3 ms·

They have a pitch deck lamenting 90% of US adults have cavities, and they are 2x likely to get untreated if you are poor, then propose to market this for 20k$/d

They have a pitch deck lamenting 90% of US adults have cavities, and they are 2x likely to get untreated if you are poor, then propose to market this for 20k$/dose. Saving the world, again, startup style.

boredpeter 3y ago
$20k per dose Jesus H Christ. Rent seeking galore. Hopefully the patent has run out by now and others can get in on the action and make it affordable. There’s no way in hell this could possibly cost $20k. Is capitalism ever going to produce innovation that’s affordable to regular people again and not just benefiting the profiteering VC parasite class?
- malermeister 3y ago
  The patent has expired. The whole pitch here is to modify the tech a bit so they can patent it again and charge 20k/dose.
- tptacek 3y ago
  I'm not going to say I buy any of this or that I think it's a good pitch, but you see these numbers for new treatments because the math doesn't work out for the go-to-market without them. When the product is established, the price goes down.
- jefftk 3y ago
  > Hopefully the patent has run out by now and others can get in on the action and make it affordable. The patent has run out, and in the ~20y since it expired no one has tried to revive the idea. Why are you faulting the people who are finally picking the idea back up instead of all the people who could have but didn't over the last ~20y?
  - boredpeter 3y ago
    I’m faulting them because it’s nothing more than a get rich quick scheme. Another comment even noted they are slightly tweaking it so they can get another patent for it. The government should be funding this and making it available to the general population at an affordable price instead of just having the free market “figure it out” and making something affordable only to the ultra rich. But the US is a country where the government isn’t allowed to do anything and everything has to be left to the free market which nowadays is nothing more than a bunch of hyper capitalistic rent seekers that are only interested in maximizing profit at the expense of everyone else.
    - astrange 3y ago
      If they want to pay for it they can, but the most effective way for public healthcare to reduce costs is by not paying for expensive things.
    - jefftk 3y ago
      The impression I have from your comment is that you think that the US is unusually bad at this? Which seems a bit hard to square with no other country having sorted out a caries vaccine either. Including many rich countries with socialized medicine.
- karaterobot 3y ago
  > Is capitalism ever going to produce innovation that’s affordable to regular people again and not just benefiting the profiteering VC parasite class? No way, those capitalist parasites will never make anything affordable. Sent from my iPhone On an IKEA sofa Drinking coffee from another hemisphere
  - justsomehnguy 3y ago
    Hardware sales are not the primary revenue stream for Apple, it's services. Would iPhone be the same if there was no need to sell iCloud and iTunes?
jey 3y ago
This is a well established route for new tech: first start by selling to the early adopters who have extra motivation and extra money, then use those funds to lower the costs by increasing scale then reach a bigger market.
- imjonse 3y ago
  but they say this is old tech, with exprired patents, with some confusing 'Pfizer offered to buy it' and no extra details. To me it seems they mostly want VC money from those who would bet on something unproven if the potential market is huge. For a lot of non-software new tech you at least have a visible research group and at least some attempts at presenting peer reviewed papers.
SCSIfloppy 3y ago
[flagged]
unsupp0rted 3y ago
It’s only 20k$/dose for the first family member. Once they establish the new biome you can borrow their toothbrush for a dose.

boredpeter 3y ago

$20k per dose Jesus H Christ. Rent seeking galore. Hopefully the patent has run out by now and others can get in on the action and make it affordable. There’s no way in hell this could possibly cost $20k. Is capitalism ever going to produce innovation that’s affordable to regular people again and not just benefiting the profiteering VC parasite class?

malermeister 3y ago
The patent has expired. The whole pitch here is to modify the tech a bit so they can patent it again and charge 20k/dose.
tptacek 3y ago
I'm not going to say I buy any of this or that I think it's a good pitch, but you see these numbers for new treatments because the math doesn't work out for the go-to-market without them. When the product is established, the price goes down.
jefftk 3y ago
> Hopefully the patent has run out by now and others can get in on the action and make it affordable. The patent has run out, and in the ~20y since it expired no one has tried to revive the idea. Why are you faulting the people who are finally picking the idea back up instead of all the people who could have but didn't over the last ~20y?
- boredpeter 3y ago
  I’m faulting them because it’s nothing more than a get rich quick scheme. Another comment even noted they are slightly tweaking it so they can get another patent for it. The government should be funding this and making it available to the general population at an affordable price instead of just having the free market “figure it out” and making something affordable only to the ultra rich. But the US is a country where the government isn’t allowed to do anything and everything has to be left to the free market which nowadays is nothing more than a bunch of hyper capitalistic rent seekers that are only interested in maximizing profit at the expense of everyone else.
  - astrange 3y ago
    If they want to pay for it they can, but the most effective way for public healthcare to reduce costs is by not paying for expensive things.
  - jefftk 3y ago
    The impression I have from your comment is that you think that the US is unusually bad at this? Which seems a bit hard to square with no other country having sorted out a caries vaccine either. Including many rich countries with socialized medicine.
karaterobot 3y ago
> Is capitalism ever going to produce innovation that’s affordable to regular people again and not just benefiting the profiteering VC parasite class? No way, those capitalist parasites will never make anything affordable. Sent from my iPhone On an IKEA sofa Drinking coffee from another hemisphere
- justsomehnguy 3y ago
  Hardware sales are not the primary revenue stream for Apple, it's services. Would iPhone be the same if there was no need to sell iCloud and iTunes?

jey 3y ago

This is a well established route for new tech: first start by selling to the early adopters who have extra motivation and extra money, then use those funds to lower the costs by increasing scale then reach a bigger market.

imjonse 3y ago
but they say this is old tech, with exprired patents, with some confusing 'Pfizer offered to buy it' and no extra details. To me it seems they mostly want VC money from those who would bet on something unproven if the potential market is huge. For a lot of non-software new tech you at least have a visible research group and at least some attempts at presenting peer reviewed papers.

SCSIfloppy 3y ago

[flagged]

unsupp0rted 3y ago

It’s only 20k$/dose for the first family member. Once they establish the new biome you can borrow their toothbrush for a dose.