5 ms·

Well, this guy didn't become a legend by accident, that's for sure ! Reading this log, I can't stop thinking how clear things needed to be in his head to advan

Well, this guy didn't become a legend by accident, that's for sure ! Reading this log, I can't stop thinking how clear things needed to be in his head to advance at that pace. Like he already had everything programmed in his mind, he was just transcribing it for the computer.

beebeepka 3y ago
Isn't that what programming is like? I guess the main challenge is to avoid lying to yourself by downplaying stuff that is problematic.
- Jiocus 3y ago
  The hard part is knowing what parts -and why- you need to load into your head, so work can even begin.
- userbinator 3y ago
  Some are like this, and others tend to have more of a "mess around and try things until it works" style. In fact I've noticed a lot more programmers in the latter category than the former.
  - asalahli 3y ago
    Edsger Dijkstra calls it Mozart vs Beethoven style of programming in an interview. https://youtu.be/-Uae9_pgZzE https://youtu.be/-Uae9_pgZzE
  - tjpnz 3y ago
    Can the former even exist today?
beachy 3y ago
I looked at one of the work logs. Thought "that's a fair amount to get done in a week". Then realised it was just one day. Man is a machine!
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  He said he works 13h days.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - voytec 3y ago
    Final log excerpt: > Vacation? I don't need a vacation!
    - markus_zhang 3y ago
      Or maybe: I'm having vacations every day!
- anonymoose33282 3y ago
  Sometimes I wish I could go back to the 90s (or even early/mid 2000s) just for a day to remember what that vacuum of "stuff to do" in every day life was like. I lived it, I remember "being bored" or having "nothing to do", but I truly can't access it in a meaningful way. I would love to go back to those days of playing games or engaging in my hobbies where I didn't feel that constant pressure of "but you better get stuff done, we don't have all day here".
loa_in_ 3y ago
I can't help but notice that the days are continuous, with not many (two day) gaps in between.
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  It was a start-up where he was a founder and major shareholder, and Quake was his own pet project, so of course he worked nearly 7 days/week. Not only was the future of the company at stake but he also enjoyed doing it. Then AAA game studios saw this and thought that game devs just love working 7 days/week for peanuts even if it's on other people's companies and other people's projects.
  - shortrounddev2 3y ago
    > Not only was the future of the company at stake but he also enjoyed doing it. The business concerns were not a major factor for Carmack. He was against expanding the business and the company was making plenty of money with a lot of cash to spare. They had other projects other than Quake that were making them money. Had he really cared about the health of the business, he wouldn't have lashed out so much at other developers working on things other than Quake. He simply thought the company should basically work on one project at a time.
- chandler5555 3y ago
  found more of his logs by googling and my favorite is that he worked on xmas and new years eve in 1997. impressive focus
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
marginalia_nu 3y ago
I used to have a somewhat similar system, basically just a stack/heap system where I'd push/pop one list into another list of dated completed items, and I think I fairly often ended up with a huge volume of points. It gets momentum and is self-reinforcing, the practice of jotting down unrelated threads you come up with makes them easy to pick up later, so you always have stack of problems to attack without having any of them cluttering your head as you execute. Often when I'm not doing stuff, it's because I don't have a clear picture of what I should do next, or how to do the next thing. This is not a problem I had working like this. It was all execution.
onetimeuse92304 3y ago
I understand this will not explain entirety of it, but when you concentrate responsibility, decision making and ability to do all things through entirety of the application, you can move much, much faster than what all of us are used to working for regular companies. It almost feels, and sometimes is cheating. I was confronted with this when I felt really fantastic being super productive at one of the projects and then a team member pointed out that I am also tech lead, architect and a manager all in one and I simply don't work by the same rules as everybody else. Where everybody else has to get permissions, approvals, concensus, inputs, has to wait for other people to do things, I can just do it all in my head and act immediately. This taught me an important lesson and I am now much more conscious of this fact and spending way more time trying to remove any barriers from other team members. This also explains why solo developers can sometimes achieve so much -- they simply don't have to work with anybody else. They don't have to understand code somebody else designed and wrote. They don't have to spend time arguing defending their approach or solutions. They know how everything works and can make all decisions solely on whether it helps them to achieve the result. Synchronising with other people is a huge overhead in any organisation.
shortrounddev2 3y ago
That's sort of the myth behind the guy, but from Romero's account in Doom Guy, Carmack was pushing himself to the limit. He didn't sleep, he didn't take breaks, and he frequently rewrote things that other engineers wrote from scratch. While his code was great, his faculties as an employee and manager greatly suffered. He started lashing out at other developers and became an utter tyrant of a boss when he began to perceive that the lack of similar effort on behalf of other developers was unfair. I think he really struggled with Quake 1, especially since he had to teach himself all the math required, having no background in math

beebeepka 3y ago

Isn't that what programming is like? I guess the main challenge is to avoid lying to yourself by downplaying stuff that is problematic.

Jiocus 3y ago
The hard part is knowing what parts -and why- you need to load into your head, so work can even begin.
userbinator 3y ago
Some are like this, and others tend to have more of a "mess around and try things until it works" style. In fact I've noticed a lot more programmers in the latter category than the former.
- asalahli 3y ago
  Edsger Dijkstra calls it Mozart vs Beethoven style of programming in an interview. https://youtu.be/-Uae9_pgZzE https://youtu.be/-Uae9_pgZzE
- tjpnz 3y ago
  Can the former even exist today?

beachy 3y ago

I looked at one of the work logs. Thought "that's a fair amount to get done in a week". Then realised it was just one day. Man is a machine!

FirmwareBurner 3y ago
He said he works 13h days.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- voytec 3y ago
  Final log excerpt: > Vacation? I don't need a vacation!
  - markus_zhang 3y ago
    Or maybe: I'm having vacations every day!
anonymoose33282 3y ago
Sometimes I wish I could go back to the 90s (or even early/mid 2000s) just for a day to remember what that vacuum of "stuff to do" in every day life was like. I lived it, I remember "being bored" or having "nothing to do", but I truly can't access it in a meaningful way. I would love to go back to those days of playing games or engaging in my hobbies where I didn't feel that constant pressure of "but you better get stuff done, we don't have all day here".

loa_in_ 3y ago

I can't help but notice that the days are continuous, with not many (two day) gaps in between.

FirmwareBurner 3y ago
It was a start-up where he was a founder and major shareholder, and Quake was his own pet project, so of course he worked nearly 7 days/week. Not only was the future of the company at stake but he also enjoyed doing it. Then AAA game studios saw this and thought that game devs just love working 7 days/week for peanuts even if it's on other people's companies and other people's projects.
- shortrounddev2 3y ago
  > Not only was the future of the company at stake but he also enjoyed doing it. The business concerns were not a major factor for Carmack. He was against expanding the business and the company was making plenty of money with a lot of cash to spare. They had other projects other than Quake that were making them money. Had he really cared about the health of the business, he wouldn't have lashed out so much at other developers working on things other than Quake. He simply thought the company should basically work on one project at a time.
chandler5555 3y ago
found more of his logs by googling and my favorite is that he worked on xmas and new years eve in 1997. impressive focus
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

marginalia_nu 3y ago

I used to have a somewhat similar system, basically just a stack/heap system where I'd push/pop one list into another list of dated completed items, and I think I fairly often ended up with a huge volume of points. It gets momentum and is self-reinforcing, the practice of jotting down unrelated threads you come up with makes them easy to pick up later, so you always have stack of problems to attack without having any of them cluttering your head as you execute. Often when I'm not doing stuff, it's because I don't have a clear picture of what I should do next, or how to do the next thing. This is not a problem I had working like this. It was all execution.

onetimeuse92304 3y ago

I understand this will not explain entirety of it, but when you concentrate responsibility, decision making and ability to do all things through entirety of the application, you can move much, much faster than what all of us are used to working for regular companies. It almost feels, and sometimes is cheating. I was confronted with this when I felt really fantastic being super productive at one of the projects and then a team member pointed out that I am also tech lead, architect and a manager all in one and I simply don't work by the same rules as everybody else. Where everybody else has to get permissions, approvals, concensus, inputs, has to wait for other people to do things, I can just do it all in my head and act immediately. This taught me an important lesson and I am now much more conscious of this fact and spending way more time trying to remove any barriers from other team members. This also explains why solo developers can sometimes achieve so much -- they simply don't have to work with anybody else. They don't have to understand code somebody else designed and wrote. They don't have to spend time arguing defending their approach or solutions. They know how everything works and can make all decisions solely on whether it helps them to achieve the result. Synchronising with other people is a huge overhead in any organisation.

shortrounddev2 3y ago

That's sort of the myth behind the guy, but from Romero's account in Doom Guy, Carmack was pushing himself to the limit. He didn't sleep, he didn't take breaks, and he frequently rewrote things that other engineers wrote from scratch. While his code was great, his faculties as an employee and manager greatly suffered. He started lashing out at other developers and became an utter tyrant of a boss when he began to perceive that the lack of similar effort on behalf of other developers was unfair. I think he really struggled with Quake 1, especially since he had to teach himself all the math required, having no background in math