5 ms·

Elon Musk's X removes New York Times' verification badge

58 points by CharlesW 3y ago

entuno 3y ago
These news sites should really just stop using Twitter. Every time Twitter does something stupid and they all just happily keep using it they're just encouraging more stupid decisions down the line.
- legitster 3y ago
  Part of the unspoken reality of Twitter is that it became an integral part of modern journalism. News agencies have been spending the last two decades cutting way back on their field reporting and foreign bureaus. And most journalists graduate college without any actual investigative experience, and get a job where they sit at a desk and read the internet all day. No one is out knocking on doors anymore. Twitter basically became the outsourcing platform for beat reporting. There is no plan B.
  - EA-3167 3y ago
    That's the theory, but I wonder if it's actually true? I suspect it isn't, especially at this point. I think a lot of that activity came down to reporters talking to each other, followed by hordes of bots and people who don't actually read past the headline. NPR bailed on Twitter and they claim they've seen zero change in their metrics as a result; I believe them.
    - legitster 3y ago
      How much of the news you have seen from Hamas/Israel has actually come from a reporter or news crew on the scene? Almost exclusively the content that is not coming from government sources themselves is coming from from videos and posts being uploaded by Palestinians/Israelis directly. Even if NPR and others have bailed from having an official presence on Twitter, I can almost guarantee you that individual journalists at said organizations are still probably on it all day scanning for content.
      - zmk5 3y ago
        iirc journalists are not allowed into Gaza and have been stuck at the border.
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
      - api 3y ago
        > is coming from from videos and posts being uploaded by Palestinians/Israelis directly. ... which also means it could be coming from Israeli or Hamas (or Iranian or Russian or American or ...) propagandists posing as on the ground citizen reporters and there's nobody on the ground to fact check anything. This is particularly true in the era of deepfakes. You don't even have to stage or mis-caption or mis-attribute photos. You can outright fake things. You don’t even need to be there. That on the ground reporter in Gaza could be in a basement in Idaho using Midjourney and Dall-E. Even if the deepfake is detectable most of the hordes on Xitter will believe it. See, believe, retweet.
      - technion 3y ago
        I just watched the Anthony Bourdain special where he talked to people in Israel about previous wars, and they talked about Twitter saving their lives, calling in NATO strikes by Tweeting about enemy activities.
      - gausswho 3y ago
        May not be from the big name sources you expect, but journalists are there. And 19 known to have died are covered here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/19/journalists-killed-israel-gaza-war/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/19/journalists-...
      - aaomidi 3y ago
        Israel doesn’t allow journalists in since this started. https://apnews.com/article/israel-gaza-journalists-safety-259bcff10356a8a48d5b7640e8a16274 https://apnews.com/article/israel-gaza-journalists-safety-25...
    - badwolf 3y ago
      The theory gains more credibility to me every time I see journalists screeching about how they can't use search on Threads to find out what "people" are saying.
    - saulpw 3y ago
      Yes, it's true. The costs to do apparent 'journalism' fell because underpaid news writers could make a valid-sounding article from stuff they found on Twitter. That started a race to the bottom, where now very few places are doing non-Twitter journalism.
    - halJordan 3y ago
      You're arguing a different point. There is no actual argument to be had about the decline of the reporter. Print media died and took journalists with it. Outlets like the NYT or NPR get by with their old guard, but once they retire who knows what'll happen.
  - api 3y ago
    > Part of the unspoken reality of Twitter is that it became an integral part of modern journalism. I think this is true, and it's absolutely horrifying. Nuke it from orbit. Twitter didn't just become toxic with the Elon takeover. It's always been toxic. It's structurally toxic. The net effect of Twitter being the brain of humanity is to prioritize and elevate the dumbest, most divisive, and most emotionally triggering ideas from every part of the ideological landscape and de-prioritize anything deep and intelligent. Trash and rage bait drive engagement. It's like letting trashy daytime TV drive your civilization.
    - andrewinardeer 3y ago
      I don't think that Twitter should be shouldering the blame for the fact that Twitter is an integral part of modern journalism and that journalism these days involves regurgitating stories found on Twitter.
  - cratermoon 3y ago
    > most journalists graduate college without any actual investigative experience [citation needed]
- duskwuff 3y ago
  > These news sites should really just stop using Twitter. It's already happening: https://niemanreports.org/articles/npr-twitter-musk/ https://niemanreports.org/articles/npr-twitter-musk/ TL;DR: NPR and many of its member stations stopped posting to Twitter in April 2023. Traffic to their web site dropped by ~1%.
  - mgiannopoulos 3y ago
    Important note: Traffic from Twitter was already 2% and is now at 1% Not exactly the same dramatic story if you think about it.
  - eclipticplane 3y ago
    To further distance themselves, they need to stop quoting things that happened on Twitter as if its news. "Such-and-such Senator said on X, Formerly Twitter ..." can be replaced with the actual quote, press release, or news conference.
Mountain_Skies 3y ago
As reported by Jeff Bezo's Washington Post. Wonder what Rupert Murdock's Fox News thinks about this? Maybe we can ask Mark Zuckerberg's Facebook to weight in on alternatives.
- glonq 3y ago
  We need a modern update to Diderot's solution for kings and priests that considers politicians and billionaires.
gamblor956 3y ago
For context, NYT recently called out Musk for spreading anti-Semitic propaganda. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/19/x-twitter-nyt-dispute-musk/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/19/x-twitt... https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/08/israel-hamas-disinfo-musk-twitter-x/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/08/israel-...
- lp0_on_fire 3y ago
  Elon Musk owns a social media company that is pretty open about it's speech policies, whether you agree with them or not. I hold random twitter user spouting bullshit to a much different standard than say...an organization that styles itself as a "newspaper of record" _uncritically_ parroting Hamas propaganda for the past two weeks. Those in glass houses and all...
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago
    What Hamas propaganda? https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/14/opinion/israel-gaza-war.html https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/14/opinion/israel-gaza-war.h... > Israel stands on the verge of invading Gaza in response to the terrorist attacks by Hamas that many, including Israel’s leaders, have compared to Sept. 11 not just because of the scale and savagery but also because the terrorists sought to destroy the tranquillity of daily life. They killed the very young and the very old, the strong and the weak, civilians and soldiers; they took some 150 hostages, including children, and survivors said the attackers raped women — all to send a message that no Israeli was safe. - The Editorial Board
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - iudqnolq 3y ago
    Elon Musk said > For following the war in real-time, @WarMonitors & @sentdefender are good Turns out those accounts aren't good. Musk had the freedom to endorse those accounts, and the times has the freedom to criticize him for doing so.
wilg 3y ago
I mean the verification badge means less than nothing these days anyway.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  Nah, it means someone, somewhere, paid $8.
  - wilg 3y ago
    No, because the New York Times didn't but had one. Many people are sort of grandfathered in. It's a hot mess.
ChatGTP 3y ago
How are things at the town square ?
clubm8 3y ago
[dead]
babelthuap 3y ago
[dead]
moralestapia 3y ago
I guess they have to pay $8 like everybody else ...
- Ch4otic 3y ago
  That's if they want the blue checkmark. Organisations have to pay for a gold checkmark, which is ~$1000 p/m
Crosseye_Jack 3y ago
https://archive.ph/Ce30B https://archive.ph/Ce30B
golemiprague 3y ago
[dead]
mgiannopoulos 3y ago
They were getting a badge because of their advertising budget They stopped paying for it, so… https://twitter.com/xDaily/status/1715231084307509429 https://twitter.com/xDaily/status/1715231084307509429

58 points by CharlesW 3y ago

These news sites should really just stop using Twitter. Every time Twitter does something stupid and they all just happily keep using it they're just encouraging more stupid decisions down the line.

legitster 3y ago
Part of the unspoken reality of Twitter is that it became an integral part of modern journalism. News agencies have been spending the last two decades cutting way back on their field reporting and foreign bureaus. And most journalists graduate college without any actual investigative experience, and get a job where they sit at a desk and read the internet all day. No one is out knocking on doors anymore. Twitter basically became the outsourcing platform for beat reporting. There is no plan B.
- EA-3167 3y ago
  That's the theory, but I wonder if it's actually true? I suspect it isn't, especially at this point. I think a lot of that activity came down to reporters talking to each other, followed by hordes of bots and people who don't actually read past the headline. NPR bailed on Twitter and they claim they've seen zero change in their metrics as a result; I believe them.
  - legitster 3y ago
    How much of the news you have seen from Hamas/Israel has actually come from a reporter or news crew on the scene? Almost exclusively the content that is not coming from government sources themselves is coming from from videos and posts being uploaded by Palestinians/Israelis directly. Even if NPR and others have bailed from having an official presence on Twitter, I can almost guarantee you that individual journalists at said organizations are still probably on it all day scanning for content.
    - zmk5 3y ago
      iirc journalists are not allowed into Gaza and have been stuck at the border.
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
    - api 3y ago
      > is coming from from videos and posts being uploaded by Palestinians/Israelis directly. ... which also means it could be coming from Israeli or Hamas (or Iranian or Russian or American or ...) propagandists posing as on the ground citizen reporters and there's nobody on the ground to fact check anything. This is particularly true in the era of deepfakes. You don't even have to stage or mis-caption or mis-attribute photos. You can outright fake things. You don’t even need to be there. That on the ground reporter in Gaza could be in a basement in Idaho using Midjourney and Dall-E. Even if the deepfake is detectable most of the hordes on Xitter will believe it. See, believe, retweet.
    - technion 3y ago
      I just watched the Anthony Bourdain special where he talked to people in Israel about previous wars, and they talked about Twitter saving their lives, calling in NATO strikes by Tweeting about enemy activities.
    - gausswho 3y ago
      May not be from the big name sources you expect, but journalists are there. And 19 known to have died are covered here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/19/journalists-killed-israel-gaza-war/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/19/journalists-...
    - aaomidi 3y ago
      Israel doesn’t allow journalists in since this started. https://apnews.com/article/israel-gaza-journalists-safety-259bcff10356a8a48d5b7640e8a16274 https://apnews.com/article/israel-gaza-journalists-safety-25...
  - badwolf 3y ago
    The theory gains more credibility to me every time I see journalists screeching about how they can't use search on Threads to find out what "people" are saying.
  - saulpw 3y ago
    Yes, it's true. The costs to do apparent 'journalism' fell because underpaid news writers could make a valid-sounding article from stuff they found on Twitter. That started a race to the bottom, where now very few places are doing non-Twitter journalism.
  - halJordan 3y ago
    You're arguing a different point. There is no actual argument to be had about the decline of the reporter. Print media died and took journalists with it. Outlets like the NYT or NPR get by with their old guard, but once they retire who knows what'll happen.
- api 3y ago
  > Part of the unspoken reality of Twitter is that it became an integral part of modern journalism. I think this is true, and it's absolutely horrifying. Nuke it from orbit. Twitter didn't just become toxic with the Elon takeover. It's always been toxic. It's structurally toxic. The net effect of Twitter being the brain of humanity is to prioritize and elevate the dumbest, most divisive, and most emotionally triggering ideas from every part of the ideological landscape and de-prioritize anything deep and intelligent. Trash and rage bait drive engagement. It's like letting trashy daytime TV drive your civilization.
  - andrewinardeer 3y ago
    I don't think that Twitter should be shouldering the blame for the fact that Twitter is an integral part of modern journalism and that journalism these days involves regurgitating stories found on Twitter.
- cratermoon 3y ago
  > most journalists graduate college without any actual investigative experience [citation needed]
duskwuff 3y ago
> These news sites should really just stop using Twitter. It's already happening: https://niemanreports.org/articles/npr-twitter-musk/ https://niemanreports.org/articles/npr-twitter-musk/ TL;DR: NPR and many of its member stations stopped posting to Twitter in April 2023. Traffic to their web site dropped by ~1%.
- mgiannopoulos 3y ago
  Important note: Traffic from Twitter was already 2% and is now at 1% Not exactly the same dramatic story if you think about it.
- eclipticplane 3y ago
  To further distance themselves, they need to stop quoting things that happened on Twitter as if its news. "Such-and-such Senator said on X, Formerly Twitter ..." can be replaced with the actual quote, press release, or news conference.

Mountain_Skies 3y ago

As reported by Jeff Bezo's Washington Post. Wonder what Rupert Murdock's Fox News thinks about this? Maybe we can ask Mark Zuckerberg's Facebook to weight in on alternatives.

glonq 3y ago
We need a modern update to Diderot's solution for kings and priests that considers politicians and billionaires.

gamblor956 3y ago

For context, NYT recently called out Musk for spreading anti-Semitic propaganda. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/19/x-twitter-nyt-dispute-musk/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/19/x-twitt... https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/08/israel-hamas-disinfo-musk-twitter-x/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/10/08/israel-...

lp0_on_fire 3y ago
Elon Musk owns a social media company that is pretty open about it's speech policies, whether you agree with them or not. I hold random twitter user spouting bullshit to a much different standard than say...an organization that styles itself as a "newspaper of record" _uncritically_ parroting Hamas propaganda for the past two weeks. Those in glass houses and all...
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago
  What Hamas propaganda? https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/14/opinion/israel-gaza-war.html https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/14/opinion/israel-gaza-war.h... > Israel stands on the verge of invading Gaza in response to the terrorist attacks by Hamas that many, including Israel’s leaders, have compared to Sept. 11 not just because of the scale and savagery but also because the terrorists sought to destroy the tranquillity of daily life. They killed the very young and the very old, the strong and the weak, civilians and soldiers; they took some 150 hostages, including children, and survivors said the attackers raped women — all to send a message that no Israeli was safe. - The Editorial Board
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- iudqnolq 3y ago
  Elon Musk said > For following the war in real-time, @WarMonitors & @sentdefender are good Turns out those accounts aren't good. Musk had the freedom to endorse those accounts, and the times has the freedom to criticize him for doing so.

wilg 3y ago

I mean the verification badge means less than nothing these days anyway.

JohnFen 3y ago
Nah, it means someone, somewhere, paid $8.
- wilg 3y ago
  No, because the New York Times didn't but had one. Many people are sort of grandfathered in. It's a hot mess.

ChatGTP 3y ago

How are things at the town square ?

clubm8 3y ago

[dead]

babelthuap 3y ago

[dead]

moralestapia 3y ago

I guess they have to pay $8 like everybody else ...

Ch4otic 3y ago
That's if they want the blue checkmark. Organisations have to pay for a gold checkmark, which is ~$1000 p/m

Crosseye_Jack 3y ago

https://archive.ph/Ce30B https://archive.ph/Ce30B

golemiprague 3y ago

[dead]

mgiannopoulos 3y ago

They were getting a badge because of their advertising budget They stopped paying for it, so… https://twitter.com/xDaily/status/1715231084307509429 https://twitter.com/xDaily/status/1715231084307509429