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It's not that simple. If it were simple, no-one would struggle. Overeating is usually a psychological issue.

tiffanyh 3y ago
It’s typically not psychological. It’s more likely to be a function of people not knowing how many calories are in food. Eg, a salad from Chick Fila A might sound healthy, but it’s actually 850 calories. That’s nearly 1/2 of your daily intake. https://www.chick-fil-a.com/menu/cobb-salad https://www.chick-fil-a.com/menu/cobb-salad It’s also the same reason why schools in the US removed soda machines because it was a contributing factor to child obesity.
- doix 3y ago
  > It’s more likely to be a function of people not knowing how many calories are in food. I strongly doubt it. In the UK, they put the amount of calories pretty much everywhere and there is still a obesity problem.
- peterashford 3y ago
  This is just not true. Plenty of people who explicitly count calories still struggle to lose weight.
  - tiffanyh 3y ago
    That can’t be possible. Energy in = energy out More likely, people are underestimating the calories they are consuming, or are cheating.
    - Hermitian909 3y ago
      I think you misunderstand the failure mode. How do you measure calories out? Is that number static? How does it change over time? My father is obese, and has been for many years. At the weight he usually hovers at, his BMR appears to be ~2,500 calories. He can lose weight from here no problem eating ~1600 calories a day, not easy, but not to hard. The problem is, that after about 15 lbs of weightloss, he plateaus. Dexafit scans confirm there's been a massive reduction in BMR. By the time he's dropped 20 lbs his calorie counts generally need to be in the 1200s to lose weight, which is just torturous. The longest he ever last at these really low calorie counts was probably a year, I'm significantly smaller fitter than he is and I could not have lived a productive life on the diet he was eating. I'm not sure how common this kind of response is, but his doctor's didn't seem to think it uncommon.
      - willcipriano 3y ago
        > At the weight he usually hovers at, his BMR appears to be ~2,500 calories. He can lose weight from here no problem eating ~1600 calories a day, not easy, but not to hard. So he is something like 60, sedentary, 5 foot 10 and 280 pounds. That results in a estimated TDEE (BMR plus accounting for calorie burn of basic life activities) of 2504 calories per day.[0] > By the time he's dropped 20 lbs his calorie counts generally need to be in the 1200s to lose weight In this scenario that would drop his TDEE to 2395 calories per day. At 1200 calories a day, if those numbers are correct should see at least 2 pounds a week of weight loss. If he is maintaining, check your priors. He is either overcounting exercise, over estimating TDEE or under counting what he eats. If you have weights and accurate calorie counts you can extrapolate his TDEE from that and know exactly what deficit to eat at. [0]https://tdeecalculator.net/ https://tdeecalculator.net/
        Schiendelman 3y ago
        It also doesn’t sound like he has to drop to 1200 cals to lose weight! More like 1500-1700.
        Hermitian909 3y ago
        > In this scenario that would drop his TDEE to 2395 calories per day. This is what naive calculations say, this is not what a DEXA scan says. His body is actively reducing calorie expendature well below what you would expect. I have tried taking over his calorie counting for a week to help him, as someone who manages my own weight successfully I don't think I would overcount by a factor of 2. The chance he ate calories I was unaware of during that week is approximately zero (highly controlled environment, never left apartment)
        willcipriano 3y ago
        He needs to go into a whole body calorimeter[0] to prove it if what you say is true. It will be a world first. [0]https://www.uhcw.nhs.uk/leading-research/about-us/our-facilities/human-metabolism-research-unit-hmru/our-facilities/whole-body-calorimeter/ https://www.uhcw.nhs.uk/leading-research/about-us/our-facili...
    - yungporko 3y ago
      people aren't stupid, the amount of calories in food is mostly readily available and it isn't hard to avoid the cases where you can't tell. the problem is that getting fat is virtually a one way process without medical intervention. there is a reason that almost no fat people ever reach a healthy weight again, and almost none of the ones that do stay that way for more than 5 years. of course you can lose the weight by eating less, and also water is wet. the problem is that once you become fat, you have the appetite of a fat person. forever. of course you can diet and exercise your way back to a healthy weight, but you will be hungry forever. except for a exceptionally small percentage of outliers, humans cannot psychologically keep up that level of constant discomfort and discipline indefinitely when the solution is in the fridge just a few steps away. imagine telling an heroin addict to "just do less heroin" when their house is full of heroin, people are constantly doing heroin around them, and they have no choice but to take small amounts of heroin three times a day or they die. except for a very small handful of people who are wired differently, it just isn't something you can reasonably expect a person to achieve.
    - peterashford 3y ago
      It bloody well is possible. I've done it myself.
- nradov 3y ago
  The numbers vary a lot by individual. For me it would be closer to ¼ of my daily intake.
- paulpauper 3y ago
  yeah but knowing what % of that 850 calories will be stored as fat or metabolized is the hard part and changes. obese ppl tend to store too many calories as fat due to bad genetics and other factors but are hungry all the time too...a combination that assures weight gain. People with better genetics are able to to eat to fullness without becoming obese because metabolism rises to accommodate surplus calories. That was the case for me. I ate 4-5k calories a day and never got above 190 for well over 15 years despite little exercise and being around 5'8. Other ppl could easily got to 300+ lbs on that diet. I would have jack in box for breakfast, panda express for lunch, and full dinner. plus lots of soda and snacks. It's all genes, in the end. It’s also the same reason why schools in the US removed soda machines because it was a contributing factor to child obesity. if only that was the only place to buy soda
raincom 3y ago
it is physiological, mostly triggered by signals (messed up hormones).

It’s typically not psychological. It’s more likely to be a function of people not knowing how many calories are in food. Eg, a salad from Chick Fila A might sound healthy, but it’s actually 850 calories. That’s nearly 1/2 of your daily intake. https://www.chick-fil-a.com/menu/cobb-salad https://www.chick-fil-a.com/menu/cobb-salad It’s also the same reason why schools in the US removed soda machines because it was a contributing factor to child obesity.

doix 3y ago
> It’s more likely to be a function of people not knowing how many calories are in food. I strongly doubt it. In the UK, they put the amount of calories pretty much everywhere and there is still a obesity problem.
peterashford 3y ago
This is just not true. Plenty of people who explicitly count calories still struggle to lose weight.
- tiffanyh 3y ago
  That can’t be possible. Energy in = energy out More likely, people are underestimating the calories they are consuming, or are cheating.
  - Hermitian909 3y ago
    I think you misunderstand the failure mode. How do you measure calories out? Is that number static? How does it change over time? My father is obese, and has been for many years. At the weight he usually hovers at, his BMR appears to be ~2,500 calories. He can lose weight from here no problem eating ~1600 calories a day, not easy, but not to hard. The problem is, that after about 15 lbs of weightloss, he plateaus. Dexafit scans confirm there's been a massive reduction in BMR. By the time he's dropped 20 lbs his calorie counts generally need to be in the 1200s to lose weight, which is just torturous. The longest he ever last at these really low calorie counts was probably a year, I'm significantly smaller fitter than he is and I could not have lived a productive life on the diet he was eating. I'm not sure how common this kind of response is, but his doctor's didn't seem to think it uncommon.
    - willcipriano 3y ago
      > At the weight he usually hovers at, his BMR appears to be ~2,500 calories. He can lose weight from here no problem eating ~1600 calories a day, not easy, but not to hard. So he is something like 60, sedentary, 5 foot 10 and 280 pounds. That results in a estimated TDEE (BMR plus accounting for calorie burn of basic life activities) of 2504 calories per day.[0] > By the time he's dropped 20 lbs his calorie counts generally need to be in the 1200s to lose weight In this scenario that would drop his TDEE to 2395 calories per day. At 1200 calories a day, if those numbers are correct should see at least 2 pounds a week of weight loss. If he is maintaining, check your priors. He is either overcounting exercise, over estimating TDEE or under counting what he eats. If you have weights and accurate calorie counts you can extrapolate his TDEE from that and know exactly what deficit to eat at. [0]https://tdeecalculator.net/ https://tdeecalculator.net/
      - Schiendelman 3y ago
        It also doesn’t sound like he has to drop to 1200 cals to lose weight! More like 1500-1700.
      - Hermitian909 3y ago
        > In this scenario that would drop his TDEE to 2395 calories per day. This is what naive calculations say, this is not what a DEXA scan says. His body is actively reducing calorie expendature well below what you would expect. I have tried taking over his calorie counting for a week to help him, as someone who manages my own weight successfully I don't think I would overcount by a factor of 2. The chance he ate calories I was unaware of during that week is approximately zero (highly controlled environment, never left apartment)
        willcipriano 3y ago
        He needs to go into a whole body calorimeter[0] to prove it if what you say is true. It will be a world first. [0]https://www.uhcw.nhs.uk/leading-research/about-us/our-facilities/human-metabolism-research-unit-hmru/our-facilities/whole-body-calorimeter/ https://www.uhcw.nhs.uk/leading-research/about-us/our-facili...
  - yungporko 3y ago
    people aren't stupid, the amount of calories in food is mostly readily available and it isn't hard to avoid the cases where you can't tell. the problem is that getting fat is virtually a one way process without medical intervention. there is a reason that almost no fat people ever reach a healthy weight again, and almost none of the ones that do stay that way for more than 5 years. of course you can lose the weight by eating less, and also water is wet. the problem is that once you become fat, you have the appetite of a fat person. forever. of course you can diet and exercise your way back to a healthy weight, but you will be hungry forever. except for a exceptionally small percentage of outliers, humans cannot psychologically keep up that level of constant discomfort and discipline indefinitely when the solution is in the fridge just a few steps away. imagine telling an heroin addict to "just do less heroin" when their house is full of heroin, people are constantly doing heroin around them, and they have no choice but to take small amounts of heroin three times a day or they die. except for a very small handful of people who are wired differently, it just isn't something you can reasonably expect a person to achieve.
  - peterashford 3y ago
    It bloody well is possible. I've done it myself.
nradov 3y ago
The numbers vary a lot by individual. For me it would be closer to ¼ of my daily intake.
paulpauper 3y ago
yeah but knowing what % of that 850 calories will be stored as fat or metabolized is the hard part and changes. obese ppl tend to store too many calories as fat due to bad genetics and other factors but are hungry all the time too...a combination that assures weight gain. People with better genetics are able to to eat to fullness without becoming obese because metabolism rises to accommodate surplus calories. That was the case for me. I ate 4-5k calories a day and never got above 190 for well over 15 years despite little exercise and being around 5'8. Other ppl could easily got to 300+ lbs on that diet. I would have jack in box for breakfast, panda express for lunch, and full dinner. plus lots of soda and snacks. It's all genes, in the end. It’s also the same reason why schools in the US removed soda machines because it was a contributing factor to child obesity. if only that was the only place to buy soda

raincom 3y ago

it is physiological, mostly triggered by signals (messed up hormones).