4 ms·

If locals would vote to relax zoning and simplify regulations we wouldn't have the crisis in the first place.

ktosobcy 3y ago
I'm sorry but what are you rambling about? Barcelona for example is flooded with tourists and "nomads" and save for basically banning short term rentals and eradicating cancerous Airbnb there is not that much that can be done...
- kjkjadksj 3y ago
  If there is demand for a thing and its exceeded such that people who want that thing can’t get it, just make more of that thing. Barcelona should build like Tokyo does until demand is satiated. The solution exists, people are just generally in favor of how things presently look and feel like and fear the unknown, so policies on land use tend to reflect these feelings.
- ajmurmann 3y ago
  Is the problem in Barcelona that the ration of tourists to locals is broken (I agree it is and didn't like it there when I visited because of this) or is the problem affordability as called out by the parent comment? If the issue is affordability this can be addressed by increasing supply. If the issue is simply too many tourists flooding the city and changing the character, it's a different point than I was responding to and I don't have any well-formed thoughts on potential solutions and causes.
  - ktosobcy 3y ago
    It's both actually and they are compounding. For the latter one there exists tourist tax that could curb a bit the overflood but AFAIR it was harder to enforce / collect with Airbnb and short term rentals (as opposed to typical licensed hotels and hostels) that only exasperated the situation by pushing more people to try to cash on the airbnb
kjkjadksj 3y ago
The surprised reactions from airbnb taking up housing stock are from people who don’t piece together what you describe. Basically if the airbnb is taking needed housing stock, why not just zone for more housing? Or regulated hotels that these days are able to compete with airbnb on cost once again? That’s never mentioned though, people just stick fingers in their ears and repeat “screw airnbnb” without thinking of penciling this sort of stuff out to its logical conclusions.
chongli 3y ago
Locals are incapable of that because property owners are the majority of voters and unwilling to vote against their own interests. Furthermore, if one municipality solves its affordability crisis a ton of people will move there and gobble up the affordable housing stock. It’s a problem that can’t be solved locally.
- nonethewiser 3y ago
  > Locals are incapable of that because property owners are the majority of voters and unwilling to vote against their own interests This seems unlikely to be true. Especially In the places where housing is most expensive. Do the majority of voters in NYC and SF own homes or other real estate?
  - chongli 3y ago
    The places where housing is the most expensive are the same places where people who cannot afford housing are forced to commute from somewhere else. Commuters don't get to vote in the place where they work; they have to vote where they live.
    - nonethewiser 3y ago
      People do commute from outside but they are irrelevant. Do you think more NYC residents rent or own?
      - chongli 3y ago
        They are not irrelevant. If they didn’t have to commute they would be able to vote in local elections. Property owners vote at much higher rates than non-owners. Property owners are the only ones with the right to put up election signs. Property owners are far more politically connected than non-owners.

I'm sorry but what are you rambling about? Barcelona for example is flooded with tourists and "nomads" and save for basically banning short term rentals and eradicating cancerous Airbnb there is not that much that can be done...

kjkjadksj 3y ago
If there is demand for a thing and its exceeded such that people who want that thing can’t get it, just make more of that thing. Barcelona should build like Tokyo does until demand is satiated. The solution exists, people are just generally in favor of how things presently look and feel like and fear the unknown, so policies on land use tend to reflect these feelings.
ajmurmann 3y ago
Is the problem in Barcelona that the ration of tourists to locals is broken (I agree it is and didn't like it there when I visited because of this) or is the problem affordability as called out by the parent comment? If the issue is affordability this can be addressed by increasing supply. If the issue is simply too many tourists flooding the city and changing the character, it's a different point than I was responding to and I don't have any well-formed thoughts on potential solutions and causes.
- ktosobcy 3y ago
  It's both actually and they are compounding. For the latter one there exists tourist tax that could curb a bit the overflood but AFAIR it was harder to enforce / collect with Airbnb and short term rentals (as opposed to typical licensed hotels and hostels) that only exasperated the situation by pushing more people to try to cash on the airbnb

kjkjadksj 3y ago

The surprised reactions from airbnb taking up housing stock are from people who don’t piece together what you describe. Basically if the airbnb is taking needed housing stock, why not just zone for more housing? Or regulated hotels that these days are able to compete with airbnb on cost once again? That’s never mentioned though, people just stick fingers in their ears and repeat “screw airnbnb” without thinking of penciling this sort of stuff out to its logical conclusions.

chongli 3y ago

Locals are incapable of that because property owners are the majority of voters and unwilling to vote against their own interests. Furthermore, if one municipality solves its affordability crisis a ton of people will move there and gobble up the affordable housing stock. It’s a problem that can’t be solved locally.

nonethewiser 3y ago
> Locals are incapable of that because property owners are the majority of voters and unwilling to vote against their own interests This seems unlikely to be true. Especially In the places where housing is most expensive. Do the majority of voters in NYC and SF own homes or other real estate?
- chongli 3y ago
  The places where housing is the most expensive are the same places where people who cannot afford housing are forced to commute from somewhere else. Commuters don't get to vote in the place where they work; they have to vote where they live.
  - nonethewiser 3y ago
    People do commute from outside but they are irrelevant. Do you think more NYC residents rent or own?
    - chongli 3y ago
      They are not irrelevant. If they didn’t have to commute they would be able to vote in local elections. Property owners vote at much higher rates than non-owners. Property owners are the only ones with the right to put up election signs. Property owners are far more politically connected than non-owners.