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I think that it also exposes some of the crazy group think going on here, so maybe it wasn't all bad. I mean, You're an idiot isn't supposed to be a +5 comment

by Ezra 18y ago

I think that it also exposes some of the crazy group think going on here, so maybe it wasn't all bad. I mean, You're an idiot isn't supposed to be a +5 comment on this site. And reasoned discourse like It doesn't really matter what the Justin.tv CEO said. He pasted some boiler plate because there's nothing more to be said; the deed had been done. What do you want? An apology for not finding the video? For not policing the Internet? Prosecution of anybody "egging him on?" Come on. Someone broadcast their suicide. That fact doesn't make it any more tragic than any other suicide. It also doesn't mean anybody more than usual was responsible. There's really no story here which is why I chose to make a comment that didn't acknowledge there was. shouldn't be -12. At least not in my mind. Not to mention all the equally pithy and/or distasteful rejoinders that were upvoted.

rantfoil 18y ago
The rabid responses to Tom's post both shocked and surprised me as well. They just seemed a little bit more spirited than I would expect. It was a little schadenfreude-infused, to say the least.
- greendestiny 18y ago
  So wait, we're shocked and horrified at downvoting, but suicide, hey happens all the time. Do the upvotes in this thread represent anti-group think group think?
  - trominos 18y ago
    We can do something about downvoting. Being gratuitously shocked and horrified at some more-or-less random kid's suicide is just obnoxious. FWIW, tdavis, I wasn't offended by your comment, except to the extent that it makes HN more reddit-like. But in that respect it was no worse than most of the comments in that thread.
  - LPTS 18y ago
    people link their scores to the dopamine reactions in their brain so downvotes seem more important to these non introspective fucks then a suicide.
- mojombo 18y ago
  I wasn't shocked at all. My favorite thing about HN is the community and the discussion that goes on here. I don't have comments on my blog for a reason, and it is precisely so that I don't have to deal with anonymous trolls that don't think before they comment. To me, Tom's comment was highly reminiscent of why I can't stand Reddit or Digg or YouTube comments. I expect more from HN discussions. This community has built something special. I enjoy discussing my own blog posts here specifically because trollish comments are punished. I think the reason that the downmodding was so agressive on this specific comment was that people wanted to express that actions have consequences. You post a thoughtless, off-color comment that does not legitimately address the topic at hand, and you will pay dearly for it. That being said, I applaud Tom's apology. He made a mistake in making the comment and several of the followups. We are all stupid sometimes, and it takes balls to fess up to that fact. So I forgive his remark and hope that we've all learned something from this. Let's keep HN a place where real discussions about hacking and startups can take place. Think before you comment. Is your comment contributing to the discussion, or would it be better placed on Reddit?
  - Ezra 18y ago
    Perhaps I should have been more clear: The downvoting of the joke was expected. The massive upvoting of the snarky "oh, snap" comments that followed, is what was surprising. You are supposed to upvote intelligent discourse, and downvote the cruft; ie. encourage the "community and the discussion that goes on here", and discourage the "anonymous trolls that don't think before they comment". Or at least that's how I learned it. The reverse seems to have happened. See: "indeed" +12 "memo to self: stop using ticketstumbler.com" +34 "Such a shame, but I won't be using it either." +9 "TicketStumbler founders - Get a life." +4 "You think the people on here are dumb enough to believe that what you posted was an "experiment"? You're an asshole." +21 "Just apologize for the comment, man. You're not going to change anyone's mind with a childish rant like this." +20 "Posting comments irrelevant to your initial insensitivity will not help save face, especially when you throw in an attack towards the entire crowd." +18 or the especially ironic "I actually had to scroll up to the banner to make sure I was still on Hacker News and not reddit." +12 As far as I can tell, those are on the same plane as the original comment. It was the upvoting of these (and similar) inane, and snarky one-liners that I was surprised at, not the downvoting of the comment that set it all off. Although the upvoting of the "golly gee-whiz, that's awful bad, hyuk" type comments, and the intertia of the downvoting of the subsequent comments were also surprising. It appears as if the score of some of the other comments, ie. "You're an idiot" seem to be stabilizing over time. It's no longer +5, at least.
listic 18y ago
I mean, You're an idiot isn't supposed to be a +5 comment on this site. Shoot. I tried to downvote it only to find that I can only UPvote. Maybe that's also the problem for others.
- aneesh 18y ago
  Once your karma passes a certain threshold, you will gain the ability to downvote comments.
  - jcl 18y ago
    Also, it seems you can't downvote replies to your own posts, or downvote anything older than a day or so.
    - astine 18y ago
      That, I imagine is to prevent revenge down-voting. It seems like a good idea to me.
      - unalone 18y ago
        Yep. It also occasionally locks out posts by a user in the same thread as the one in which they reply to you. Same anti-revenge idea, as far as I can see.
LPTS 18y ago
"Prosecution of anybody "egging him on?" I do want prosecution of egging someone on who is suicidal. Suicide is a medical emergency like a heart attack. Inducing a heart attack in a person with poison and inducing a suicide in a person with words are the same to me. Incitement to commit suicide should be the same as incitement to commit murder.

by Ezra 18y ago

rantfoil 18y ago

The rabid responses to Tom's post both shocked and surprised me as well. They just seemed a little bit more spirited than I would expect. It was a little schadenfreude-infused, to say the least.

greendestiny 18y ago
So wait, we're shocked and horrified at downvoting, but suicide, hey happens all the time. Do the upvotes in this thread represent anti-group think group think?
- trominos 18y ago
  We can do something about downvoting. Being gratuitously shocked and horrified at some more-or-less random kid's suicide is just obnoxious. FWIW, tdavis, I wasn't offended by your comment, except to the extent that it makes HN more reddit-like. But in that respect it was no worse than most of the comments in that thread.
- LPTS 18y ago
  people link their scores to the dopamine reactions in their brain so downvotes seem more important to these non introspective fucks then a suicide.
mojombo 18y ago
I wasn't shocked at all. My favorite thing about HN is the community and the discussion that goes on here. I don't have comments on my blog for a reason, and it is precisely so that I don't have to deal with anonymous trolls that don't think before they comment. To me, Tom's comment was highly reminiscent of why I can't stand Reddit or Digg or YouTube comments. I expect more from HN discussions. This community has built something special. I enjoy discussing my own blog posts here specifically because trollish comments are punished. I think the reason that the downmodding was so agressive on this specific comment was that people wanted to express that actions have consequences. You post a thoughtless, off-color comment that does not legitimately address the topic at hand, and you will pay dearly for it. That being said, I applaud Tom's apology. He made a mistake in making the comment and several of the followups. We are all stupid sometimes, and it takes balls to fess up to that fact. So I forgive his remark and hope that we've all learned something from this. Let's keep HN a place where real discussions about hacking and startups can take place. Think before you comment. Is your comment contributing to the discussion, or would it be better placed on Reddit?
- Ezra 18y ago
  Perhaps I should have been more clear: The downvoting of the joke was expected. The massive upvoting of the snarky "oh, snap" comments that followed, is what was surprising. You are supposed to upvote intelligent discourse, and downvote the cruft; ie. encourage the "community and the discussion that goes on here", and discourage the "anonymous trolls that don't think before they comment". Or at least that's how I learned it. The reverse seems to have happened. See: "indeed" +12 "memo to self: stop using ticketstumbler.com" +34 "Such a shame, but I won't be using it either." +9 "TicketStumbler founders - Get a life." +4 "You think the people on here are dumb enough to believe that what you posted was an "experiment"? You're an asshole." +21 "Just apologize for the comment, man. You're not going to change anyone's mind with a childish rant like this." +20 "Posting comments irrelevant to your initial insensitivity will not help save face, especially when you throw in an attack towards the entire crowd." +18 or the especially ironic "I actually had to scroll up to the banner to make sure I was still on Hacker News and not reddit." +12 As far as I can tell, those are on the same plane as the original comment. It was the upvoting of these (and similar) inane, and snarky one-liners that I was surprised at, not the downvoting of the comment that set it all off. Although the upvoting of the "golly gee-whiz, that's awful bad, hyuk" type comments, and the intertia of the downvoting of the subsequent comments were also surprising. It appears as if the score of some of the other comments, ie. "You're an idiot" seem to be stabilizing over time. It's no longer +5, at least.

listic 18y ago

I mean, You're an idiot isn't supposed to be a +5 comment on this site. Shoot. I tried to downvote it only to find that I can only UPvote. Maybe that's also the problem for others.

aneesh 18y ago
Once your karma passes a certain threshold, you will gain the ability to downvote comments.
- jcl 18y ago
  Also, it seems you can't downvote replies to your own posts, or downvote anything older than a day or so.
  - astine 18y ago
    That, I imagine is to prevent revenge down-voting. It seems like a good idea to me.
    - unalone 18y ago
      Yep. It also occasionally locks out posts by a user in the same thread as the one in which they reply to you. Same anti-revenge idea, as far as I can see.

LPTS 18y ago

"Prosecution of anybody "egging him on?" I do want prosecution of egging someone on who is suicidal. Suicide is a medical emergency like a heart attack. Inducing a heart attack in a person with poison and inducing a suicide in a person with words are the same to me. Incitement to commit suicide should be the same as incitement to commit murder.