6 ms·

impressive, but as I've witnessed a top fuel dragster do 0-320mph in just over 3 seconds (meters away from me!), think I am a bit desensitised.

by canbus 3y ago

Waterluvian 3y ago
At that distance and in real time, can you see those tires doing that absolutely wild twist as they “wind up” all the tension gripping the asphalt?
- canbus 3y ago
  Not at real time - i'm a hobbyist photographer so have snapped the tyres digging into the track, but they're far too fast to see with a pair of eyes! really the only thing you can see is a blur then a parachute being deployed. the noise goes through you like nothing else though. I have metal plates in my arm due to an injury and was worried the vibration was going to undo the hardware :-D
  - Waterluvian 3y ago
    By chance do you share any of that photography online? P.S. You could always stop by the pits and ask them to re-torque the bolts :-D
    - canbus 3y ago
      unfortunately not - will see if i can dig some out. haven't been over to santa pod for a while so the pics are a bit rubbish.
bobo_legos 3y ago
Seeing, hearing and smelling a nitro fuel car is a complete sensory overload. It's an amazing experience. I know that electric or some other thing is the future, but I seriously doubt that those things will ever be the visceral experience that is an 11,000HP nitro engine.
rbut 3y ago
Growing up watching top fuel I'm exactly the same. And until battery technology achieves the same energy density as fuel (and its a long way off) we won't see the same kind of speeds with electric vehicles.
- HeyLaughingBoy 3y ago
  For drag racing, you only need enough battery life to last a few seconds. Hell, this might spur the development of high-energy supercapacitors!
- aidenn0 3y ago
  Nitromethane engines are less than 50% efficient and batteries are already about 10% as dense as nitromethane, so it's less than a factor of 5 difference. For drag, the limit is more likely to be power density rather than energy density (same reason why more energy dense gasoline isn't used in top-fuel; the limiting power factor for a typical ICE is the amount of air you can get in the cylinder and you get about double the power with nitromethane vs gasoline for a fixed amount of oxygen). [edit] The power you can get with nitromethane is only double if you run stochiometric; since it is partially self-oxidizing, running richer lets you get even more power (sources seem to indicate 4x). Of course running rich lowers the efficiency even more.
- api 3y ago
  Nit pick: battery technology only needs to equal about 25-30% the raw energy density of fuel to equal the density of fuel in terms of useful work output. That’s because electric motors can be as high as 98-99% efficient at converting electric power into work while small internal combustion engines peak out at about 35% and that’s generous. 20% is more typical. Then for ICE you have additional losses in the transmission that don’t happen for electric. The vast majority of the energy in liquid fuel heats the air around the car. This is also why a normal sized EV powered entirely by coal fired electricity can emit less carbon per mile than an efficient ICE car or even a hybrid. A big supercritical steam turbine in a coal power plant is going to be well over twice as efficient at converting heat into useful work than a small ICE. (Few people get all their power from coal, which is the worst case for CO2 emission, so in practice EVs are pretty much always lower carbon.) Small heat engines suck.
refurb 3y ago
I had a chance to stand on the track with a pro-dragster. It was more like an explosion than a car accelerating. Suddenly a ton of noise you could feel in your chest and then it's gone.
yodelshady 3y ago
It's much more impressive to me seeing it be done on a basically Formula Student++ budget. I'm sure the same team could make a very fast ICE car, and that would be impressive too. I've seen Ford make a similarly fast electric mustang-chassis dragster, and yeah, that's a bit... unsurprising, really? You know how much force you need, ergo how much torque, translating that into a motor is not hard, translating that into a current is not hard, translating that into cabling is not hard. It's much more a set of composable sub-problems, and unlike engines, most of those sub-problems can't explode.

impressive, but as I've witnessed a top fuel dragster do 0-320mph in just over 3 seconds (meters away from me!), think I am a bit desensitised.

by canbus 3y ago

impressive, but as I've witnessed a top fuel dragster do 0-320mph in just over 3 seconds (meters away from me!), think I am a bit desensitised.

Waterluvian 3y ago

At that distance and in real time, can you see those tires doing that absolutely wild twist as they “wind up” all the tension gripping the asphalt?

canbus 3y ago
Not at real time - i'm a hobbyist photographer so have snapped the tyres digging into the track, but they're far too fast to see with a pair of eyes! really the only thing you can see is a blur then a parachute being deployed. the noise goes through you like nothing else though. I have metal plates in my arm due to an injury and was worried the vibration was going to undo the hardware :-D
- Waterluvian 3y ago
  By chance do you share any of that photography online? P.S. You could always stop by the pits and ask them to re-torque the bolts :-D
  - canbus 3y ago
    unfortunately not - will see if i can dig some out. haven't been over to santa pod for a while so the pics are a bit rubbish.

bobo_legos 3y ago

Seeing, hearing and smelling a nitro fuel car is a complete sensory overload. It's an amazing experience. I know that electric or some other thing is the future, but I seriously doubt that those things will ever be the visceral experience that is an 11,000HP nitro engine.

rbut 3y ago

Growing up watching top fuel I'm exactly the same. And until battery technology achieves the same energy density as fuel (and its a long way off) we won't see the same kind of speeds with electric vehicles.

HeyLaughingBoy 3y ago
For drag racing, you only need enough battery life to last a few seconds. Hell, this might spur the development of high-energy supercapacitors!
aidenn0 3y ago
Nitromethane engines are less than 50% efficient and batteries are already about 10% as dense as nitromethane, so it's less than a factor of 5 difference. For drag, the limit is more likely to be power density rather than energy density (same reason why more energy dense gasoline isn't used in top-fuel; the limiting power factor for a typical ICE is the amount of air you can get in the cylinder and you get about double the power with nitromethane vs gasoline for a fixed amount of oxygen). [edit] The power you can get with nitromethane is only double if you run stochiometric; since it is partially self-oxidizing, running richer lets you get even more power (sources seem to indicate 4x). Of course running rich lowers the efficiency even more.
api 3y ago
Nit pick: battery technology only needs to equal about 25-30% the raw energy density of fuel to equal the density of fuel in terms of useful work output. That’s because electric motors can be as high as 98-99% efficient at converting electric power into work while small internal combustion engines peak out at about 35% and that’s generous. 20% is more typical. Then for ICE you have additional losses in the transmission that don’t happen for electric. The vast majority of the energy in liquid fuel heats the air around the car. This is also why a normal sized EV powered entirely by coal fired electricity can emit less carbon per mile than an efficient ICE car or even a hybrid. A big supercritical steam turbine in a coal power plant is going to be well over twice as efficient at converting heat into useful work than a small ICE. (Few people get all their power from coal, which is the worst case for CO2 emission, so in practice EVs are pretty much always lower carbon.) Small heat engines suck.

refurb 3y ago

I had a chance to stand on the track with a pro-dragster. It was more like an explosion than a car accelerating. Suddenly a ton of noise you could feel in your chest and then it's gone.

yodelshady 3y ago

It's much more impressive to me seeing it be done on a basically Formula Student++ budget. I'm sure the same team could make a very fast ICE car, and that would be impressive too. I've seen Ford make a similarly fast electric mustang-chassis dragster, and yeah, that's a bit... unsurprising, really? You know how much force you need, ergo how much torque, translating that into a motor is not hard, translating that into a current is not hard, translating that into cabling is not hard. It's much more a set of composable sub-problems, and unlike engines, most of those sub-problems can't explode.