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There is a reasonable argument that, as a minor nobody, we should rather use services from hostile countries. It isn't feasible for Russia to to compel someone

by roenxi 3y ago

There is a reasonable argument that, as a minor nobody, we should rather use services from hostile countries. It isn't feasible for Russia to to compel someone in an English-speaking country to do something unpleasant. That is a lot more than can be said for the local police or politicians. Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments - the atmosphere is too hostile to it.

0xDEF 3y ago
>Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments - the atmosphere is too hostile to it. Brussels, Vienna, and many other European capitals are full of Russian "lobbyists".
di456 3y ago
> Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments - the atmosphere is too hostile to it. Some recent parts of the government welcome the corruption. https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizens-and-russian-intelligence-officers-charged-conspiring-use-us-citizens-illegal https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizens-and-russian-intel... https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/16/us/politics/election-interference-russia-2020-assessment.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/16/us/politics/election-inte...
barbariangrunge 3y ago
I don’t know, you’ve never heard of blackmail? $500 in Bitcoin to some wallet or we leak your search results to your church group?
- suslik 3y ago
  How would they connect search results to an individual? Surely, a simple VPN, which is a basic internet hygene these days, prevents that.
  - ludwik 3y ago
    That's what AOL thought when they released the anonymized search data of their users (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AOL_search_log_release https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AOL_search_log_release). Turns out they were very wrong.
dindobre 3y ago
>Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments No offense but the fact that someone on HN could get to this conclusion is rather shocking to me. Western Europe has plenty of russian corruption and I'm afraid the ongoing war has unearthed only a fraction of it.
- slashdev 3y ago
  For example?
  - throw-ru-938 3y ago
    There's probably no hard proof, but Russia is allegedly funding far-right movements like AfD and whatever Le Pen's party in France is now called. Also, see the career of Gerhard Schroeder, first German chancellor and then a top Gazprom official.
    - tri5635hhfgvv5r 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - oneshtein 3y ago
        Russia is very lucky that someone blown up their stopped pipe-line, because that saved them many billions in fines for violation of supply contract. They also very lucky that working pipeline is not blown up.
      - reducesuffering 3y ago
        Actually they are very credible; pretty much objective facts. Putin’s inner circle spokesman, Dmitri Peskov, had his daughter Elizaveta as an assistant to the far-right Aymeric Chauprade, a French Member of the European Parliament.[0] You will see “coincidentally” similar connections across major western powers like the UK, US, Germany, and Italy. [0] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/25/daughter-putin-spokesman-dmitry-peskov-working-far-right-french/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/25/daughter-putin-s...
gostsamo 3y ago
check how many western politicians went to work for gasprom or other russian government companies and talk again.
ClumsyPilot 3y ago
> Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments Russia has an asset in British goverbment, in the hoise of lords! Have you neber heard of Baron Lebedev, of Hampton in the London Borough of Richmond upon Thames and of Siberia in the Russian Federation?? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evgeny_Lebedev https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evgeny_Lebedev Current Government was taking political dotations from Russian oligarchs, officially, but somehow thos gets postes https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-58711151 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-58711151
alwayslikethis 3y ago
I have a better way to frame this. A hostile country is less interested in low profile users and is not as able/willing to use the data it collects against the user. Committed tax evasion / breach of contract / fraud? Russia is much less likely to care than your own government.
- speed_spread 3y ago
  You're framing it wrong. They _care_ very much. They even have a word for it! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kompromat https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kompromat
  - the-printer 3y ago
    For what it's worth, the examples given on that page are either domestic instances or do not, as your parent comment describes, involve low profile individuals.
AlecSchueler 3y ago
But it's a fallacy to see the concern being about them having your individual data, right? The concern is the power of the information they yield when they have access to our collective data.
Toutouxc 3y ago
Many Jews got killed in the 40s because they'd registered themselves as Jews many years back, way before Hitler was a thing. A lot of Ukrainians suddenly found themselves on Russian [claimed] soil and under Russian jurisdiction just a few months ago. There are certain nations before which I'm not going to incriminate myself, out of precaution, Russia and China among them.
- slashdev 3y ago
  If my country suddenly becomes Russian or China occupied territory, them having my search history is very far down my list of worries.
  - oneshtein 3y ago
    They may send killers just for you. For example, they are killing Holodomor researchers around the world (genocide of Ukrainians in 1932-1934: 25 millions were starved to death, 20 millions are recorded as Russian, millions were killed or executed).
    - slashdev 3y ago
      No, they won’t, because I’m nobody to them. If you’re some kind of public enemy of Russia, maybe don’t use Russian services of any variety.
      - oneshtein 3y ago
        > No, they won’t, because I’m nobody to them. I can tell you more about Holodomor.
      - justinclift 3y ago
        > No, they won’t, because I’m nobody to them. Maybe today. Who knows about the future though? :)
      - winrid 3y ago
        Your character arc is just getting started :)
blackpelican 3y ago
The UK is significantly influenced by Russia. Brexit is a prime, recent example, as well as the frequent donations from oligarchs to the Conservative party
- mayd 3y ago
  Your claim that Russia influenced Brexit, which the Cameron-led Conservative government opposed, has been thoroughly debunked, as has the Trump-Russia collusion hoax in the US. Indeed, a certain Guardian "journalist", who promoted the Brexit-Russia influence hoax, lost a defamation case against her for falsely promoting it. The UK, which is currently governed by a Conservative party majority parliament, has also been, from the start, one of the most aggressive and dependable supporters of Ukraine in her struggle to resist the Russian invasion. So, I am wondering, to what kind of "significant influence" are you alluding?

by roenxi 3y ago

0xDEF 3y ago

>Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments - the atmosphere is too hostile to it. Brussels, Vienna, and many other European capitals are full of Russian "lobbyists".

di456 3y ago

> Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments - the atmosphere is too hostile to it. Some recent parts of the government welcome the corruption. https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizens-and-russian-intelligence-officers-charged-conspiring-use-us-citizens-illegal https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizens-and-russian-intel... https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/16/us/politics/election-interference-russia-2020-assessment.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/16/us/politics/election-inte...

barbariangrunge 3y ago

I don’t know, you’ve never heard of blackmail? $500 in Bitcoin to some wallet or we leak your search results to your church group?

suslik 3y ago
How would they connect search results to an individual? Surely, a simple VPN, which is a basic internet hygene these days, prevents that.
- ludwik 3y ago
  That's what AOL thought when they released the anonymized search data of their users (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AOL_search_log_release https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AOL_search_log_release). Turns out they were very wrong.

dindobre 3y ago

>Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments No offense but the fact that someone on HN could get to this conclusion is rather shocking to me. Western Europe has plenty of russian corruption and I'm afraid the ongoing war has unearthed only a fraction of it.

slashdev 3y ago
For example?
- throw-ru-938 3y ago
  There's probably no hard proof, but Russia is allegedly funding far-right movements like AfD and whatever Le Pen's party in France is now called. Also, see the career of Gerhard Schroeder, first German chancellor and then a top Gazprom official.
  - tri5635hhfgvv5r 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - oneshtein 3y ago
      Russia is very lucky that someone blown up their stopped pipe-line, because that saved them many billions in fines for violation of supply contract. They also very lucky that working pipeline is not blown up.
    - reducesuffering 3y ago
      Actually they are very credible; pretty much objective facts. Putin’s inner circle spokesman, Dmitri Peskov, had his daughter Elizaveta as an assistant to the far-right Aymeric Chauprade, a French Member of the European Parliament.[0] You will see “coincidentally” similar connections across major western powers like the UK, US, Germany, and Italy. [0] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/25/daughter-putin-spokesman-dmitry-peskov-working-far-right-french/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/25/daughter-putin-s...

gostsamo 3y ago

check how many western politicians went to work for gasprom or other russian government companies and talk again.

ClumsyPilot 3y ago

> Russian corruption doesn't generally touch Western governments Russia has an asset in British goverbment, in the hoise of lords! Have you neber heard of Baron Lebedev, of Hampton in the London Borough of Richmond upon Thames and of Siberia in the Russian Federation?? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evgeny_Lebedev https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evgeny_Lebedev Current Government was taking political dotations from Russian oligarchs, officially, but somehow thos gets postes https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-58711151 https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-58711151

alwayslikethis 3y ago

I have a better way to frame this. A hostile country is less interested in low profile users and is not as able/willing to use the data it collects against the user. Committed tax evasion / breach of contract / fraud? Russia is much less likely to care than your own government.

speed_spread 3y ago
You're framing it wrong. They _care_ very much. They even have a word for it! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kompromat https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kompromat
- the-printer 3y ago
  For what it's worth, the examples given on that page are either domestic instances or do not, as your parent comment describes, involve low profile individuals.

AlecSchueler 3y ago

But it's a fallacy to see the concern being about them having your individual data, right? The concern is the power of the information they yield when they have access to our collective data.

Toutouxc 3y ago

Many Jews got killed in the 40s because they'd registered themselves as Jews many years back, way before Hitler was a thing. A lot of Ukrainians suddenly found themselves on Russian [claimed] soil and under Russian jurisdiction just a few months ago. There are certain nations before which I'm not going to incriminate myself, out of precaution, Russia and China among them.

slashdev 3y ago
If my country suddenly becomes Russian or China occupied territory, them having my search history is very far down my list of worries.
- oneshtein 3y ago
  They may send killers just for you. For example, they are killing Holodomor researchers around the world (genocide of Ukrainians in 1932-1934: 25 millions were starved to death, 20 millions are recorded as Russian, millions were killed or executed).
  - slashdev 3y ago
    No, they won’t, because I’m nobody to them. If you’re some kind of public enemy of Russia, maybe don’t use Russian services of any variety.
    - oneshtein 3y ago
      > No, they won’t, because I’m nobody to them. I can tell you more about Holodomor.
    - justinclift 3y ago
      > No, they won’t, because I’m nobody to them. Maybe today. Who knows about the future though? :)
    - winrid 3y ago
      Your character arc is just getting started :)

blackpelican 3y ago

The UK is significantly influenced by Russia. Brexit is a prime, recent example, as well as the frequent donations from oligarchs to the Conservative party

mayd 3y ago
Your claim that Russia influenced Brexit, which the Cameron-led Conservative government opposed, has been thoroughly debunked, as has the Trump-Russia collusion hoax in the US. Indeed, a certain Guardian "journalist", who promoted the Brexit-Russia influence hoax, lost a defamation case against her for falsely promoting it. The UK, which is currently governed by a Conservative party majority parliament, has also been, from the start, one of the most aggressive and dependable supporters of Ukraine in her struggle to resist the Russian invasion. So, I am wondering, to what kind of "significant influence" are you alluding?