3 ms·

I thought (and still think) their product is a great idea. Some people here seem to think my objection was being asked to use the product. It was actually the

I thought (and still think) their product is a great idea. Some people here seem to think my objection was being asked to use the product. It was actually the content of the message I was asked to send that bothered me. It wasn't "explain how your experience would be useful in this role", or "explain your feelings on the technical aspects of this product". It was something closer to "show me how excited you are to work here". I don't know why but at the time it felt like being asked to grovel. My stupid pride, I guess.

paxys 3y ago
Well were you excited to work there? For a startup that usually matters as much or more than technical skills and experience. If the founders are giving you a significant chunk of equity in their company then they want to make sure you are in it for the right reasons, and won't bounce as soon as you reach your vesting cliff. If you think answering this simple question is a hit on your pride then yeah, you were probably not a good fit.
- zoogeny 3y ago
  It is hard to remember how I felt about the company before (as opposed to the product idea). To be even more clear, the request was explicit. Like "we are super passionate about this product here and want people who are just as passionate, send us a video showing how excited you are". I'm sure some others can't understand and I view it as a mistake. 2 minutes of performative "I can' wait to be a full stack engineer!" or "we're really going to change he world!" energy might have netted me some big payout? If I passed the interview? Who knows. It's one thing to have genuine passion for working hard, doing a great job, making a great product. There is something else in being asked to make a video performance of that. It's something like how I hate leet code. It is almost just a hoop you jump through to prove you are willing to jump through hoops. But I suppose it does provide many companies with a lot of value. And some of those companies end up exiting high. Maybe if I was less prideful I could have taken more advantage.
  - pm90 3y ago
    FWIW I don’t think of it as pride as much as setting boundaries. You understood yours and it made you uncomfortable to cross it. I personally think that’s a good thing.
tqi 3y ago
I don't feel like it's necessary to take sides on this one - seems like Loom gave you some signal on what company culture looked like on the inside, and you decided it wasn't a good match. Seems like a positive interaction/outcome for both parties?
nugget 3y ago
In my experience as a founder, excitement to work in a particular area is way more important than experience/skills. Ideally you have both. But lack of enthusiasm for a product, especially a niche product, kills a culture.
- namtab00 3y ago
  I'm excited for continuing to have a roof over my head, food in my belly, and maybe something extra for retirement... I find that the expectation of "excitement" from your developers is truly absurd.
  - pm90 3y ago
    Yeah… this is the biggest red flag for me. Yes startups are all about building great products that users will love. But that love should be organic and authentic, not blind belief. I suspect that this expectation is likely because most startups are actually bullshit products. Look at all the dumbass crypto startups and now the AI startups. Its become an institution that churns out crap so you need to be able to delude yourself into believing the nonsense to keep doing it repeatedly.
notJim 3y ago
At a startup, you need people who are excited to make the product a success, not just someone who's gonna churn through tickets and tick off boxes. They were probably looking to see if you were going to commit at that level. Totally get why this rubs some people the wrong way, but probably just means it's not a good fit.
1123581321 3y ago
I’m sure they didn’t mean to give you that impression. That’s a good lesson for people making these requests. If the CEO had worded it more evenly (“send me a Loom about what interests you in working for Loom”) you might’ve sent one in, and the people who wanted to demonstrate sheer enthusiasm to maximally fulfill the request still would’ve. (Also, I still think you didn’t much like the product… :) )

paxys 3y ago

Well were you excited to work there? For a startup that usually matters as much or more than technical skills and experience. If the founders are giving you a significant chunk of equity in their company then they want to make sure you are in it for the right reasons, and won't bounce as soon as you reach your vesting cliff. If you think answering this simple question is a hit on your pride then yeah, you were probably not a good fit.

zoogeny 3y ago
It is hard to remember how I felt about the company before (as opposed to the product idea). To be even more clear, the request was explicit. Like "we are super passionate about this product here and want people who are just as passionate, send us a video showing how excited you are". I'm sure some others can't understand and I view it as a mistake. 2 minutes of performative "I can' wait to be a full stack engineer!" or "we're really going to change he world!" energy might have netted me some big payout? If I passed the interview? Who knows. It's one thing to have genuine passion for working hard, doing a great job, making a great product. There is something else in being asked to make a video performance of that. It's something like how I hate leet code. It is almost just a hoop you jump through to prove you are willing to jump through hoops. But I suppose it does provide many companies with a lot of value. And some of those companies end up exiting high. Maybe if I was less prideful I could have taken more advantage.
- pm90 3y ago
  FWIW I don’t think of it as pride as much as setting boundaries. You understood yours and it made you uncomfortable to cross it. I personally think that’s a good thing.

tqi 3y ago

I don't feel like it's necessary to take sides on this one - seems like Loom gave you some signal on what company culture looked like on the inside, and you decided it wasn't a good match. Seems like a positive interaction/outcome for both parties?

nugget 3y ago

In my experience as a founder, excitement to work in a particular area is way more important than experience/skills. Ideally you have both. But lack of enthusiasm for a product, especially a niche product, kills a culture.

namtab00 3y ago
I'm excited for continuing to have a roof over my head, food in my belly, and maybe something extra for retirement... I find that the expectation of "excitement" from your developers is truly absurd.
- pm90 3y ago
  Yeah… this is the biggest red flag for me. Yes startups are all about building great products that users will love. But that love should be organic and authentic, not blind belief. I suspect that this expectation is likely because most startups are actually bullshit products. Look at all the dumbass crypto startups and now the AI startups. Its become an institution that churns out crap so you need to be able to delude yourself into believing the nonsense to keep doing it repeatedly.

notJim 3y ago

At a startup, you need people who are excited to make the product a success, not just someone who's gonna churn through tickets and tick off boxes. They were probably looking to see if you were going to commit at that level. Totally get why this rubs some people the wrong way, but probably just means it's not a good fit.

1123581321 3y ago

I’m sure they didn’t mean to give you that impression. That’s a good lesson for people making these requests. If the CEO had worded it more evenly (“send me a Loom about what interests you in working for Loom”) you might’ve sent one in, and the people who wanted to demonstrate sheer enthusiasm to maximally fulfill the request still would’ve. (Also, I still think you didn’t much like the product… :) )