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Live Nation, who own Ticketmaster, also own the venues and do the promotion for the tours. They have a vertically integrated monopoly.
by teppic 3y ago
Live Nation, who own Ticketmaster, also own the venues and do the promotion for the tours.
They have a vertically integrated monopoly.
- danabenson 3y agoSuccinct. Precise. Accurate. Correct.
- cbsmith 3y agoNot accurate. TM already had a lock the market before LN acquired them. In fact, LN created their own ticketing platform to compete with TM... and failed miserably. Take a look at the largest venues in the country. Most of them aren't owned by LN, but they still use TM for ticketing. If anything, TM has helped LN to acquire more venues than the other way around. In general, TM has a much more dominant share of the ticketing business than LN has of the venue or promotion business.
- latchkey 3y agoYou're bringing up the past, they are talking about the present, which is absolutely accurate.
- IshKebab 3y agoOP asked why nobody has beaten TM. The answer cannot be "because they have a vertically integrated monopoly" because in the past that wasn't true and nobody was able to beat them then either.
- latchkey 3y agoEven if a venue isn't owned my LN, they still use TM for ticketing because otherwise their booking agents won't be able to get the Clear Channel artists to come. It has been that way for a LONG time. Before LN, it was CC. Source: I used to own a night club in San Francisco.
- cbsmith 3y agoYeah, no: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Live_Nation_(events_promoter) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Live_Nation_(events_promoter) "Founded in 1996 by Robert F. X. Sillerman as SFX Entertainment, the company's business was built around consolidating concert promoters into a national entity to counter the oversized influence of ticket behemoth Ticketmaster." It's kind of amazing how the present distorts our perspective of the past.
- latchkey 3y agoWhat are you no about? Like I said, before LN, it was CC.
- cbsmith 3y agoIt was formed to compete with TM, because TM had too much market power. In other words, you didn't need to use TM if you were using CC from a business/monopoly standpoint --in fact it was against their interests. However, CC/LN often went with TM anyway because it worked out better for them.
- latchkey 3y agoAnd what happened? They joined TM and CC.
- cbsmith 3y agoNo, LN was spun off from CC and after years of trying & failing to compete with TM, then acquired TM. The point being: TM already had the market power before LN was on the scene, and all of LN's market power wasn't enough to get people to use their ticketing platform instead of TM. Saying LN is the reason everyone uses TM is very much getting it backwards.
- cbsmith 3y agoSo LN's market share in venues and acts is smaller than TM's market share for ticketing, and LN tried to use their venue/promotion business to launch their own ticketing platform and couldn't compete with TM... but right now the only reason people use TM is because of LN? Surely, if LN's dominance is what is needed to lock up the ticketing market, LN's ticketing platform should have been able to compete with TM quite well, and TM should have been struggling to succeed in the ticketing market prior to being acquired by LN.
- gardenhedge 3y agoSo someone did beat TM by buying them
- tylergetsay 3y agoIt's not that LN owns the venues, but that the venues have an exclusive ticket agreement with TM. So if you want to perform at this venue, you must sell via TM. When my startup was trying to compete, we found that basically every single outdoor amphitheater had exclusive ticket rights. This makes stuff like crowdfunding a concert impossible
- cbsmith 3y agoRight, but now you have to ask yourself why do the venues have exclusive ticket agreements with TM rather than another ticketing vendor?
- wdr1 3y agoTicketmaster was still seen as a monopoly long before LN bought them. In fact, Pearl Jam sued TM for being a monopoly in 1994, about 15 years before LN bought TM. https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/1994-when-pearl-jam-took-ticketmaster-look-back/UFQFVWKQPJB63FWUAVNRQCMSV4/#:~:text=Even%20after%20complaining%20to%20the,under%20%2420%20for%20their%20fans https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/1994-when-pearl-jam-took-ti....