4 ms·

Your two examples leave some questions. You seem to be saying that your cabin community was able to find a solution that would not be acceptable to a large tel

Your two examples leave some questions. You seem to be saying that your cabin community was able to find a solution that would not be acceptable to a large telco. Why isn't that OK? Why should the large company be forced to do something they don't want to do if, by your example, other organizations are capable of servicing those communities? To rephrase the question: What, if anything, prevents smaller organizations or non-profits or niche companies from servicing areas that large telcos will only do through regulatory mandates? Can the business/regulatory climate be improved to facilitate these smaller organizations? Are there existing regulations (for example access to poles or conduits) in some areas that block smaller organizations?

jjoonathan 3y ago
> Why isn't that OK? Ask the telcos lobbying to stop it. That's the problem.
tw04 3y ago
>You seem to be saying that your cabin community was able to find a solution that would not be acceptable to a large telco. Why isn't that OK? Why should the large company be forced to do something they don't want to do if, by your example, other organizations are capable of servicing those communities? Because they're also actively lobbying to kill any local co-op formation. Successfully in many states. They tried here and got shot down, then proclaimed they were going to build out fiber themselves in the co-op's targeted service area (they didn't). There are states where they were successful in getting laws passed preventing "wasteful government spending on broadband networks" - the end result of this will be people who literally have no possible way to EVER get broadband.
- tivert 3y ago
  > Because they're also actively lobbying to kill any local co-op formation. Successfully in many states. How exactly do they do that?
  - dragonwriter 3y ago
    I suspect the same way PG&E has fought public power expansion: channel corporate propaganda through astroturf taxpayer groups misleading about the costs.
  - PaulDavisThe1st 3y ago
    In all the various ways that corporations manage to get legislation passed. These corporations are not stopping local co-op formation. They are lobbying for laws that severely limit (and in some cases, prevent) their ability to operate.
    - tivert 3y ago
      > They are lobbying for laws that severely limit (and in some cases, prevent) their ability to operate. That's what I'm curious about. What's in those laws they're lobbying for?
      - nobody9999 3y ago
        >That's what I'm curious about. What's in those laws they're lobbying for? See[0] for yourself. You keep "asking questions" about stuff that's decades old. It makes me wonder if you're not asking in good faith. Please prove me wrong. [0] https://broadbandnow.com/report/municipal-broadband-roadblocks https://broadbandnow.com/report/municipal-broadband-roadbloc...
  - jjoonathan 3y ago
    Why don't you read the article that we are supposed to be discussing and find out?
    - speff 3y ago
      Right back at you? The bill in the article is a call for deregulation. Zero to do with killing competition
  - nobody9999 3y ago
- gwright 3y ago
  > There are states where they were successful in getting laws passed preventing "wasteful government spending on broadband networks" The devil is in the details but arguing that municipalities shouldn't compete with private businesses is not the same thing as arguing that private businesses shouldn't have other private competitors. I have no doubt that telcos lobby heavily to restrict competition. Last mile infrastructure regulation is complicated but I'm more in favor of a level playing field (i.e. regulation) for access to poles/conduits/rights-of-way than having municipalities operate their own broadband architecture or even worse operate and then protect themselves from competition by other providers.

jjoonathan 3y ago

> Why isn't that OK? Ask the telcos lobbying to stop it. That's the problem.

tw04 3y ago

>You seem to be saying that your cabin community was able to find a solution that would not be acceptable to a large telco. Why isn't that OK? Why should the large company be forced to do something they don't want to do if, by your example, other organizations are capable of servicing those communities? Because they're also actively lobbying to kill any local co-op formation. Successfully in many states. They tried here and got shot down, then proclaimed they were going to build out fiber themselves in the co-op's targeted service area (they didn't). There are states where they were successful in getting laws passed preventing "wasteful government spending on broadband networks" - the end result of this will be people who literally have no possible way to EVER get broadband.

tivert 3y ago
> Because they're also actively lobbying to kill any local co-op formation. Successfully in many states. How exactly do they do that?
- dragonwriter 3y ago
  I suspect the same way PG&E has fought public power expansion: channel corporate propaganda through astroturf taxpayer groups misleading about the costs.
- PaulDavisThe1st 3y ago
  In all the various ways that corporations manage to get legislation passed. These corporations are not stopping local co-op formation. They are lobbying for laws that severely limit (and in some cases, prevent) their ability to operate.
  - tivert 3y ago
    > They are lobbying for laws that severely limit (and in some cases, prevent) their ability to operate. That's what I'm curious about. What's in those laws they're lobbying for?
    - nobody9999 3y ago
      >That's what I'm curious about. What's in those laws they're lobbying for? See[0] for yourself. You keep "asking questions" about stuff that's decades old. It makes me wonder if you're not asking in good faith. Please prove me wrong. [0] https://broadbandnow.com/report/municipal-broadband-roadblocks https://broadbandnow.com/report/municipal-broadband-roadbloc...
- jjoonathan 3y ago
  Why don't you read the article that we are supposed to be discussing and find out?
  - speff 3y ago
    Right back at you? The bill in the article is a call for deregulation. Zero to do with killing competition
- nobody9999 3y ago
gwright 3y ago
> There are states where they were successful in getting laws passed preventing "wasteful government spending on broadband networks" The devil is in the details but arguing that municipalities shouldn't compete with private businesses is not the same thing as arguing that private businesses shouldn't have other private competitors. I have no doubt that telcos lobby heavily to restrict competition. Last mile infrastructure regulation is complicated but I'm more in favor of a level playing field (i.e. regulation) for access to poles/conduits/rights-of-way than having municipalities operate their own broadband architecture or even worse operate and then protect themselves from competition by other providers.