5 ms·

Mozilla is clearly trying to expand into new areas. Some of the fun ones from their open job postings include a social recommendation component (likely the reas

Mozilla is clearly trying to expand into new areas. Some of the fun ones from their open job postings include a social recommendation component (likely the reason for this rename), Search and a bunch of AI stuff. > Mozilla Social’s vision is to develop an integrated platform that empowers users through seamless communication, content discovery, curation, and sharing capabilities, enabling them to stay up-to-date, explore new perspectives, and engage within a safe and enriching experience. Define and own the technical execution of our long term ML strategy with a particular focus on developing industry leading recommender system techniques. > Mozilla’s Innovation Studio is a fast-paced organization of entrepreneurs and entrepreneurial minded individuals. We build new products and experiment quickly to improve and extend the way people access and engage on the Web. We are looking for a Senior Staff Machine Learning Engineer to help us develop and grow new machine learning driven products and tools. > The Firefox team is a community of engineers who care deeply about delivering the fastest, friendliest, most usable browser possible. We are responsible for making the things you see in the browser work securely, quickly, and well! We are looking for a Principal Engineer to help us develop and grow new machine learning driven products and tools. You will play a key role in enabling safe and healthy machine learning and AI driven experiences in Firefox. > Firefox is used by hundreds of millions worldwide and the Director of Product for Search and AI is a critical role in the product management team. The role will lead a team of PMs and be responsible for the product strategy, vision, and execution of our Search and AI investments. You’ll combine product excellence with strong leadership skills and help build a smart browser that helps our users be productive online.

ajsnigrutin 3y ago
I wish they'd stick to a browser, and keep the other stuff separate. I have no idea why every product has to grow until it's overbloated and the core functionality starts lacking behind.
- cptskippy 3y ago
  A lot of this comes down to keeping your talented folks happy so they don't look for greener pastures.
- dralley 3y ago
  The eternal HN cycle. "I can't trust Mozilla, they get too much of their income from Google" (Mozilla tries to branch out so that they're less dependent on Google) "I wish Mozilla would just stick to Firefox" (Mozilla tries to find a non-Google revenue source for Firefox) "How dare they try to monetize Firefox, the one and only product I want them to produce."
  - soderfoo 3y ago
    Was just thinking the same thing! It would be nice if those critical of Mozilla offered solutions. I agree with alot of the points raised, but I also empathize with the tough position Mozilla is in. I know squat about product management and would love to hear some knowledgeable input.
    - jemmyw 3y ago
      I've never made the exact criticisms above but I've got the solution. Taking the money from Google is fine. Stop spending it all. The CEO doesn't need an inflated salary, Mozilla is not a tech giant. Mozilla doesn't need pristine expensive offices in HCOL areas. Mozilla could pay a core group of engineers good salaries, work on Firefox and adjacent tech like servo. If they had done that and banked/invested the rest of the cash they'd have a big runway for the future. How many is core? I don't know. Not 750 though. To change course now would mean layoffs which nobody likes. But I argue they never should have hired that many folks, and to continue with that headcount is throwing good money after bad. If the purpose of the Mozilla organisation was to fund Firefox into the future then they have catastrophically failed at their job. If their purpose was to spread the money they had around to a bunch of people as quickly as possible before it runs out, whilst putting on a good face, then they've succeeded 100%
      - j16sdiz 3y ago
        Rust was a spinoff from Mozilla. It doesn't sound very "core" to me. Mozilla have a DNA of inventing their own wheel -- XPCOM was one of them
- lazide 3y ago
  Die young a hero, or live long enough to become the villain?
- heavyset_go 3y ago
  I'm cool with what they're doing. Their investment into AI yielded some cool things like on-device language translation that I use a lot in Firefox. Rust is something that grew out of their investments into programming languages/tooling/etc. Their investment into documentation and technical writing brought us MDN, which is a great resource for web development. Mozilla's development of password managers, that they eventually walked back on rolling out as an independent product, yielded a better password manager built into Firefox, as well as Firefox Verify. It's also important to make a distinction between the Mozilla Foundation, the non-profit, and Mozilla the corporation. The non-profit is responsible for many of the non-browser investments.
Aeolun 3y ago
> Senior Staff Machine Learning Engineer Double title inflation! What’s before this? Junior Staff Machine Learning Engineer?
- fabrice_d 3y ago
  That's a classic title at least in the US: Senior -> Staff -> Senior Staff -> Principal
- crossroadsguy 3y ago
  No, just lose that "Junior", it's just that. There's usually no Jr here. Or maybe this is how the order goes: Junior Staff -> Staff -> Senior Staff. No?
- marcinzm 3y ago
  Would you prefer that IC levels just ended at some point and everyone got shuffled onto the management track if they wanted further progress?
fkmzlask 3y ago
This pattern in the tech industry is getting really annoying. Imagine going to your favorite pizzeria and they keep trying to push you to buy some newspapers, clothing or car servicing, because the pizzeria executives want to fill up their resume. And I think you see that most in foundations (Wikipedia, Linux, etc.) because they have no profit motive, so the ranks get filled by hundreds of unproductive activists or parasites while the tech staff is still a tiny core and doing the actual work.

ajsnigrutin 3y ago

I wish they'd stick to a browser, and keep the other stuff separate. I have no idea why every product has to grow until it's overbloated and the core functionality starts lacking behind.

cptskippy 3y ago
A lot of this comes down to keeping your talented folks happy so they don't look for greener pastures.
dralley 3y ago
The eternal HN cycle. "I can't trust Mozilla, they get too much of their income from Google" (Mozilla tries to branch out so that they're less dependent on Google) "I wish Mozilla would just stick to Firefox" (Mozilla tries to find a non-Google revenue source for Firefox) "How dare they try to monetize Firefox, the one and only product I want them to produce."
- soderfoo 3y ago
  Was just thinking the same thing! It would be nice if those critical of Mozilla offered solutions. I agree with alot of the points raised, but I also empathize with the tough position Mozilla is in. I know squat about product management and would love to hear some knowledgeable input.
  - jemmyw 3y ago
    I've never made the exact criticisms above but I've got the solution. Taking the money from Google is fine. Stop spending it all. The CEO doesn't need an inflated salary, Mozilla is not a tech giant. Mozilla doesn't need pristine expensive offices in HCOL areas. Mozilla could pay a core group of engineers good salaries, work on Firefox and adjacent tech like servo. If they had done that and banked/invested the rest of the cash they'd have a big runway for the future. How many is core? I don't know. Not 750 though. To change course now would mean layoffs which nobody likes. But I argue they never should have hired that many folks, and to continue with that headcount is throwing good money after bad. If the purpose of the Mozilla organisation was to fund Firefox into the future then they have catastrophically failed at their job. If their purpose was to spread the money they had around to a bunch of people as quickly as possible before it runs out, whilst putting on a good face, then they've succeeded 100%
    - j16sdiz 3y ago
      Rust was a spinoff from Mozilla. It doesn't sound very "core" to me. Mozilla have a DNA of inventing their own wheel -- XPCOM was one of them
lazide 3y ago
Die young a hero, or live long enough to become the villain?
heavyset_go 3y ago
I'm cool with what they're doing. Their investment into AI yielded some cool things like on-device language translation that I use a lot in Firefox. Rust is something that grew out of their investments into programming languages/tooling/etc. Their investment into documentation and technical writing brought us MDN, which is a great resource for web development. Mozilla's development of password managers, that they eventually walked back on rolling out as an independent product, yielded a better password manager built into Firefox, as well as Firefox Verify. It's also important to make a distinction between the Mozilla Foundation, the non-profit, and Mozilla the corporation. The non-profit is responsible for many of the non-browser investments.

Aeolun 3y ago

> Senior Staff Machine Learning Engineer Double title inflation! What’s before this? Junior Staff Machine Learning Engineer?

fabrice_d 3y ago
That's a classic title at least in the US: Senior -> Staff -> Senior Staff -> Principal
crossroadsguy 3y ago
No, just lose that "Junior", it's just that. There's usually no Jr here. Or maybe this is how the order goes: Junior Staff -> Staff -> Senior Staff. No?
marcinzm 3y ago
Would you prefer that IC levels just ended at some point and everyone got shuffled onto the management track if they wanted further progress?

fkmzlask 3y ago

This pattern in the tech industry is getting really annoying. Imagine going to your favorite pizzeria and they keep trying to push you to buy some newspapers, clothing or car servicing, because the pizzeria executives want to fill up their resume. And I think you see that most in foundations (Wikipedia, Linux, etc.) because they have no profit motive, so the ranks get filled by hundreds of unproductive activists or parasites while the tech staff is still a tiny core and doing the actual work.