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Not many have mentioned policy here, just automation. How are we to create sustainable jobs if we keep taxing, regulating, etc... such that we increase the req

Not many have mentioned policy here, just automation. How are we to create sustainable jobs if we keep taxing, regulating, etc... such that we increase the requirement for marginal productivity of labor in order to turn a profit? Basically, on-the-job training and low skills employment could be made more profitable by making it so that there is some room left for the free market. If they have lower non-employment costs, then they will be able to hire less productive people. This drives demand for employment, and thus, wages. But I'm not suggesting that this will ever happen. ;) Some people in power pay lip service to the free market while attacking it, and others aren't shy about attacking it. We create "make work" jobs that come at the cost of companies and individuals. If it didn't come at the cost of companies and individuals their costs would be lower. If enough wiggle room was given, on-the-jobs training would be possible, and low-skills labor more profitable. As of April, the US will have the highest corporate tax rate in the world. This approach doesn't seem to be solving the inequality of wealth problem, and it doesn't look like it's giving people a way to earn their living.

yason 15y ago
I've never understood taxing of income, except that for the point of a taxing bureau it's a very convenient spot to impose taxes. Namely, taxing reduces whatever that is taxed. Taxing work makes work less desirable, and sometimes not worth to be done at all. Taxes should target things that are unnecessary or harming. Thus, income shouldn't be taxed at all. Conversely, consumption should be taxed with a VAT roughly equal to the lost income tax. Food could certainly be taxed less than cars but the general rule should be that you're taxed for consuming. Because income wouldn't be taxed, people's purchasing power would increase but taxing the consumption would make them think twice where they spend their money. Consider that this is the opposite of the current situation: people are all pre-taxed (=license to consume) and items and products are so cheap they can get spent money on and ultimately discarded without anyone blinking an eye.
- devs1010 15y ago
  we are taxed at consumption as well, I'm assuming you mean you want even higher sales tax than we currently have but no income tax? I have felt that the current sales tax of up to 10% in some places is already fairly high as is
  - lucaspiller 15y ago
    10%? Wow! Here in Ireland income tax is 20% on the first €32,000 and 40% above that. VAT (sales tax) is at 23%.
    - jules 15y ago
      In Sweden income tax can be over 60% and VAT 25%.
    - disgruntledphd2 15y ago
      Ireland's quite weird in terms of tax policy internationally. We have supposedly low rates of income tax, high sales taxes and low corporate tax. Ireland also has more deductible than I've seen in the UK. I went looking for things I could use to reduce my tax bill (there's loads in Ireland), but there appeared to be no comparable tax reliefs available for me in the UK :(.
      - devs1010 15y ago
        At those rates, income tax would also be higher than in the U.S., at least for most people
    - devs1010 15y ago
      In some places its lower, some places higher, I presume, but I've never heard as high as 23%, I think people here wouldn't stand for that, I presume there are much better social services in Ireland, which would be the benefit of higher taxation
- desas 15y ago
  The counter argument is that taxing spending adversely impacts the poor. They have to spend a higher proportion of their income. The richer you are the more of your income you're likely to save/invest. It's hard to progressively tax consumption.

yason 15y ago

I've never understood taxing of income, except that for the point of a taxing bureau it's a very convenient spot to impose taxes. Namely, taxing reduces whatever that is taxed. Taxing work makes work less desirable, and sometimes not worth to be done at all. Taxes should target things that are unnecessary or harming. Thus, income shouldn't be taxed at all. Conversely, consumption should be taxed with a VAT roughly equal to the lost income tax. Food could certainly be taxed less than cars but the general rule should be that you're taxed for consuming. Because income wouldn't be taxed, people's purchasing power would increase but taxing the consumption would make them think twice where they spend their money. Consider that this is the opposite of the current situation: people are all pre-taxed (=license to consume) and items and products are so cheap they can get spent money on and ultimately discarded without anyone blinking an eye.

devs1010 15y ago
we are taxed at consumption as well, I'm assuming you mean you want even higher sales tax than we currently have but no income tax? I have felt that the current sales tax of up to 10% in some places is already fairly high as is
- lucaspiller 15y ago
  10%? Wow! Here in Ireland income tax is 20% on the first €32,000 and 40% above that. VAT (sales tax) is at 23%.
  - jules 15y ago
    In Sweden income tax can be over 60% and VAT 25%.
  - disgruntledphd2 15y ago
    Ireland's quite weird in terms of tax policy internationally. We have supposedly low rates of income tax, high sales taxes and low corporate tax. Ireland also has more deductible than I've seen in the UK. I went looking for things I could use to reduce my tax bill (there's loads in Ireland), but there appeared to be no comparable tax reliefs available for me in the UK :(.
    - devs1010 15y ago
      At those rates, income tax would also be higher than in the U.S., at least for most people
  - devs1010 15y ago
    In some places its lower, some places higher, I presume, but I've never heard as high as 23%, I think people here wouldn't stand for that, I presume there are much better social services in Ireland, which would be the benefit of higher taxation
desas 15y ago
The counter argument is that taxing spending adversely impacts the poor. They have to spend a higher proportion of their income. The richer you are the more of your income you're likely to save/invest. It's hard to progressively tax consumption.