions telling me what I can buy and not buy.
- guerrilla 3y agoSo you should force them to work for the interestbof everyone else. That's called slavery.
- seanmcdirmid 3y agoNo. I would force competition though. Longshore men don’t want to unload a ship? Fine, they don’t have to work that day. Just hire people from the hall that will? No one wants to unload the ship? Ok, just let the robots do it.
- guerrilla 3y ago
- lovich 3y agoWhat would you expect the government to do here if the workers as a group decided not to unload these parts? Legitimately what would the appropriate response look like to you?
- SamReidHughes 3y agoChannel their inner LKY and deal with it the way he did.
- lovich 3y agoI do not understand the reference. What/who is LKY in this situation?
- andromeduck 3y agoSingapore.
- medvezhenok 3y agoI'm assuming it's referring to Lee Kuan Yew, first premier of Singapore: https://mothership.sg/2017/11/lee-kuan-yew-singapore-airlines-union/ https://mothership.sg/2017/11/lee-kuan-yew-singapore-airline...
- bugglebeetle 3y agoThe parent is expressing their affection for a fascist dictator.
- SamReidHughes 3y agoFrom his memoirs "The Singapore Story", Chapter 6, "Winning Over the Unions", on the ports: > Recounting Britain's prodigal years of crippling dock strikes which led to the devaluation of the pound sterling in 1967, I warned, "If that happens here at our harbour I will declare this high treason. I will move against the strike leaders. Charges will be brought in court later. I will get the port going straight away. The Singapore dollar will never be devalued and I think the people of Singapore expect this of their government." I spotlighted the "selfishness of established labour." Cargo handled by the Port of Singapore Authority in 1967 increased by winning over the unions over 10 percent, but the number of workers employed did not go up because the extra work was all taken up by overtime. This was immoral at a time of high unemployment. I told the union delegates that we must rid ourselves of pernicious British-style trade union practices. A very interesting book; of course, it's his side of the story.
- whenc 3y agoSweden being a member of the customs union, the cars can be brought in via any other custom union state i.e the EEA plus Turkey.
- havkom 3y agoWell, then there will probably be other steps. For example electricians unions blocking any work or maintenance on Tesla charging infrastructure. The unions collective agreements in Sweden and pretty standardalized and include standard things like pension offsets etc. So not a big bruden for serious companies. From a company/management point of view it is often something good in the end if in addition employees are union members (I’ve been in this situation myself as a manager in Swedish companies): Say you want to terminate someone, they will get union representation. There will be very little hassle and the process will go smoothly since everyone in the room knows the rules and when the employee gets upset their union representative can help them move forward without unnecessary hassel which would lead nowhere.
- CPLX 3y ago“Allows” them to decide what sort of work they are and aren’t willing to do?
- TraspSE 3y agoThey don't, and cars can still come in to Swedish ports... There's just not anyone there that's willing to unload those made by Tesla before the ship has to leave again. The unions are allowed to strike because Tesla refuse to sign the collective agreement that regulates the use of strikes while the employees in return are guaranteed minimal wage, pensions and so on. Tesla can sign this agreement any time they want to, but they're choosing this fight while the unions wants regulation. That's on them, not anyone else - and Musk is perfectly free to take his business elsewhere if he don't want to conform to Swedish customs.