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TypeScript is also controlled by MS and that has tons of community support. Sure, if things got evil someone would fork/reimplement, but right now Microsoft dec

by easton 3y ago

TypeScript is also controlled by MS and that has tons of community support. Sure, if things got evil someone would fork/reimplement, but right now Microsoft decides how the language goes for the most part. And for writing C# on the server, the major benefit is that Microsoft has a batteries included web framework that’s very battle tested. There’s at least one good first party answer for every problem (auth, database connections, caching, etc) which is very nice as compared to finding 30 npm packages to try to put stuff together. And C# is a pretty nice type-safe language that’s as fast if not faster than Java. As for the front-end scene? Yuck. That’s a big ol mess in .NET right now.

marcosdumay 3y ago
But there is a very compelling reason to use TypeScript. There isn't one for C#. (And, oh man, that batteries included battle tested framework is a stinky pile of trash. The language itself is ok, but the framework uses every misguided trend somebody at MS thought as cool, has no documentation of them, and implements half of them in some way that only that person thought about. There is a passable "web framework" inside it, but you have to ignore the MS recommendations and know what tons of pieces to discard, also, it's not very batteries included, because the batteries are almost all poisonous.)
- jmaker 3y ago
  This is kinda totally off. You could say that about Spring and Pivotal/Tanzu/VMware or even Quarkus and Red Hat, or just IBM. In my experience though those words apply best to much of the Python and Rust landscape. You could say much more about the Node landscape. But .NET and ASP? Really? Could you substantiate?
- andomggazzz662 3y ago
  I find the opposite to be the case in all honesty. I've never used C# or dotnet core but I know from word of mouth that it is a relatively well put together framework of tools for doing a lot of the things organizations with a lot of backend services to write might need. Many of those orgs are already very locked in with Microsoft, so the greater support by the open source community that comes with typescript is mostly irrelevant. Whatever the officially supported version of something is is what you will be required to use, and the typescript ecosystem provides very little if you want some big company to declare one particular thing to be the blessed solution.
anthonypasq 3y ago
sure, but why not just use Java in that case? Essentially equivalent, except not controlled by Microsoft, and arguably much easier to hire for.
- jmaker 3y ago
  Perhaps because Java is a mess? Much easier to hire? Where? In some locations there’s a 2:1 to 4:1 of C# over Java ratio for demand. And your “why not just use” something else is kinda condescending. You do realize that’s not how one is supposed to choose their tech stack? Java is “controlled” by Oracle. Kotlin by JetBrains. Scala is “controlled” by… no one knows. Go is “controlled” by Google. C++ is “controlled” through representatives of a consortium of blue chip corps, including MSFT and GOOG. They also “control” Linux to a significant extent. Their employees contribute to many OSS projects. There’s no perfect governance structure. .NET has the .NET Foundation, like Haskell (also “controlled” by Microsoft until recently) and Python; but who “controls” Python? Did you ever bother to wonder or was it ever important at all? And the language alone is insignificant, you need a community and an ecosystem that you and your project fit best in and you can rely upon for the lifetime of you project.
wryanzimmerman 3y ago
If you had to, you could go from typescript to JavaScript overnight in a large project, whereas no similar escape hatch exists for C#. As for the frontend, you have to have so JavaScript somewhere, it’s unavoidable, so typescript is just a way to make the inevitable more palatable.
- jmaker 3y ago
  How is the first paragraph significant or even relevant? What scenario are you contemplating to hedge against? And there are other frontend options that go without any JS on your side, so it’s quite avoidable. In most cases it’s impractical to avoid JS for the browser target. But the browser is not the only UI target for many apps.

by easton 3y ago

marcosdumay 3y ago

But there is a very compelling reason to use TypeScript. There isn't one for C#. (And, oh man, that batteries included battle tested framework is a stinky pile of trash. The language itself is ok, but the framework uses every misguided trend somebody at MS thought as cool, has no documentation of them, and implements half of them in some way that only that person thought about. There is a passable "web framework" inside it, but you have to ignore the MS recommendations and know what tons of pieces to discard, also, it's not very batteries included, because the batteries are almost all poisonous.)

jmaker 3y ago
This is kinda totally off. You could say that about Spring and Pivotal/Tanzu/VMware or even Quarkus and Red Hat, or just IBM. In my experience though those words apply best to much of the Python and Rust landscape. You could say much more about the Node landscape. But .NET and ASP? Really? Could you substantiate?
andomggazzz662 3y ago
I find the opposite to be the case in all honesty. I've never used C# or dotnet core but I know from word of mouth that it is a relatively well put together framework of tools for doing a lot of the things organizations with a lot of backend services to write might need. Many of those orgs are already very locked in with Microsoft, so the greater support by the open source community that comes with typescript is mostly irrelevant. Whatever the officially supported version of something is is what you will be required to use, and the typescript ecosystem provides very little if you want some big company to declare one particular thing to be the blessed solution.

anthonypasq 3y ago

sure, but why not just use Java in that case? Essentially equivalent, except not controlled by Microsoft, and arguably much easier to hire for.

jmaker 3y ago
Perhaps because Java is a mess? Much easier to hire? Where? In some locations there’s a 2:1 to 4:1 of C# over Java ratio for demand. And your “why not just use” something else is kinda condescending. You do realize that’s not how one is supposed to choose their tech stack? Java is “controlled” by Oracle. Kotlin by JetBrains. Scala is “controlled” by… no one knows. Go is “controlled” by Google. C++ is “controlled” through representatives of a consortium of blue chip corps, including MSFT and GOOG. They also “control” Linux to a significant extent. Their employees contribute to many OSS projects. There’s no perfect governance structure. .NET has the .NET Foundation, like Haskell (also “controlled” by Microsoft until recently) and Python; but who “controls” Python? Did you ever bother to wonder or was it ever important at all? And the language alone is insignificant, you need a community and an ecosystem that you and your project fit best in and you can rely upon for the lifetime of you project.

wryanzimmerman 3y ago

If you had to, you could go from typescript to JavaScript overnight in a large project, whereas no similar escape hatch exists for C#. As for the frontend, you have to have so JavaScript somewhere, it’s unavoidable, so typescript is just a way to make the inevitable more palatable.

jmaker 3y ago
How is the first paragraph significant or even relevant? What scenario are you contemplating to hedge against? And there are other frontend options that go without any JS on your side, so it’s quite avoidable. In most cases it’s impractical to avoid JS for the browser target. But the browser is not the only UI target for many apps.