6 ms·

Uber CEO surprised after Wired reporter pays $51 for a 2.9-mile Uber ride

35 points by PeterCorless 3y ago

stevenicr 3y ago
Some years ago I was part of the group that joked that public transportation systems in our city were no longer needed since uber / lyft were so cheap. Fast forward a bit, not long ago I checked lyft for a ride to the library for the youngster, it's 1.8 miles - that was $14 at the time (rates have risen since then apparently) - so $28 (without tips) to and from the library for under 4 miles, not quite what the wired reported paid, but that was already too rich imho.
- dublin 3y ago
  And now that tipping at ridiculous rates is effectively mandatory, they've priced themselves right out of the market. Interestingly, there is a pattern here with most "sharing" services - far more than just rides: AirBNB and VRBO are now postively rapacious in their pricing. What was once decent pricing 5-6 years ago would now make Shylock blush with embarrassment...
  - j1elo 3y ago
    Could you elaborate on why and how tipping at ridiculous rates is effectively mandatory? Genuinely curious. In Europe, I just book a ride in the app, get brought to my destination, say goodbye to the driver, the service's price is automatically charged on my bank account, and I go on with my plans. It does ask for a tip (between 0.50 € to maybe 4 € or so, if I recall correctly) and a rating if you are looking at the app. So maybe give 5 starts as a way to help the driver if they were good and there is some free time to kill. But as far as I know, most people just ignore it and dismiss any extra dialogs after the trip. Are you from the US, and would you say that the culture of almost-mandatory tipping in bars & restaurants also applies for services like Uber?
    - stevenicr 3y ago
      <- I'm not the person who were replying to asking the question, so I am not answering for them.. but being the US watching this tipping thing unfold the past 10 years especially has been quite interesting. There was a time when only a few held their hand out, hotel bag carriers, bartenders, food waitresses and strippers mainly.. I think starbucks really pushed tipping into more regular spaces as a whole, and 'influencer' youtube / insta 'models' - and the like have it all extra cool and extra normal.. Now in the 2020's it's common to see people paint thier venmo Id on thier car with 'just got married / graduated / send me a money/drink via cashap.. etc. It's been exacerbated the adding of 'add a tip' on payment devices at places (like starbcuks) and during check out for ordering pizza via web portals.. then you see stories where the pizza place is using door dash instead of their own drivers and places keeping tips.. The rideshare apps ask for a tip at the end of the ride and people worry that tipping or not affects' their rider rating, and there are many people who do not understand that uber drivers are not paid like a regular salary or hourly wage. to see it's added effects - do a news search and see the dozens of 'door dash' (and similar) drivers who demand money when delivering food, beg for money, throw the food, decide to eat it - or otherwise ruin food deliveries because the tip was not high enough -there's been a lot. (one recently cussed at a guy for tipping 30% on an order because the driver felt like the house the person was at was so nice that they should have to tip more) It's a thing with all these gig-workers doing all these things hoping for a tip so bad because they are not making enough money to pay bill and do car (and proper human) maintenance.. There have been several news stories about 'tipping fatigue' that explain it a but here recently as well. Tips requested via digital payment portals at places that have no cashier / wait staff.. It's hitting a boiling point where people are stopping using services where it's asked - and that's adding to other pressures.
      - nullindividual 3y ago
        Tipping at Starbucks is not new. It’s been common since the 90s. What is different is that CC did not used to ask for a tip on the POS.
        stevenicr 3y ago
- WeylandYutani 3y ago
  Taxis in my country have always been for the rich, invalid and dumb tourists. Uber was able to heavily subsidize their operation for a while and a few drivers got rich until money ran out. Probably a win for the environment to be honest.
tekla 3y ago
So what side should I take? The reporter who thinks they were ripped off, without taking public transit? or The driver who got a decent payout driving in one of the most expensive cities on earth?
- FireBeyond 3y ago
  The driver who Uber says got a decent payout. The journalist should have asked to see the distribution of that money for this trip.
  - tekla 3y ago
    Its well known that ~25% is what Uber takes from the fare. Everything else is broken out by fee. The author should post receipt
    - profile53 3y ago
      I’ve chatted with about a dozen Uber drivers about this and it’s between 40-60 percent. This is in half a dozen different locales at all times of the day.
      - tekla 3y ago
        If thats the case, good! The driver makes more money in absolute terms still.
        profile53 3y ago
        I don’t think the driver benefits in this arrangement. I suppose I should provide an example. On a $60 airport fare, Uber+Fees was about $35 and the driver received $25. Two years ago, that trip was maybe $40, so if Uber took 25% and taxes took some, the driver would’ve received $26-28. More so, even if the driver received more in absolute terms per trip (e.g. in some other $60 fares, the driver received $30-32), the increased price due to Uber’s cut results in less people riding and less total fares. Then, even if the driver makes more per trip, they’ll make less over all.
FireBeyond 3y ago
> With Uber, the vast majority of your fare is going to your driver. I would have called him on that. "Hey, can we look up this exact trip and see exactly how much of that went to the driver, then?"
- tekla 3y ago
  Sure, I would love to the see the receipt from the author
- shove 3y ago
  If Wired did actual journalism, they’d have done that
- HyprMusic 3y ago
  Based off my many conversations with Uber drivers, Uber takes 40% in the UK (including from tips). Sure it's a majority but I think "vast majority" is a bit of a stretch.
  - solumunus 3y ago
    That’s terrible.
  - bspammer 3y ago
    The help section on the Uber website says 100% of tips go to the driver. I think your driver might have been trying to get a bigger tip. https://www.uber.com/gb/en/ride/how-it-works/tips/ https://www.uber.com/gb/en/ride/how-it-works/tips/
NoPicklez 3y ago
Many of these additional costs to Uber and potentially other ride sharing platforms is that these gig economy jobs at least in Australia, have been due to additional worker regulations. In Aus, there have been talks (or potentially action) on giving gig economy workers additional rights regarding sick leave and annual leave etc. All of these things increase the costs to doing business, akin to what Taxi's would provide their own workers. I know for a fact that Deliveroo (meal delivery service) in Australia closed due to the costs associated from doing business in Australia. Funny when its based on a Kangaroo. I'm not saying this is why in this case, but if your ride sharing prices start going up this might be part of the reason. There is a cynical part of me as well, but I'll push it to the side for the sake of the argument.
- defrost 3y ago
  The punch line from independant business analysis disagrees. E.g. (one example) In 2020, Uber Eats dominated Australia’s food delivery market with a 59.7% share. In the same year, Deliveroo held 17.5% and Menulog 12.1%. However, by the end of 2021, these numbers had changed slightly. Uber Eats’ market share dropped to 52.9%, Menulog gained market share with 19%, and Deliveroo lost market share, holding just 11.7% With a dramatically decreasing market share, it’s unsurprising that Deliveroo decided to call it quits. https://www.lightspeedhq.com.au/blog/what-does-the-collapse-of-deliveroo-mean-for-the-future-of-delivery-in-australia/ https://www.lightspeedhq.com.au/blog/what-does-the-collapse-...
pessimizer 3y ago
Congratulations! Uber is now profitable. But it's probably time for some taxi companies to open back up. These are prices you can compete with easily, and you can pick up people on the street and at taxi stands. Uber at these prices and with such slow pickups is not better than a cab.
WheelsAtLarge 3y ago
Taxis are expensive too. There's no reason to expect Uber is going to be cheap. It's a business. They just have to be more convenient and maybe a bit cheaper than the alternative. They were losing money to get the business. They don't have to do it anymore. I'm someone that thinks that the less Uber is available the more likely public transportation will get better.
- turnsout 3y ago
  In my experience in major US cities, taxis are either comparable or cheaper than Uber. And the cost of a taxi is far less variable, which is a huge plus.
ChrisArchitect 3y ago
For anyone wondering what the quick conversion is: That's 4.6 km
archo 3y ago
https://archive.is/0WZd5 https://archive.is/0WZd5
timbo1642 3y ago
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35 points by PeterCorless 3y ago

Some years ago I was part of the group that joked that public transportation systems in our city were no longer needed since uber / lyft were so cheap. Fast forward a bit, not long ago I checked lyft for a ride to the library for the youngster, it's 1.8 miles - that was $14 at the time (rates have risen since then apparently) - so $28 (without tips) to and from the library for under 4 miles, not quite what the wired reported paid, but that was already too rich imho.

dublin 3y ago
And now that tipping at ridiculous rates is effectively mandatory, they've priced themselves right out of the market. Interestingly, there is a pattern here with most "sharing" services - far more than just rides: AirBNB and VRBO are now postively rapacious in their pricing. What was once decent pricing 5-6 years ago would now make Shylock blush with embarrassment...
- j1elo 3y ago
  Could you elaborate on why and how tipping at ridiculous rates is effectively mandatory? Genuinely curious. In Europe, I just book a ride in the app, get brought to my destination, say goodbye to the driver, the service's price is automatically charged on my bank account, and I go on with my plans. It does ask for a tip (between 0.50 € to maybe 4 € or so, if I recall correctly) and a rating if you are looking at the app. So maybe give 5 starts as a way to help the driver if they were good and there is some free time to kill. But as far as I know, most people just ignore it and dismiss any extra dialogs after the trip. Are you from the US, and would you say that the culture of almost-mandatory tipping in bars & restaurants also applies for services like Uber?
  - stevenicr 3y ago
    <- I'm not the person who were replying to asking the question, so I am not answering for them.. but being the US watching this tipping thing unfold the past 10 years especially has been quite interesting. There was a time when only a few held their hand out, hotel bag carriers, bartenders, food waitresses and strippers mainly.. I think starbucks really pushed tipping into more regular spaces as a whole, and 'influencer' youtube / insta 'models' - and the like have it all extra cool and extra normal.. Now in the 2020's it's common to see people paint thier venmo Id on thier car with 'just got married / graduated / send me a money/drink via cashap.. etc. It's been exacerbated the adding of 'add a tip' on payment devices at places (like starbcuks) and during check out for ordering pizza via web portals.. then you see stories where the pizza place is using door dash instead of their own drivers and places keeping tips.. The rideshare apps ask for a tip at the end of the ride and people worry that tipping or not affects' their rider rating, and there are many people who do not understand that uber drivers are not paid like a regular salary or hourly wage. to see it's added effects - do a news search and see the dozens of 'door dash' (and similar) drivers who demand money when delivering food, beg for money, throw the food, decide to eat it - or otherwise ruin food deliveries because the tip was not high enough -there's been a lot. (one recently cussed at a guy for tipping 30% on an order because the driver felt like the house the person was at was so nice that they should have to tip more) It's a thing with all these gig-workers doing all these things hoping for a tip so bad because they are not making enough money to pay bill and do car (and proper human) maintenance.. There have been several news stories about 'tipping fatigue' that explain it a but here recently as well. Tips requested via digital payment portals at places that have no cashier / wait staff.. It's hitting a boiling point where people are stopping using services where it's asked - and that's adding to other pressures.
    - nullindividual 3y ago
      Tipping at Starbucks is not new. It’s been common since the 90s. What is different is that CC did not used to ask for a tip on the POS.
      - stevenicr 3y ago
WeylandYutani 3y ago
Taxis in my country have always been for the rich, invalid and dumb tourists. Uber was able to heavily subsidize their operation for a while and a few drivers got rich until money ran out. Probably a win for the environment to be honest.

tekla 3y ago

So what side should I take? The reporter who thinks they were ripped off, without taking public transit? or The driver who got a decent payout driving in one of the most expensive cities on earth?

FireBeyond 3y ago
The driver who Uber says got a decent payout. The journalist should have asked to see the distribution of that money for this trip.
- tekla 3y ago
  Its well known that ~25% is what Uber takes from the fare. Everything else is broken out by fee. The author should post receipt
  - profile53 3y ago
    I’ve chatted with about a dozen Uber drivers about this and it’s between 40-60 percent. This is in half a dozen different locales at all times of the day.
    - tekla 3y ago
      If thats the case, good! The driver makes more money in absolute terms still.
      - profile53 3y ago
        I don’t think the driver benefits in this arrangement. I suppose I should provide an example. On a $60 airport fare, Uber+Fees was about $35 and the driver received $25. Two years ago, that trip was maybe $40, so if Uber took 25% and taxes took some, the driver would’ve received $26-28. More so, even if the driver received more in absolute terms per trip (e.g. in some other $60 fares, the driver received $30-32), the increased price due to Uber’s cut results in less people riding and less total fares. Then, even if the driver makes more per trip, they’ll make less over all.

FireBeyond 3y ago

> With Uber, the vast majority of your fare is going to your driver. I would have called him on that. "Hey, can we look up this exact trip and see exactly how much of that went to the driver, then?"

tekla 3y ago
Sure, I would love to the see the receipt from the author
shove 3y ago
If Wired did actual journalism, they’d have done that
HyprMusic 3y ago
Based off my many conversations with Uber drivers, Uber takes 40% in the UK (including from tips). Sure it's a majority but I think "vast majority" is a bit of a stretch.
- solumunus 3y ago
  That’s terrible.
- bspammer 3y ago
  The help section on the Uber website says 100% of tips go to the driver. I think your driver might have been trying to get a bigger tip. https://www.uber.com/gb/en/ride/how-it-works/tips/ https://www.uber.com/gb/en/ride/how-it-works/tips/

NoPicklez 3y ago

Many of these additional costs to Uber and potentially other ride sharing platforms is that these gig economy jobs at least in Australia, have been due to additional worker regulations. In Aus, there have been talks (or potentially action) on giving gig economy workers additional rights regarding sick leave and annual leave etc. All of these things increase the costs to doing business, akin to what Taxi's would provide their own workers. I know for a fact that Deliveroo (meal delivery service) in Australia closed due to the costs associated from doing business in Australia. Funny when its based on a Kangaroo. I'm not saying this is why in this case, but if your ride sharing prices start going up this might be part of the reason. There is a cynical part of me as well, but I'll push it to the side for the sake of the argument.

defrost 3y ago
The punch line from independant business analysis disagrees. E.g. (one example) In 2020, Uber Eats dominated Australia’s food delivery market with a 59.7% share. In the same year, Deliveroo held 17.5% and Menulog 12.1%. However, by the end of 2021, these numbers had changed slightly. Uber Eats’ market share dropped to 52.9%, Menulog gained market share with 19%, and Deliveroo lost market share, holding just 11.7% With a dramatically decreasing market share, it’s unsurprising that Deliveroo decided to call it quits. https://www.lightspeedhq.com.au/blog/what-does-the-collapse-of-deliveroo-mean-for-the-future-of-delivery-in-australia/ https://www.lightspeedhq.com.au/blog/what-does-the-collapse-...

pessimizer 3y ago

Congratulations! Uber is now profitable. But it's probably time for some taxi companies to open back up. These are prices you can compete with easily, and you can pick up people on the street and at taxi stands. Uber at these prices and with such slow pickups is not better than a cab.

WheelsAtLarge 3y ago

Taxis are expensive too. There's no reason to expect Uber is going to be cheap. It's a business. They just have to be more convenient and maybe a bit cheaper than the alternative. They were losing money to get the business. They don't have to do it anymore. I'm someone that thinks that the less Uber is available the more likely public transportation will get better.

turnsout 3y ago
In my experience in major US cities, taxis are either comparable or cheaper than Uber. And the cost of a taxi is far less variable, which is a huge plus.

ChrisArchitect 3y ago

For anyone wondering what the quick conversion is: That's 4.6 km

archo 3y ago

https://archive.is/0WZd5 https://archive.is/0WZd5

timbo1642 3y ago

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