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Area 51 FBI Raid (2023)
- UnlockedSecrets 3y agoThis seems very light on actual details on what happened, whom they are, etcetera without being asked to search through 100 pages to uncover each detail?
- owlninja 3y agoAnd they've raised 17 thousand bucks so far.
- rudyfink 3y agoHere are some news articles that have covered the raid: -https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/your-air-force/2022/11/18/air-force-fbi-raid-homes-of-man-with-area-51-website/ https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/your-air-force/2022/11/18... -https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/joerg-arnu-area-51-fbi-raid-b2368462.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/joerg-arnu... -https://nypost.com/2022/11/17/federal-agents-raid-nevada-homes-of-area-51-website-founder/ https://nypost.com/2022/11/17/federal-agents-raid-nevada-hom...
- idiotsecant 3y agolooks like the FBI busted down his door, took all his stuff 6 months ago and never charged him with a crime or returned any property. Seems bad enough to me on the surface. I have to admit I am intensely curious about what hit this big of a nerve with the feds.
- rolph 3y agolikely posting pix and panorams of the base along with analysis of observations For Anyone To See.
- whartung 3y agoMy read from one of the warrants is that the FBI et al can keep anything pertaining to the investigation. Apparently after 6 months, that investigation is still active. This is why they’re not commenting on anything or returning anything. Honestly this all seems pretty normal based solely on a long history of TV watching. I mean the investigation may not even be primarily about him. Who knows what it’s all about. IANAL.
- helsinkiandrew 3y agoThe search warrants are relating to “information and records about military installations and their operation”. Taking photos and flying drones at classified military locations is probably what hit the nerve of the feds.
- Lammy 3y agoHe's the guy who runs this website https://dreamlandresort.com/ https://dreamlandresort.com/ The warrants cite "Photographing and Sketching Defense Installations" a.k.a. it's over stuff like this https://dreamlandresort.com/area51/panorama_0523.html https://dreamlandresort.com/area51/panorama_0523.html
- predictabl3 3y agoWell, this was interesting, even if I have no idea what I'm looking at and my skepticism about all things remains high.
- ethanbond 3y agoYou’re looking at free intel provided to China/Russia etc about US next generation weapons capabilities! They develop aircraft here, stuff that is wildly important to the (current) global security regime. Not a thing I’d personally want to be recklessly/ignorantly poking and prodding by releasing photos like that.
- PrimeMcFly 3y agoThen the military ought to choose a better location, somewhere a civilian with a good camera can't take such compromising photos.
- scrum-treats 3y agoso... time travel back to pre-2020s?
- downvotetruth 3y agoAlaska tundra would probably be the best spot given the absence of people, cloud cover, ice as runway, and cold for engine efficiency. Would be interesting to know how many mountain tops would need to be closed to stop the ground cameras for 51.
- o11c 3y ago"Do not take photos of secret military installations (especially using drones)" seems a relevant takeaway. It's disingenuous that he says "I didn't do anything illegal" when the search warrants lists the laws that were broken. Though the fact that it's basically vandalism is still concerning. But the photos only show door damage, not sure where those $numbers are coming from.
- Lammy 3y agoCan't take photos of equipment that's been confiscated (computers, any external storage, etc)
- o11c 3y agoThe $numbers are specified separately for "taken" and "damaged".
- ethanbond 3y agoGoing through the website linked above it’s pretty obvious this would be a huge, huge security problem for an installation like that and yeah, ultimately for the nation.
- cycomanic 3y agoSo if he has broken a law why is he not being charged? What happened to due process? If they are not charging him it has at least not been determined by law that he has broken the law, in fact he has not even been formally accused of it. Still he is being punished with $30,000. I wonder how you would react if the police would take e.g. your car under the pretence of "we think you might have been speeding" and after six month you still have not have your car returned, or been actually fined (or taken to court for speeding). But the only comment on a forum is "well he should have been speeding".
- doubleg72 3y agoCause taking photos of military installation is equivalent to a summary offense such as speeding, huh?
- cycomanic 3y agoI had no idea of the whole issue and it took my all of 10min reading to understand what happened. I know the attention economy requires immediate gratification, but I thought we are better than this here at HN. If you're not interested enough to read a page or two, why comment?
- underlipton 3y agoI was a little bewildered when I first opened this. My mind immediately went to, "Is this... an ARG?" But, no, just police overreach and fundamental rights infringement. Actually kind of appropriate for Area "Is it aliens, the proof that we're not alone in the universe, suspicions vindicated that our government - one that is the most powerful in the world and yet unable to solve problems less wealthy countries have a handle on - is hiding its true capabilities from us? No, just more sophisticated ways to kill people." 51.
- TechBro8615 3y ago[flagged]
- kanbara 3y agoi very much doubt the hyperbole here. i’m _very_ acab, and hugely against domestic overreach, but to call it soviet union style is pretty ridiculous, and belittles the actual horrors of the stalinist regime
- artificialLimbs 3y agoIt won’t take many steps when the government monitors all communications and has cameras nearly everywhere.
- ofalkaed 3y agoThe people get who the people deserve. The bulk of the population wants a police state, they just want the police state which panders to their views of what is right, hence the heavy right vs left views. Democracy requires diversity of idea to work.
- hatware 3y ago[dead]
- 29athrowaway 3y agoSome people think they want a police state. But they won't like it once implemented.
- ofalkaed 3y agoNah, it just will not be the police state they wanted.
- simple-thoughts 3y agoNo they will like it. A great book on the topic is “Hitlers Beneficiaries”. Most people like the idea of punishing their out group.
- morninglight 3y agoWhere is Art Bell when we need him? http://stream3.u7radio.org:8500/ http://stream3.u7radio.org:8500/ http://198.27.120.235:8450/ http://198.27.120.235:8450/
- AYBABTME 3y agoUnchanged opinion since last submitted: some obsessive person is consistently and purposefully trying to dig out defense secrets while somehow being incredule that anyone would have any problems with it. Doesn't inspire much sympathy. When your delusions turn you into an unbeknownst foreign intelligence assets, I guess it's a bit sad but also... tough luck?
- whatshisface 3y ago>When your delusions turn you into an unbeknownst foreign intelligence asset Could you at least wait until we're at war before you bring out the usual wartime justifications for unconstitutionally restricting civilian's freedom of speech? From the linked website, >I was never given a reason for the raid, nor have I been charged with a crime. In fact, I have not heard from the FBI since the day of the raid. I have done nothing illegal.
- Eisenstein 3y agoQuestions: 1. Do you think that confiscation of property for use in an investigation is unconstitutional? 2. Do you think that prosecutors need to be able to press charges as soon as or soon after the execution of a search warrant? If so, what is a reasonable time frame? 3. Do you think that people who regularly obsess over and take pictures of secure military installations are reliable witnesses regarding their own actions? 4. What do you propose be done in this case?
- whatshisface 3y ago1. "Unreasonable" search and seizure includes taking stuff from people, keeping it forever, and never giving it back despite taking arbitrarily long to charge them. 2. The sixth amendment guarantees the right to a speedy trial. If law enforcement has a good reason to hold you or your belongings, it is in anticipation of a trial. I don't think the police have a right to hold on to your stuff forever only for the shortest reasonable time as determined by the speed of the judicial system, not "until they crack the case enough to figure out whether it was you." 3. There is a time and a place for determining who is a reliable witness of what. 4. That the FBI either give this guy his PC back or press the espionage charges you come across as believing (with no evidence) he could be found guilty of.
- tiahura 3y agoI’m unsure if a practical political philosophy exists that doesn’t endorse halting efforts to expose defense secrets. I may not fully agree with the majority of the world - where such endeavors might promptly be met with a bullet between the eyes - yet, if you only lost some gear, you should likely consider yourself lucky.
- freitzkriesler2 3y agoArea 51 is an air force base that's used to test experimental aircraft, nothing more. The ayy lmao obsessors need to move on. There are far more too secret bases out there that could hold actual aliens but they're all stuck up on this salt flat in the desert.
- Lammy 3y ago> used to test experimental aircraft This is the reason I think it's interesting though
- freitzkriesler2 3y agoTrue, some of these top secret crafts are something else. There's a reason why America never bothered to develop hypersonic missiles.
- WesolyKubeczek 3y agoAs someone whose home country is currently at war, I wouldn’t mind if the guy was also publicly flogged with some BDSM implements for extra humiliation. “Nothing illegal”, my arse… There are reasons you shouldn’t be publicizing defense facilities photos, some folks had to learn it the hard way.
- throwaway589458 3y agoI am very sympathetic to wartime necessitates but I would ask why fight to remain free if not to enjoy the freedom, including filming the government from a legal vantage, in times of peace?
- aa1234556 3y ago[dead]
- WesolyKubeczek 3y agoBecause you cannot reasonably predict if and for how long times of peace are going to last, and if they suddenly stop, you're in top 10 contributors to fucking up the defense position. Sure it's assumed that espionage exists and that leaks will happen, but if some aggressive "They" come for you and yours and have a very easy time because you specifically have done all the recon for them, you're going to realize just how fucking stupid of you it has been. There are other areas of government you can, and should put a pressure on, but jeopardizing one's own defense is the most brain damaged way to go about it. I would surely make a fuss if open/public/declassified information sources point at egregious inefficiencies of defense. I want more killer robodogs like they had in that Black Mirror episode, powerful and resiliend mine removal equipment, and swarms of inexpensive lethal and recon drones with dozens of lethal heavy drones to follow them please, not some swindle like a fence painted for $500k or something to that tune. I'm ok with many halfway failed killer robodog projects, though.
- xp84 3y agoTo what end though, do you need to take such pictures? What aspect of your life is enhanced by documenting and publishing the photos of these military bases? If you accept that it’s best that a country has a strong defense, and that part of that is your enemy not knowing literally everything you’ve got, then you accept that some things should be kept secret. And secret means nothing if they make no effort to stop people from snooping and then publishing everything online.
- ChoHag 3y ago[dead]
- _8j50 3y agoI tried to go to area51 once. You can't even begin the trip there on ground without getting on gravel roads patrolled by unmakred cars with guys that have automatic machine guns driving them. Not to mention the locals from Parhump in NV to further away in Shoshone,CA everyone kept asking me wtf I was doing there. The moment I mentioned area 51, I thought they'd think it was about aliens (it was sort of, but not seriously, just pop culture curiosity) but everyone got very serious suspecting me of trying to spy on behalf of some foreign country perhaps. My read was people getting paid to sneak and take pictures of area51 secret military stuff is not uncommon. I honestly thought, given the publicity, the government would only test not-so-secret stuff area51. There are more isolated places in central and northern nevada for even more secret lairs.
- euroderf 3y agoI've always wondered why someone just doesn't set up an unattended camera to transmit pictures in real time. But I guess these guys operating extralegally would do something.