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This is hilariously biased. This is HN, you're not talking to people who don't know what Linux is. Hell, a huge portion of us are linux engineers of various sor

by swozey 3y ago

This is hilariously biased. This is HN, you're not talking to people who don't know what Linux is. Hell, a huge portion of us are linux engineers of various sorts. You're also in a thread literally about a linux app. Anyway. I would never, ever use Linux as a desktop environment over OSX after the experiences I've had with it over the last 20+ years. OSX GUI applications absolutely blow everything that Linux has out of the water. I don't care if we're talking KDE, i3, dwm, cinnamon. The worst part about OSX applications is they aren't cheap. Even small apps like Soundsource a https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/ https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/ are usually $30+ but they are fantastic. The thought of using pipewire and all the configuration hell you have to do to it to make it like Soundsource is a complete turn off. OSX apps work. They integrate. They look great and there are a LOT of them that do pretty unique things that I haven't seen in Windows or Linux. I work on Linux 8 hours a day from OSX and about 30% of my time is using Win11 on my gaming desktop. Also, now that I'm on an m1 max there is no way in the world I'm going back to x86 as my productivity machine.

gumballindie 3y ago
> I would never, ever use Linux as a desktop environment over OSX after the experiences I've had with it over the last 20+ years. You probably had enough of it. I’d be sick of it after 20 years even if it were the shiniest option out there.
- swozey 3y ago
  lol You're 100% right. I don't enjoy fixing linux at all after work. I used to do the VFIO GPU gaming desktop w/ linux + windows passthrough but I finally got over it and just installed windows on my desktop.
  - gumballindie 3y ago
    And there’s not a single problem with that. Though these days you dont need to hack much for gaming.
augusto-moura 3y ago
This reply is also biased, maybe we had some bad experience in the past, but the example you made, Pipewire, is one of the things I was stunned that worked out of the box. It is relatively recent but it is already installed by default on most modern distros, and no "configuration hell" required. Linux applications might not be as good-looking as most of Apple store ones, but most of them sure work. I'm not saying that you should switch to Linux, you do you, and to be honest Linux is not that friendly anyway. But that is not reason to stone linux to death, the parent comment is not even that offensive for MacOS users, it just asks if switching to linux would be an option, as an thought
- swozey 3y ago
  Of course it comes installed so you can listen to audio. That isn't what Soundsource does - you CAN make Pipewire work like soundsource, though. Of course my post is biased. I gave my opinion as someone who uses both vs someone who only uses linux and doesn't know osx. Any Linux user telling me that "Linux does more than OSX" is getting my biased reply. Per app audio redirection, per app effects, per app volume control, system-wide effects, headphone equalizer, auto change inputs/outputs etc. I haven't worked with pipewire in a long time but I had to use another app with some complicated GUI of "wires" or pipes to get the same affect. I can't remember the name of it now. edit: Wireplumber or Mixx/Raysession, I forget. It was a huge pain comparatively. Mixx - https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/free1/uploads/mixxx/original/2X/a/a32d04259bb801863ff987d66b960689d7fe2af9.png https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/free1/uploads/mixxx/origin... wireplumber -https://forum.level1techs.com/uploads/default/original/4X/e/b/8/eb855cab65a78074930e8972a8d3f50ed3b673e3.png https://forum.level1techs.com/uploads/default/original/4X/e/...
  - gumballindie 3y ago
    My mac mini and macbook pro would attest that i do know osx and indeed i have been using it for 15 years in work environments. Right after i switched to these from linux, to which i switched from windows and freebsd. Now back to linux. It’s come a long way.
    - 3y ago
domdabgnad 3y ago
lol. SoundSource looks identical to `pavucontrol` which I've been using for close to a decade, without ever touching a single bit of configuration, ever, for PulseAudio or PipeWire. Or a single line to install EasyEffects which adds effects in the mix, also with zero configuration. I'm not exaggerating. Tell me something you think SoundSource can do, and I'll show you me doing the same thing with Pavucontrol or EasyEffects in my entirely stock setup. But sure. You found a screenshot of the ultimate Pipewire power tool that allows you to do things I guarantee SoundSource doesn't, and ran with it. >They look great and there are a LOT of them that do pretty unique things that I haven't seen in Windows or Linux. Oh?
- swozey 3y ago
  lol cool. This app looks like complete trash, and I guarantee isn't as feature filled out of the box, like I said. But sure. pavucontrol https://freedesktop.org/software/pulseaudio/pavucontrol//screenshot.png https://freedesktop.org/software/pulseaudio/pavucontrol//scr... soundsource https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/images/hero@2x.png https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/images/hero@2x.png I love those of you who think an OSX user wouldn't know linux/linux apps. edit: Yeah, this does nothing that soundsource does. I wish some of you would actually read the features and stop posting these volume control apps. Not to mention Soundsource was just a quick example. I could name 50 more apps that don't have a Linux alternative or one that is of any quality. Literally - "A simple volume control tool (mixer) for the PulseAudio sound server."
  - domdabgnad 3y ago
    Then you would name a feature that SoundSource does that Pavucontrol doesn't. But you don't actually know what you're talking about. For all the talk, it should be trivial for you to make me look foolish right now. Like, so easy, right?
    - swozey 3y ago
      Show me the UI for telling a specific application to redirect its audio output to a specific device automatically. Show me the UI where I plug in a specific device it switches a specific applications (not all) default automatically to the new device. Show me it's headphone EQ. Show me per-app headphone EQ. Show me per app EQ settings. Show me the built in 3D/spatial audio for headphones Then show me the config file you had to edit to set all of this up. And show me how clean and attractive the UI doing all this is. Then show me it in Pipewire because I don't care about Pulseaudio anyway and would never use that in 2023 with my need for low latency due to my DAW/equipment. Then, in Pipewire, show me how to all this without using Wireplumber or Mixx. I didn't say you couldn't do things in XYZ. I said the configuration of doing so sucks compared to doing it in another app. Soundsource was just an example. I don't know why you care so much. I could've said Pixelmator (GIMP?) or 30 other apps. PS: "For all the talk, it should be trivial for you to make me look foolish right now. Like, so easy, right?" You're this heated up because I like an OSX app more than Linux options? You're acting like I personally care about "winning" this argument. Even if it has these features I still wouldn't use the app. Aesthetics and ease of use is important to my day to day machine. Win the "argument" all you want.
kayg04 3y ago
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by swozey 3y ago

gumballindie 3y ago

> I would never, ever use Linux as a desktop environment over OSX after the experiences I've had with it over the last 20+ years. You probably had enough of it. I’d be sick of it after 20 years even if it were the shiniest option out there.

swozey 3y ago
lol You're 100% right. I don't enjoy fixing linux at all after work. I used to do the VFIO GPU gaming desktop w/ linux + windows passthrough but I finally got over it and just installed windows on my desktop.
- gumballindie 3y ago
  And there’s not a single problem with that. Though these days you dont need to hack much for gaming.

augusto-moura 3y ago

This reply is also biased, maybe we had some bad experience in the past, but the example you made, Pipewire, is one of the things I was stunned that worked out of the box. It is relatively recent but it is already installed by default on most modern distros, and no "configuration hell" required. Linux applications might not be as good-looking as most of Apple store ones, but most of them sure work. I'm not saying that you should switch to Linux, you do you, and to be honest Linux is not that friendly anyway. But that is not reason to stone linux to death, the parent comment is not even that offensive for MacOS users, it just asks if switching to linux would be an option, as an thought

swozey 3y ago
Of course it comes installed so you can listen to audio. That isn't what Soundsource does - you CAN make Pipewire work like soundsource, though. Of course my post is biased. I gave my opinion as someone who uses both vs someone who only uses linux and doesn't know osx. Any Linux user telling me that "Linux does more than OSX" is getting my biased reply. Per app audio redirection, per app effects, per app volume control, system-wide effects, headphone equalizer, auto change inputs/outputs etc. I haven't worked with pipewire in a long time but I had to use another app with some complicated GUI of "wires" or pipes to get the same affect. I can't remember the name of it now. edit: Wireplumber or Mixx/Raysession, I forget. It was a huge pain comparatively. Mixx - https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/free1/uploads/mixxx/original/2X/a/a32d04259bb801863ff987d66b960689d7fe2af9.png https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/free1/uploads/mixxx/origin... wireplumber -https://forum.level1techs.com/uploads/default/original/4X/e/b/8/eb855cab65a78074930e8972a8d3f50ed3b673e3.png https://forum.level1techs.com/uploads/default/original/4X/e/...
- gumballindie 3y ago
  My mac mini and macbook pro would attest that i do know osx and indeed i have been using it for 15 years in work environments. Right after i switched to these from linux, to which i switched from windows and freebsd. Now back to linux. It’s come a long way.
  - 3y ago

domdabgnad 3y ago

lol. SoundSource looks identical to `pavucontrol` which I've been using for close to a decade, without ever touching a single bit of configuration, ever, for PulseAudio or PipeWire. Or a single line to install EasyEffects which adds effects in the mix, also with zero configuration. I'm not exaggerating. Tell me something you think SoundSource can do, and I'll show you me doing the same thing with Pavucontrol or EasyEffects in my entirely stock setup. But sure. You found a screenshot of the ultimate Pipewire power tool that allows you to do things I guarantee SoundSource doesn't, and ran with it. >They look great and there are a LOT of them that do pretty unique things that I haven't seen in Windows or Linux. Oh?

swozey 3y ago
lol cool. This app looks like complete trash, and I guarantee isn't as feature filled out of the box, like I said. But sure. pavucontrol https://freedesktop.org/software/pulseaudio/pavucontrol//screenshot.png https://freedesktop.org/software/pulseaudio/pavucontrol//scr... soundsource https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/images/hero@2x.png https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/images/hero@2x.png I love those of you who think an OSX user wouldn't know linux/linux apps. edit: Yeah, this does nothing that soundsource does. I wish some of you would actually read the features and stop posting these volume control apps. Not to mention Soundsource was just a quick example. I could name 50 more apps that don't have a Linux alternative or one that is of any quality. Literally - "A simple volume control tool (mixer) for the PulseAudio sound server."
- domdabgnad 3y ago
  Then you would name a feature that SoundSource does that Pavucontrol doesn't. But you don't actually know what you're talking about. For all the talk, it should be trivial for you to make me look foolish right now. Like, so easy, right?
  - swozey 3y ago
    Show me the UI for telling a specific application to redirect its audio output to a specific device automatically. Show me the UI where I plug in a specific device it switches a specific applications (not all) default automatically to the new device. Show me it's headphone EQ. Show me per-app headphone EQ. Show me per app EQ settings. Show me the built in 3D/spatial audio for headphones Then show me the config file you had to edit to set all of this up. And show me how clean and attractive the UI doing all this is. Then show me it in Pipewire because I don't care about Pulseaudio anyway and would never use that in 2023 with my need for low latency due to my DAW/equipment. Then, in Pipewire, show me how to all this without using Wireplumber or Mixx. I didn't say you couldn't do things in XYZ. I said the configuration of doing so sucks compared to doing it in another app. Soundsource was just an example. I don't know why you care so much. I could've said Pixelmator (GIMP?) or 30 other apps. PS: "For all the talk, it should be trivial for you to make me look foolish right now. Like, so easy, right?" You're this heated up because I like an OSX app more than Linux options? You're acting like I personally care about "winning" this argument. Even if it has these features I still wouldn't use the app. Aesthetics and ease of use is important to my day to day machine. Win the "argument" all you want.

kayg04 3y ago

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