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The next general elections are due to take place by the end of January 2025, so probably next year, and he has started campainging. He knows that "15-minute ci

The next general elections are due to take place by the end of January 2025, so probably next year, and he has started campainging. He knows that "15-minute cities" are not popular so he is using it. Frankly, a number of local councils have given a bad image to the concept and that's a shame but they have only themselves to blame. I am sure that most people would actually like 15-minute cities but councils are not doing that at all, they are only restricting cars and so many people are not happy. In any case, it's utopian (or dystopian) to think that people will be able to work within 15 minutes of their home unless we implement a collectivist-style management of employment and housing. But at least there should be investment in moving healthcare, schools, shops within 15 minutes, then they can start discouraging cars...

323231ff 3y ago
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- hgomersall 3y ago
  This is the natural consequence of 50 years of car centric urban design. It turns out there's a limit on how many cars you can fit into a limited space. It's not policy that hates cars but geometry: https://thewaroncars.org/transcript-episode-79-the-end-of-uber-with-cory-doctorow/ https://thewaroncars.org/transcript-episode-79-the-end-of-ub...
  - 323231ff 3y ago
    [flagged]
DoughnutHole 3y ago
It only seems utopian if your main experience of cities is car-centric sprawl. In Amsterdam the average commute is under 25 minutes. But the average for bicyclists and motorcyclists (who make up ~50% of commuters) is ~15 minutes. For pedestrians and tram riders it’s ~25 minutes. Cars, trains and buses have the worst journeys of 40-50 minutes, but they’re travelling much greater distances (because if you live close you have better options). Source: https://www.numbeo.com/traffic/in/Amsterdam https://www.numbeo.com/traffic/in/Amsterdam We’re not going to get everyone’s commute down to 15 minutes, but Dutch cities demonstrate that you can get huge swaths of the urban population using active travel and public transport with intelligent planning. The Netherlands aren’t even anti-car - they have one of the densest motorway networks in the world. Cars are just deprioritised in the cities.
- mytailorisrich 3y ago
  > It only seems utopian if your main experience of cities is car-centric sprawl. Not really. There is no way most people can walk or cycle to work within 15 minutes as a rule. This has nothing to do with being "car-centric" but rather the consequence of life: You live here, you find a job there, your spouse finds a job over there.
  - DoughnutHole 3y ago
    The average family isn't that spread out in their work-life habits as you make out. Most cities have an urban core where most commercial enterprises are, and most people commute into that area. The vast majority of Dublin City Council (population ~600,000) is <15 minutes away from the city centre by bicycle. As such most people are within a 15 minute journey of most places of business that they could need, and most workplaces. Little work has been put in to make it this way, it's just a consequence of being an old, dense urban core. By contrast, people who live in the surrounding suburbs have woeful commutes that only make sense by car. This is a consequence of building sprawling cities - it's not some innate fact of life. Developing dense cores that people commute to from relatively nearby areas results in short commutes for most people and makes active travel feasible. One core serving an ever expanding catchment area results in long commutes pushes people into cars. Regardless, the main point of "15-minute cities" isn't to solve everyone's existing commute. It's to develop areas so that all essential services are available by active travel. It's to make shopping, education, healthcare, businesses and leisure accessible so everyone has the option to conduct their life with less travel, as opposed to a model where a vehicle is strictly necessary.
    - mytailorisrich 3y ago
      It is extremely common for families to be that spread out since the average commute time in the UK is about 30 minutes each way and more than 10 miles. > It's to develop areas so that all essential services are available by active travel. It's to make shopping, education, healthcare, businesses and leisure will be accessible so everyone has the option to conduct their life with less travel, as opposed to a model where a vehicle is strictly necessary. Correct, and the point is that you don't achieve that by restricting cars. You do by moving those services nearer to people.

323231ff 3y ago

[flagged]

hgomersall 3y ago
This is the natural consequence of 50 years of car centric urban design. It turns out there's a limit on how many cars you can fit into a limited space. It's not policy that hates cars but geometry: https://thewaroncars.org/transcript-episode-79-the-end-of-uber-with-cory-doctorow/ https://thewaroncars.org/transcript-episode-79-the-end-of-ub...
- 323231ff 3y ago
  [flagged]

DoughnutHole 3y ago

It only seems utopian if your main experience of cities is car-centric sprawl. In Amsterdam the average commute is under 25 minutes. But the average for bicyclists and motorcyclists (who make up ~50% of commuters) is ~15 minutes. For pedestrians and tram riders it’s ~25 minutes. Cars, trains and buses have the worst journeys of 40-50 minutes, but they’re travelling much greater distances (because if you live close you have better options). Source: https://www.numbeo.com/traffic/in/Amsterdam https://www.numbeo.com/traffic/in/Amsterdam We’re not going to get everyone’s commute down to 15 minutes, but Dutch cities demonstrate that you can get huge swaths of the urban population using active travel and public transport with intelligent planning. The Netherlands aren’t even anti-car - they have one of the densest motorway networks in the world. Cars are just deprioritised in the cities.

mytailorisrich 3y ago
> It only seems utopian if your main experience of cities is car-centric sprawl. Not really. There is no way most people can walk or cycle to work within 15 minutes as a rule. This has nothing to do with being "car-centric" but rather the consequence of life: You live here, you find a job there, your spouse finds a job over there.
- DoughnutHole 3y ago
  The average family isn't that spread out in their work-life habits as you make out. Most cities have an urban core where most commercial enterprises are, and most people commute into that area. The vast majority of Dublin City Council (population ~600,000) is <15 minutes away from the city centre by bicycle. As such most people are within a 15 minute journey of most places of business that they could need, and most workplaces. Little work has been put in to make it this way, it's just a consequence of being an old, dense urban core. By contrast, people who live in the surrounding suburbs have woeful commutes that only make sense by car. This is a consequence of building sprawling cities - it's not some innate fact of life. Developing dense cores that people commute to from relatively nearby areas results in short commutes for most people and makes active travel feasible. One core serving an ever expanding catchment area results in long commutes pushes people into cars. Regardless, the main point of "15-minute cities" isn't to solve everyone's existing commute. It's to develop areas so that all essential services are available by active travel. It's to make shopping, education, healthcare, businesses and leisure accessible so everyone has the option to conduct their life with less travel, as opposed to a model where a vehicle is strictly necessary.
  - mytailorisrich 3y ago
    It is extremely common for families to be that spread out since the average commute time in the UK is about 30 minutes each way and more than 10 miles. > It's to develop areas so that all essential services are available by active travel. It's to make shopping, education, healthcare, businesses and leisure will be accessible so everyone has the option to conduct their life with less travel, as opposed to a model where a vehicle is strictly necessary. Correct, and the point is that you don't achieve that by restricting cars. You do by moving those services nearer to people.