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I imagine the amount of people upgrading from an M2 Mac will be close to 0, while there's a lot of Intel stragglers out there.
by internet2000 3y ago
I imagine the amount of people upgrading from an M2 Mac will be close to 0, while there's a lot of Intel stragglers out there.
- elif 3y agoI think the point is more that "is it worth buying this new m3 or should I buy a secondhand m2 for half the price?"
- photonerd 3y agomore like "a hundred bucks less". The M1's go for maybe half... if you're lucky. Most are more.
- OJFord 3y agoBecause there's a newer model, which is now true for the M2 ones too?
- photonerd 3y agoM1’s took a hit because multiple processors came out each gen. Remember: the M1 was superseded by both the Pro & the Max (and the unites but that’s not in a MacBook). By the time the M2 came around ppl knew what was up. So you might be able to find a bog standard M1 that low (they do show up) due to this… but it’s rare.
- jki275 3y agoI don't think you're going to find any M2s for half the price. They hold their value pretty solidly.
- kimixa 3y agoThey won't if the M3 turns out to be a significant upgrade.
- stouset 3y agoThat’s honestly just not how Apple hardware resale value has ever worked. The new M3 hardware could double the performance of the previous generation and they would only drop in price by maybe a few hundred.
- philistine 3y agoOne big outlier; the recent Intel Macs have dropped far more in value than expected.
- kimixa 3y agoAnd that outlier is the last /significant/ difference in performance. M1->M2 wasn't that big, generally seen as a small incremental improvement at best, and the last few Intel updates barely moved the needle between them.
- jki275 3y agoI see ones like mine on eBay for more than 50% of what I paid for it, and it's four years old.
- jug 3y agoOr should I buy a brand new M2 Mac Mini for half the price of iMac M3 if I already own a monitor. Or a M2 Pro for the same price where iMac M3 doesn’t even have a counterpart.
- jacquesm 3y agoIntel straggler here. And I'll remain one until Linux runs flawlessly on the newer generation. I have an older Thinkpad as my main workhorse and a now quite old Macbook air for on the road, it's battery has been shot for a long time but it still works quite good when plugged in and I'm too much of a miser to have it replaced. But if there is a way to run a full Linux distro on the newer hardware then I'll probably buy one. But I'm under no illusion that Apple makes their hardware to cater to me and that's perfectly fine.
- drcongo 3y agoI don't know if this is at all helpful, but I have Ubuntu running nicely inside Orbstack on a Mac Studio. Obviously it's all running inside MacOS though, but it works.
- Bitnotri 3y agoCheck out asahilinux.org - I have archlinux arm running as my main OS on Air M1 for a year now.
- marci 3y agoThey're a small team, they can only handle/reverse-engineer the M1 as of now. edit: looks like they are make bigger strides than I thought on M2 as well https://github.com/AsahiLinux/docs/wiki/Feature-Support#m2-promaxultra-device-specific-support https://github.com/AsahiLinux/docs/wiki/Feature-Support#m2-p...
- TimTheTinker 3y agoI recommend sponsoring Hector Martin here: https://github.com/sponsors/marcan https://github.com/sponsors/marcan Yes, he's continuing to work on the long tail of drivers needed for Linux on Apple silicon. Looks like lately he's working on speakersafetyd, a daemon that will monitor audio levels and keep the builtin speakers from being damaged: https://github.com/marcan?tab=overview&from=2023-09-01&to=2023-09-30 https://github.com/marcan?tab=overview&from=2023-09-01&to=20...
- 3y ago
- cultofmetatron 3y agomy intel died last week. had to get an m2 pro and THIS drops today. kinda salty that my intel couldn' have held out till the M3 was available
- vidoc 3y agounless you went second hand, you should still be covered with the 30 day return policy no?
- vidoc 3y agowow it's 14! definitely need to hurry up :)
- evanmoran 3y agoThis is what returns are for! It is definitely worth the hassle for a better chip
- phonon 3y agoApple has a 14 day return policy. Don't need a reason. https://www.apple.com/shop/help/returns_refund https://www.apple.com/shop/help/returns_refund
- goerz 3y ago“Last week” is well within the 2-week return window.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- fastball 3y agoI bought a top spec Intel mac a month before the M1 came out. Just sold that computer for 1/3 it's original price :\
- solardev 3y ago1/3 is pretty good for a used computer, TBH. I usually get like 20% or less... sometimes they're hard to even give away.
- mschuster91 3y agoI'm one of them. For work, come and grab my 2019 16in from my cold dead hands - it may not have the battery lifetime of my private 2022 M2 MBA, but at least I don't have to fight weird issues with x86 Docker images (especially anything involving a JDK runtime, i.e. Tomcat, tends to act up). And no, converting these images to ARM isn't an option, the source image doesn't come from us, and we need to reproduce the exact software environment to reproduce bugs. And for me as a Samsung phone user, I'm pretty annoyed that I have to drag out a win10 machine every time I want to update the firmware of my phone because Odin is only available on Windows and UTM can't use Rosetta to emulate a Windows VM at any acceptable speed or stability.
- robbintt 3y agoI have 1 of these for work and 1 for home. I'm waiting 5 years from release, so about 2024-2025. Computers got really good around 2017, and the only reason to upgrade is the heat and fan. I use remote VMs anyways, so chrome is really my limiter.
- karolist 3y ago2019 16"cher here too. These are great machines just eclipsed by all the Apple silicon hype. Yes they suck comparing to performance, power use and heat to Apple silicon, they're still amazing x86 laptops compared to whatever other x86 machines are out there.
- jbverschoor 3y agoSo an occasional firmware upgrade is holding you back? If you install the guest drivers, windows is superfast under UTM. The docker thing is nonsense if you're using orbstack for example.
- mschuster91 3y ago> So an occasional firmware upgrade is holding you back? If you install the guest drivers, windows is superfast under UTM. The guest drivers don't work under Win7.
- vishnugupta 3y agoIntel straggler here. My laptop just completed 5 years. It says battery needs replacing which I’ve been putting off for a year. The thing is I have 32G which is quite good IMO so I’ll probably use it for two years at least.
- vessenes 3y agoYou're just hurting yourself. Even the M1 Pro is like 3x faster than that Intel laptop. Plus so many tiny things like sleep/wake, power management, heat.. I really can't stress enough what a tectonic change the M1 was over Intel.
- stouset 3y agoIt really, really was. I’d been used to barely-noticeable performance gains for a decade or more. The responsiveness under load of the M1s made them feel like a decade of performance improvements overnight.
- ravetcofx 3y agoThis was especially true with Apple/Intel thermal envelope, I don't know of any other manufacturer that purposefully ran their CPUs to the point of throttling just to keep fan noise down, and in such thin machines with wafer thin heatsinks for design aesthetics. I think they made the last few gens of Intel they used worse than they were (to be fair Intel did have poor TDP till recent 12th Gen)
- karolist 3y agoDepends on what they're doing with the machine. For casual use, Intel is perfectly fine and you do get some x86 benefits too. I have M1 Pro for work, personal M2 mac mini and typing this on 16" Intel MBP, watched the presentation live and still not convinced I need to upgrade my casual browsing and light programing machine this year. Battery is at 500 cycles and 84% health, still lasts 4 hours.
- 3y ago
- huytersd 3y agoI’m an Intel strangler because it’s the only way I can have Mac and Windows on the same machine. Am I the only person that really needs this? Parallels has trash performance.
- baggy_trough 3y agoYou can run ARM Windows under Parallels, which is good enough for me.
- huytersd 3y agoAh just updated my comment. I really dislike how slow Parallels is.
- baggy_trough 3y agoFunny, I never notice that.
- cpuguy83 3y agoFor gaming sure... but anything else... hypervisors are very good these days.
- solardev 3y agoJust throwing this out there: ARM Windows uses Microsoft's own ARM to x86 translation layer (like their Rosetta), which works surprisingly well for run-of-the-mill business apps and the like. 3D apps do take a big hit though. https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/arm/apps-on-arm-x86-emulation https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/arm/apps-on-arm-x8...
- rafaelmn 3y agoIntel straggler here ! When M1 hit I was certain I would get a M Apple in a year or two when they iron out the transition. It was just leaps and bounds ahead of others and the pricing was great. Now I think AMD and Intel caught up enough, Apple didn't keep the momentum, and they do standard Apple pricing discrimination - I think I'll take a gamble on Framework AMD version. I really like the idea behind the self-repairable upgradeable device and want to support them. If I was able to work on my Apple Intel i9 overheating PoS for past few years I'll be better off with anything, might as well support the stuff I like.
- turblety 3y ago> Now I think AMD and Intel caught up enough Interesting. I don't really like Apple, mainly because of how they handle the app store vendor lock in stuff, and I hate macOS. But I use an M2 MBP purely because I can't find any other laptop that has the same fast performance, long battery life, quiet fan noise, no heat. Can you recommend an AMD/Intel or anything that comes close? I'd switch in a heartbeat. The closest that comes to mind is the ThinkPad X13s.
- leonroy 3y agoI just bought a Thinkpad T14S Gen3 after evaluating a bunch of notebooks. Compared to my Macbook Air the Mac excels in a couple of areas which Thinkpad is lacking in. Like ambient light sensor, port quality (ie. how recessed the USB-C port is and how much strain it can take), audio output quality (Macs have powered headphone jacks for high impedance headphones) and of course speaker quality which on Macs is second to none. The Thinkpad by comparison has poor quality speakers, no ambient light sensor so it doesn't auto adjust the screen or keyboard backlight. Its USB-C ports are also not very strong so the any strain on them or wiggle will cause them to disconnect - they certainly feel very fragile. I hear the Thinkpad Z13/Z16 is more comparable to a Macbook but again it doesn't have little details like an ambient light sensor which seems an odd omission in a luxury laptop and price wise it's practically the same. That said, the new AMD Ryzen 7840HS and 7940HS chips are pretty competitive with an equivalent Apple M2: https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-7940hs https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-7940hs https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/mac14-15 https://browser.geekbench.com/macs/mac14-15
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]