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Will the Kenyan government now have access to the biometric data collected by Worldcoin?

MBCook 3y ago
Just how bad this is would depend on how they stored the data, I guess. Why does it feel like they probably keep WAY more data than they need instead of just the hash? Glad they’ve been shut down at least.
- danpalmer 3y ago
  I bet there's a really well understood data store that contains minimal data and meets various anonymity proofs. And then a tag-manager implementation with MixPanel, Intercom, Amplitude, Heap, FullStory, and Segment, all receiving every interaction with a full JSON object describing the current state of the application and user.
  - tristor 3y ago
    Ugh. This is probably the true nature of the thing, it's shocking how this happens at nearly every company I've been at. Eng is super concerned with privacy and security, and then as soon as Marketing gets a hold of it, it's all coated in 6 layers of analytics for funnel tracking leads.
    - danpalmer 3y ago
      I need to write a blog post about the time an ad network told me that their required integration was to integrate their JS bundle that would send all text input to their servers. When I told them No Fucking Way (in not that many more words), they said they would need to get executive sign-off on a "custom" integration. The "custom" bit being us doing everything ourselves server-side and sending them a single opaque identifier for conversions.
- uLogMicheal 3y ago
  They "securely" store the iris codes so that their machines can check for duplicates. They have the database even if the crypto crashes.
- alwa 3y ago
  Molly White points out [0] that they seem to have gotten awfully vague about what they store, emphasizing in some contexts that the hashes on the chain are all that technically HAVE to be retained (and encouraging the assumption that those themselves are rigorously impossible to extrapolate personal information from)— but also insinuating to people at en-Orb-ment that they need to opt in to letting the company store full imagery of their iris scans in case the company decides to change the hash algorithm someday. [0] https://newsletter.mollywhite.net/p/worldcoin-a-solution-in-search-of https://newsletter.mollywhite.net/p/worldcoin-a-solution-in-...
  - MBCook 3y ago
    Full iris images is exactly what I expect/am afraid of.
    - JohnFen 3y ago
      I think that hashes of the full iris images aren't much better.
      - MBCook 3y ago
        It’s a little better. To be useful someone else has to use the same hashing algorithm. Assuming the hash isn’t usefully reversible. A picture could work with any algorithm. They’re both bad though.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    > emphasizing in some contexts that the hashes on the chain are all that technically HAVE to be retained Even the context of the primary reason they cite for collecting retinal data (to prevent the same person from getting $50 multiple times) requires they keep this data for at least as long as they're paying people to scan their eyeballs.
    - ahtihn 3y ago
      Why do they need the original to prevent people to get paid multiple times? What good is the hash they're storing if the same person's retinas don't reliably produce the same hash?
Timber-6539 3y ago
Well, Worldcoin claims the data captured by the orb (face & iris scan) is deleted after the corresponding ID is generated from it. https://worldcoin.org/blog/worldcoin/orb-faqs https://worldcoin.org/blog/worldcoin/orb-faqs
stainablesteel 3y ago
i assumed that was the point

Just how bad this is would depend on how they stored the data, I guess. Why does it feel like they probably keep WAY more data than they need instead of just the hash? Glad they’ve been shut down at least.

danpalmer 3y ago
I bet there's a really well understood data store that contains minimal data and meets various anonymity proofs. And then a tag-manager implementation with MixPanel, Intercom, Amplitude, Heap, FullStory, and Segment, all receiving every interaction with a full JSON object describing the current state of the application and user.
- tristor 3y ago
  Ugh. This is probably the true nature of the thing, it's shocking how this happens at nearly every company I've been at. Eng is super concerned with privacy and security, and then as soon as Marketing gets a hold of it, it's all coated in 6 layers of analytics for funnel tracking leads.
  - danpalmer 3y ago
    I need to write a blog post about the time an ad network told me that their required integration was to integrate their JS bundle that would send all text input to their servers. When I told them No Fucking Way (in not that many more words), they said they would need to get executive sign-off on a "custom" integration. The "custom" bit being us doing everything ourselves server-side and sending them a single opaque identifier for conversions.
uLogMicheal 3y ago
They "securely" store the iris codes so that their machines can check for duplicates. They have the database even if the crypto crashes.
alwa 3y ago
Molly White points out [0] that they seem to have gotten awfully vague about what they store, emphasizing in some contexts that the hashes on the chain are all that technically HAVE to be retained (and encouraging the assumption that those themselves are rigorously impossible to extrapolate personal information from)— but also insinuating to people at en-Orb-ment that they need to opt in to letting the company store full imagery of their iris scans in case the company decides to change the hash algorithm someday. [0] https://newsletter.mollywhite.net/p/worldcoin-a-solution-in-search-of https://newsletter.mollywhite.net/p/worldcoin-a-solution-in-...
- MBCook 3y ago
  Full iris images is exactly what I expect/am afraid of.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    I think that hashes of the full iris images aren't much better.
    - MBCook 3y ago
      It’s a little better. To be useful someone else has to use the same hashing algorithm. Assuming the hash isn’t usefully reversible. A picture could work with any algorithm. They’re both bad though.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > emphasizing in some contexts that the hashes on the chain are all that technically HAVE to be retained Even the context of the primary reason they cite for collecting retinal data (to prevent the same person from getting $50 multiple times) requires they keep this data for at least as long as they're paying people to scan their eyeballs.
  - ahtihn 3y ago
    Why do they need the original to prevent people to get paid multiple times? What good is the hash they're storing if the same person's retinas don't reliably produce the same hash?

Timber-6539 3y ago

Well, Worldcoin claims the data captured by the orb (face & iris scan) is deleted after the corresponding ID is generated from it. https://worldcoin.org/blog/worldcoin/orb-faqs https://worldcoin.org/blog/worldcoin/orb-faqs

stainablesteel 3y ago

i assumed that was the point