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Let's see how it works out for Lahaina before we rush out and start more fires.

jeffbee 3y ago
Why? Do you believe there is a way to replace housing in Lahaina without building any? Do you believe that the 14000 households destroyed in Butte County, CA by the Camp Fire five years ago, who are scattered to the wind because California refuses to permit any new construction, are not enough of a precedent?
- WillPostForFood 3y ago
  The obvious way to replace housing in Lahaina is to rebuild what was there. Zoning regulations wouldn't need suspending. They definitely should suspend permitting to expedite the process, whichever way they choose to go. https://www.hawaiibusiness.com/hawaii-building-permit-delays-top-nation-uhero-study-real-estate-carl-bonham/ https://www.hawaiibusiness.com/hawaii-building-permit-delays...
  - jeffbee 3y ago
    > Zoning regulations wouldn't need suspending. A common belief, but throughout America the zoning regulations prevent the construction of that which already exists.
    - WillPostForFood 3y ago
      We are getting lost in semantics. Your original comment was clear in its intent, YIMBY martial law and "housing that meets basic health and safety criteria on a site within city limits that is already surrounded on three sides by other developed parcels". I responded with a viable alternative: free instant permit to rebuild what was there before (regardless of current zoning). You are proposing something much more radical. I'm not opposed to doing something crazy in Lahaina like a building free for all. I'm saying don't declare it a success and start promoting it elsewhere before it is even started, let alone a proven success.
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  California doesn’t want building near the tree line because those houses keep getting burned down. It’s not like Florida, where you can constantly rebuild on the beach with subsidized federal flood/hurricane insurance in play.
  - jeffbee 3y ago
    I am not suggesting building anywhere near the tree line, but the state of California should have stepped in and deleted the entire zoning code of Chico after the Camp Fire.
    - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
      The places that burned down, maybe we shouldn’t rebuild those, or let a free insurance market determine if the rebuilt housing can get insurance or not. Zoning is one of those things that prevents you from building near the tree line or building too much when you have to rely on septic, etc…
      - jeffbee 3y ago
        There is very little evidentiary basis for your statements. Zoning demonstrably allowed the creation of Paradise, which should not have been built, and strangled the growth of Chico, which should be ten times as large with a bullet train to Sacramento every 20 minutes.
        seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        There is a lot of grand father clausing in zoning where what could be built 50 years ago is no longer allowed. Chico’s growth is strangled by a poor economy, not by zoning. The bullet train might help with that, but people won’t invest in a poor housing market since they have better things to do with their money.

Why? Do you believe there is a way to replace housing in Lahaina without building any? Do you believe that the 14000 households destroyed in Butte County, CA by the Camp Fire five years ago, who are scattered to the wind because California refuses to permit any new construction, are not enough of a precedent?

WillPostForFood 3y ago
The obvious way to replace housing in Lahaina is to rebuild what was there. Zoning regulations wouldn't need suspending. They definitely should suspend permitting to expedite the process, whichever way they choose to go. https://www.hawaiibusiness.com/hawaii-building-permit-delays-top-nation-uhero-study-real-estate-carl-bonham/ https://www.hawaiibusiness.com/hawaii-building-permit-delays...
- jeffbee 3y ago
  > Zoning regulations wouldn't need suspending. A common belief, but throughout America the zoning regulations prevent the construction of that which already exists.
  - WillPostForFood 3y ago
    We are getting lost in semantics. Your original comment was clear in its intent, YIMBY martial law and "housing that meets basic health and safety criteria on a site within city limits that is already surrounded on three sides by other developed parcels". I responded with a viable alternative: free instant permit to rebuild what was there before (regardless of current zoning). You are proposing something much more radical. I'm not opposed to doing something crazy in Lahaina like a building free for all. I'm saying don't declare it a success and start promoting it elsewhere before it is even started, let alone a proven success.
seanmcdirmid 3y ago
California doesn’t want building near the tree line because those houses keep getting burned down. It’s not like Florida, where you can constantly rebuild on the beach with subsidized federal flood/hurricane insurance in play.
- jeffbee 3y ago
  I am not suggesting building anywhere near the tree line, but the state of California should have stepped in and deleted the entire zoning code of Chico after the Camp Fire.
  - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
    The places that burned down, maybe we shouldn’t rebuild those, or let a free insurance market determine if the rebuilt housing can get insurance or not. Zoning is one of those things that prevents you from building near the tree line or building too much when you have to rely on septic, etc…
    - jeffbee 3y ago
      There is very little evidentiary basis for your statements. Zoning demonstrably allowed the creation of Paradise, which should not have been built, and strangled the growth of Chico, which should be ten times as large with a bullet train to Sacramento every 20 minutes.
      - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
        There is a lot of grand father clausing in zoning where what could be built 50 years ago is no longer allowed. Chico’s growth is strangled by a poor economy, not by zoning. The bullet train might help with that, but people won’t invest in a poor housing market since they have better things to do with their money.