3 ms·

I've noticed this too - it's horrifying. Just the complete ambivalence to death. From covid to gun deaths, traffic accidents + pedestrians being killed by cars

I've noticed this too - it's horrifying. Just the complete ambivalence to death. From covid to gun deaths, traffic accidents + pedestrians being killed by cars to overdoses and suicides. Not to mention all the preventable deaths from lack of access to medical care. If the solution involves "the state", we'd rather just not bother and fighting "government overreach" at the cost of mass death is a completely common position. No license plate cameras, no gun registries, no mental health institution funding, no universal health care. People are starting to overturn vaccines rules about preventing childhood diseases. Rather than acknowledge the utility of some of these interventions and work around any potential downside, just rule out any coordinated action and hope for the best.

ryandrake 3y ago
Those numerous and recent examples you listed show us that many people would actually rather die and/or contribute to others dying than be told what to do. Rugged Individualism has become elevated to near pseudo-religion, that people are swearing their lives to.
- shrimp_emoji 3y ago
  Do you value life more, or freedom more? The answer may change, generation to generation.
  - Grum9 3y ago
    [dead]
- meinmissoula 3y ago
  This whole thread really just makes me realize how severe our filter bubbles, echo chambers and distrust of "the other side" has become. Nobody wants poor people to die and nobody has a religious adherence to "rugged individualism". If you go actually talk to people who disagree with you, instead of reading ridiculous descriptions of their motivations from people inside your bubble who hate them, you might gain an appreciation of their concerns. I'm amazed at how 4 years of the Trump administration didn't result in Liberals becoming much more open-minded to Libertarian concerns about concentrated power in the federal government. How did we come through that experience without more people saying "OK, I get it now, maybe I don't want so much power and control over my life held by the white house".
  - klipklop 3y ago
    100% correct. You hit the nail right on the head. People are dehumanizing other groups by refusing to actually speak with them. This makes it easier for them to discriminate against such groups. The end game of the dehumanizing process is not good if you follow history at all. People in general are much more reasonable in person than the internet would lead you to believe.
mattpallissard 3y ago
It's not that people are ambivalent to death. It's that a certain amount of death is going to happen. You can't legislate it away. Some of us think we've reached the point of diminishing returns on many topics and don't think giving up liberties will do much good. No I don't want cameras. No I don't want backdoor encryption. No I don't want gun registries. No I don't want the Fed's to have more money or power. They are not looking out for our best interests most of the time.
- mikeyouse 3y ago
  Hackernews never fails to deliver. The comments here are perfectly indicative. Pretending that implementing a sane healthcare system like Germany or Switzerland is "giving up liberty" relies on the assumption that the tens of millions of Americans without healthcare somehow have more "freedom" than they otherwise would if they could get regular checkups or receive health care that doesn't bankrupt them. Or that there's somehow "freedom" in being tied to a job you don't like solely because of the health insurance coverage. We already more pay per capita for government-run healthcare than e.g. Canada does, except it only covers our poorest and oldest citizens. Just a silly selfish view of 'freedom'.
  - PlunderBunny 3y ago
    Agree - someone that's dead has no freedom at all.
    - dontknowwhyihn 3y ago
      And someone who is free can choose to be as cautious as they please. They just can’t force their choices on everyone else.
      - PlunderBunny 3y ago
        I’m not sure I understand - are you arguing that universal healthcare is having a choice forced on you?
  - 3y ago

ryandrake 3y ago

Those numerous and recent examples you listed show us that many people would actually rather die and/or contribute to others dying than be told what to do. Rugged Individualism has become elevated to near pseudo-religion, that people are swearing their lives to.

shrimp_emoji 3y ago
Do you value life more, or freedom more? The answer may change, generation to generation.
- Grum9 3y ago
  [dead]
meinmissoula 3y ago
This whole thread really just makes me realize how severe our filter bubbles, echo chambers and distrust of "the other side" has become. Nobody wants poor people to die and nobody has a religious adherence to "rugged individualism". If you go actually talk to people who disagree with you, instead of reading ridiculous descriptions of their motivations from people inside your bubble who hate them, you might gain an appreciation of their concerns. I'm amazed at how 4 years of the Trump administration didn't result in Liberals becoming much more open-minded to Libertarian concerns about concentrated power in the federal government. How did we come through that experience without more people saying "OK, I get it now, maybe I don't want so much power and control over my life held by the white house".
- klipklop 3y ago
  100% correct. You hit the nail right on the head. People are dehumanizing other groups by refusing to actually speak with them. This makes it easier for them to discriminate against such groups. The end game of the dehumanizing process is not good if you follow history at all. People in general are much more reasonable in person than the internet would lead you to believe.

mattpallissard 3y ago

It's not that people are ambivalent to death. It's that a certain amount of death is going to happen. You can't legislate it away. Some of us think we've reached the point of diminishing returns on many topics and don't think giving up liberties will do much good. No I don't want cameras. No I don't want backdoor encryption. No I don't want gun registries. No I don't want the Fed's to have more money or power. They are not looking out for our best interests most of the time.

mikeyouse 3y ago
Hackernews never fails to deliver. The comments here are perfectly indicative. Pretending that implementing a sane healthcare system like Germany or Switzerland is "giving up liberty" relies on the assumption that the tens of millions of Americans without healthcare somehow have more "freedom" than they otherwise would if they could get regular checkups or receive health care that doesn't bankrupt them. Or that there's somehow "freedom" in being tied to a job you don't like solely because of the health insurance coverage. We already more pay per capita for government-run healthcare than e.g. Canada does, except it only covers our poorest and oldest citizens. Just a silly selfish view of 'freedom'.
- PlunderBunny 3y ago
  Agree - someone that's dead has no freedom at all.
  - dontknowwhyihn 3y ago
    And someone who is free can choose to be as cautious as they please. They just can’t force their choices on everyone else.
    - PlunderBunny 3y ago
      I’m not sure I understand - are you arguing that universal healthcare is having a choice forced on you?
- 3y ago