4 ms·

I think that the author is a little mixed up and is /actually/ saying that 'Reading is Objectively Superior to Listening as a Communication Method'. Writing !=

by tekacs 3y ago

I think that the author is a little mixed up and is /actually/ saying that 'Reading is Objectively Superior to Listening as a Communication Method'. Writing != Reading and as someone building an app powered by dictation that turns speech into text for the reader to consume... speaking is fast, reliable and powerful and reading is fast, reliable and powerful. On the other hand typing (especially on mobile, but even on desktop) doesn't share these qualities nearly as much in the general populace, even if some of us are good at it -- and hand-writing is even worse (although it's arguably a more powerful communication method). Listening is also pretty bad and you can see for example Matter's recent release of podcast transcription as a great example of making things easy to consume and easy to produce.

paulpauper 3y ago
listening is good for multitasking . both formats have pros and cons. you can listen to a book in the car for example.
- hotnfresh 3y ago
  Listening requires so much focus from me that if I try to multitask I’ll just realize, after a span of seconds to minutes, that I’ve not heard a single word that was said. It’ll happen again as soon as I pick the multitasking back up. May as well read or watch a video. Same focus required either way. Though I do think I’m unusual. Basically can’t enjoy podcasts the way most people do, which is a bummer. In hindsight, the high school calculus teacher who forced us to take notes while they lectured, and got upset if you stopped, was not setting me up for success. I’d get to the end with a bunch of notes but having understood nothing I heard, because I was too busy transcribing to actually listen. I knew she was messing me up at the time and what I needed to be able to do to succeed, but it took me years to realize it’s a general problem I have. Can’t take information in unless my attention is undivided.
  - jackthetab 3y ago
    I guess we're both "unusual" then.
  - paulpauper 3y ago
    most podcasts suck because they are full of ads and filler.
  - xeonmc 3y ago
    Like Feynman once discovered how different people have different processing architectures, just from the simple act of counting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj4y0EUlU-Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj4y0EUlU-Y
    - RoyalHenOil 3y ago
      That is very interesting. I am like Fenyman in this regard: counting internally is verbal, while reading is visual. I can count, recite the ABCs, sing, etc., while reading, just so long as I have it sufficiently well memorized that I can do it mindlessly. (I can't read and also actively think about something else. The reading takes up all of my thought process.) I would be curious to know if Fenyman experienced an internal monologue while he was thinking. I do not (my internal verbalizing is basically limited to recalling information that I've memorized rote), and I've often wondered if this is why I am adept at reading without verbalizing.
  - RoyalHenOil 3y ago
    Some people struggle with multitasking more than others, but nobody is actually good at it: https://www.apa.org/topics/research/multitasking https://www.apa.org/topics/research/multitasking That being said, some easy/mindless tasks (such as doodling in this example) can actually improve focus, which might be mistaken for multitasking: https://university-relations.umn.edu/blog/2021/07/16/doodling-listening-pencil https://university-relations.umn.edu/blog/2021/07/16/doodlin... I can imagine that background noise, like a podcast, might not hinder some people's focus; it may even improve it. However, if they are not focusing closely on both the podcast AND on the other task they are performing, I would not call that multitasking. For example, I listen to the radio when I drive long distances because it stops me from feeling bored or fatigued, but I don't consider it multitasking because the driving itself is mindless in this scenario. As soon as I need to focus more actively on driving, I stop paying attention to the radio.
- clipsy 3y ago
  From my experience with "multitaskers," it isn't possible with listening either.
- ripe 3y ago
  If the material isn't important to me, then maybe casual listening will work. But if I need to follow closely and understand, then audio is terrible. If I miss a word or mis-parse a sentence, I can't rescan. I would much rather read than listen.
  - wholinator2 3y ago
    I find when trying to listen and focus that the back and forward (mostly back) buttons are indispensible and that having them set to a custom length for my attention span and typical concentration loss helps immensely.
movedx 3y ago
On a somewhat related note: how come we, as a society, have never really adopted the daily "video log" (except for the YouTubers amongst us; the Neistat wannabes), but we have _heavily_ adopted the idea of the written journal?
- catchnear4321 3y ago
  writing in a journal, you put your thoughts into something. akin to a deposit in a bank. recording yourself with a device such as a camera or microphone, the device is taking your thoughts and putting them inside of itself. implicitly, you are more vulnerable. but times change, and with them so does access to the necessary technology. you haven’t yet reached the terminus. enjoy the ride.
- tekacs 3y ago
  If you (or anyone reading this) have any interest in doing this, consider e-mailing me (e-mail in my profile) and I might have something very compelling for you. I journal like this all the time now and so does my team. :)
- vlark 3y ago
  Writing is cheap, portable, and available to anyone who can produce and process written script; the poorest child in the poorest country can be taught to write their ideas in a journal. Video is expensive: not just the personal device & storage account, but the entire infrastructure to support uploading, storing, and maintaining an always-accessible archive. It is also difficult to revisit video to search for previous ideas and thoughts, etc. Text is easy to index and search both in digital and analog formats (at least, if one gives forethought to indexing one's journals during or shortly after writing a journal entry).
  - codazoda 3y ago
    Audio didn’t really catch on for journaling either; save podcasters. It’s reasonably easy to store for most of us on this platform. For most people it has the same search problem. I used to take audio notes in the car, because it’s easy to do. But I never went back and listened. Maybe if it could be transcribed reasonably well it would work out. Some dictate to their phones quite a bit these days.
drewcoo 3y ago
I think you're pedantically separating the sending and the receiving and calling receiving "communication," while sending is not. This is clearly not the case. Further, the author writes about "written communication," which implies the entire send/receive chain. You must be "mixed up," as you put it. So maybe writing is terrible if both actors are in bad faith and no one bothers trying to understand or steel man.

by tekacs 3y ago

paulpauper 3y ago

listening is good for multitasking . both formats have pros and cons. you can listen to a book in the car for example.

hotnfresh 3y ago
Listening requires so much focus from me that if I try to multitask I’ll just realize, after a span of seconds to minutes, that I’ve not heard a single word that was said. It’ll happen again as soon as I pick the multitasking back up. May as well read or watch a video. Same focus required either way. Though I do think I’m unusual. Basically can’t enjoy podcasts the way most people do, which is a bummer. In hindsight, the high school calculus teacher who forced us to take notes while they lectured, and got upset if you stopped, was not setting me up for success. I’d get to the end with a bunch of notes but having understood nothing I heard, because I was too busy transcribing to actually listen. I knew she was messing me up at the time and what I needed to be able to do to succeed, but it took me years to realize it’s a general problem I have. Can’t take information in unless my attention is undivided.
- jackthetab 3y ago
  I guess we're both "unusual" then.
- paulpauper 3y ago
  most podcasts suck because they are full of ads and filler.
- xeonmc 3y ago
  Like Feynman once discovered how different people have different processing architectures, just from the simple act of counting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj4y0EUlU-Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj4y0EUlU-Y
  - RoyalHenOil 3y ago
    That is very interesting. I am like Fenyman in this regard: counting internally is verbal, while reading is visual. I can count, recite the ABCs, sing, etc., while reading, just so long as I have it sufficiently well memorized that I can do it mindlessly. (I can't read and also actively think about something else. The reading takes up all of my thought process.) I would be curious to know if Fenyman experienced an internal monologue while he was thinking. I do not (my internal verbalizing is basically limited to recalling information that I've memorized rote), and I've often wondered if this is why I am adept at reading without verbalizing.
- RoyalHenOil 3y ago
  Some people struggle with multitasking more than others, but nobody is actually good at it: https://www.apa.org/topics/research/multitasking https://www.apa.org/topics/research/multitasking That being said, some easy/mindless tasks (such as doodling in this example) can actually improve focus, which might be mistaken for multitasking: https://university-relations.umn.edu/blog/2021/07/16/doodling-listening-pencil https://university-relations.umn.edu/blog/2021/07/16/doodlin... I can imagine that background noise, like a podcast, might not hinder some people's focus; it may even improve it. However, if they are not focusing closely on both the podcast AND on the other task they are performing, I would not call that multitasking. For example, I listen to the radio when I drive long distances because it stops me from feeling bored or fatigued, but I don't consider it multitasking because the driving itself is mindless in this scenario. As soon as I need to focus more actively on driving, I stop paying attention to the radio.
clipsy 3y ago
From my experience with "multitaskers," it isn't possible with listening either.
ripe 3y ago
If the material isn't important to me, then maybe casual listening will work. But if I need to follow closely and understand, then audio is terrible. If I miss a word or mis-parse a sentence, I can't rescan. I would much rather read than listen.
- wholinator2 3y ago
  I find when trying to listen and focus that the back and forward (mostly back) buttons are indispensible and that having them set to a custom length for my attention span and typical concentration loss helps immensely.

movedx 3y ago

On a somewhat related note: how come we, as a society, have never really adopted the daily "video log" (except for the YouTubers amongst us; the Neistat wannabes), but we have _heavily_ adopted the idea of the written journal?

catchnear4321 3y ago
writing in a journal, you put your thoughts into something. akin to a deposit in a bank. recording yourself with a device such as a camera or microphone, the device is taking your thoughts and putting them inside of itself. implicitly, you are more vulnerable. but times change, and with them so does access to the necessary technology. you haven’t yet reached the terminus. enjoy the ride.
tekacs 3y ago
If you (or anyone reading this) have any interest in doing this, consider e-mailing me (e-mail in my profile) and I might have something very compelling for you. I journal like this all the time now and so does my team. :)
vlark 3y ago
Writing is cheap, portable, and available to anyone who can produce and process written script; the poorest child in the poorest country can be taught to write their ideas in a journal. Video is expensive: not just the personal device & storage account, but the entire infrastructure to support uploading, storing, and maintaining an always-accessible archive. It is also difficult to revisit video to search for previous ideas and thoughts, etc. Text is easy to index and search both in digital and analog formats (at least, if one gives forethought to indexing one's journals during or shortly after writing a journal entry).
- codazoda 3y ago
  Audio didn’t really catch on for journaling either; save podcasters. It’s reasonably easy to store for most of us on this platform. For most people it has the same search problem. I used to take audio notes in the car, because it’s easy to do. But I never went back and listened. Maybe if it could be transcribed reasonably well it would work out. Some dictate to their phones quite a bit these days.

drewcoo 3y ago

I think you're pedantically separating the sending and the receiving and calling receiving "communication," while sending is not. This is clearly not the case. Further, the author writes about "written communication," which implies the entire send/receive chain. You must be "mixed up," as you put it. So maybe writing is terrible if both actors are in bad faith and no one bothers trying to understand or steel man.