4 ms·

I mean... I also expect the people handing out the free samples to be able to say "no more" to me. I'm not paying them, and they can stop being "nice" at any p

I mean... I also expect the people handing out the free samples to be able to say "no more" to me. I'm not paying them, and they can stop being "nice" at any point without doing anything wrong. I don't see how this is any different? He wasn't harmed in the sense that netlify drove to his house and stabbed him. He lost access to a free food platter.

john-radio 3y ago
Say what you will about Netlify, they have never driven to my house and stabbed me.
- brewdad 3y ago
  I caught them on my porch through my doorbell camera looking menacing. Fortunately, the door was locked so they left.
  - ganoushoreilly 3y ago
    Open the Noor!
toolz 3y ago
A possibly better analogy would be if a ride-share gave you a free ride to a concert and all of your friends have used that free ride without issue but then the ride-share company forced you out of the ride halfway to the concert without warning and said "should've read the fine print not our problem!" - now you're possibly in a bad neighborhood with a dead phone battery in a much worse place than you would've been if you never trusted the free service to begin with (and I would suggests it's not hard at all to imagine a scenario with more dire consequences in this situation) If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible.
- barry-cotter 3y ago
  > If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible. If you’re not paying for it you’re not owed anything. Someone was doing you a favour at their expense and then they stopped. If you want something you can rely on pay for it.
- lesuorac 3y ago
  The ride analogy is not a good one because you're in a different spot from where you started. While with Netlify the person is back at exactly where they started before Netlify was hosting w/e their project was. So they're in the same neighborhood with the same battery level as they started with. The free tier is very clearly not for professional work so its really more like if your buddy said they could pick you up but they won't move a couch for you and you showed up with a couch and they just left.
  - pbhjpbhj 3y ago
    >While with Netlify the person is back at exactly where they started // Hmm, moving to a free service can take a lot of time, there might be lock-in? I don't have specific experience of netlify. I stayed with my hosting provider despite them doubling my costs just because it would take a long time to find another trustable provider with the offering I need and then a lot of time to move and make sure everything is working. If it's just a white label service then yes, easy to switch back. If it's not directly comparable then integration costs (in time) can mean you've been "dumped in the road half way there". Of course if the driver tells you directly "I might have to drop you half way" then that's fine.
    - dinkleberg 3y ago
      It takes a couple of minutes to setup services like these (be it netlify, vercel, Cloudflare, etc.) You connect your repo, tell it what command to run, and then which directory to grab. If you’re using a popular framework like Hugo they’ll often auto detect all of those settings for you.
remram 3y ago
More like if you walk away with your free sample, and suddenly someone walks up to you and yanks it from your hands. Those are not people who need support. They were locked out with no warning and no explanation.
- eddythompson80 3y ago
  Not really. OPs analogy is closer. It’s more like you’ve been getting free samples and eating them, then they said “ok, no more” without prior warning. You wouldn’t expect them to have to give you a discontinue warning and a grace period for you to find another free sample provider
  - remram 3y ago
    I definitely would, and I have received such warning from more professional providers. Even my local grocery store sends an email when canceling tasting and marketing events. I don't know why you think otherwise. Netlify's own EULA states (https://www.netlify.com/pdf/self-serve-subscription-agreement.pdf/ https://www.netlify.com/pdf/self-serve-subscription-agreemen...): > While we always make an effort to communicate clearly and well in advance if we decide a particular website project is not a good fit for our Free Usage Tier, we reserve the right to disable or remove any website project on Netlify’s Free Usage Tier without notice at our sole discretion so every free user should very much expect "an effort to communicate clearly and well in advance". They were explicitly told they should.
    - horsawlarway 3y ago
      See - I read that exact same message, and applying my "contract legalese" filter I come away with the utter opposite opinion. "we reserve the right to disable or remove any website project on Netlify’s Free Usage Tier without notice at our sole discretion" That's the promise. Full stop. Everything else is filler words to make that seem more palatable to people. You are being misled because you are not reading the contract as "a list of things netlify MUST do". Making assumptions based on anything else is folly - you are trusting a commercial entity to be "nice" and that's a really, really bad thing to trust them to do.

john-radio 3y ago

Say what you will about Netlify, they have never driven to my house and stabbed me.

brewdad 3y ago
I caught them on my porch through my doorbell camera looking menacing. Fortunately, the door was locked so they left.
- ganoushoreilly 3y ago
  Open the Noor!

toolz 3y ago

A possibly better analogy would be if a ride-share gave you a free ride to a concert and all of your friends have used that free ride without issue but then the ride-share company forced you out of the ride halfway to the concert without warning and said "should've read the fine print not our problem!" - now you're possibly in a bad neighborhood with a dead phone battery in a much worse place than you would've been if you never trusted the free service to begin with (and I would suggests it's not hard at all to imagine a scenario with more dire consequences in this situation) If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible.

barry-cotter 3y ago
> If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible. If you’re not paying for it you’re not owed anything. Someone was doing you a favour at their expense and then they stopped. If you want something you can rely on pay for it.
lesuorac 3y ago
The ride analogy is not a good one because you're in a different spot from where you started. While with Netlify the person is back at exactly where they started before Netlify was hosting w/e their project was. So they're in the same neighborhood with the same battery level as they started with. The free tier is very clearly not for professional work so its really more like if your buddy said they could pick you up but they won't move a couch for you and you showed up with a couch and they just left.
- pbhjpbhj 3y ago
  >While with Netlify the person is back at exactly where they started // Hmm, moving to a free service can take a lot of time, there might be lock-in? I don't have specific experience of netlify. I stayed with my hosting provider despite them doubling my costs just because it would take a long time to find another trustable provider with the offering I need and then a lot of time to move and make sure everything is working. If it's just a white label service then yes, easy to switch back. If it's not directly comparable then integration costs (in time) can mean you've been "dumped in the road half way there". Of course if the driver tells you directly "I might have to drop you half way" then that's fine.
  - dinkleberg 3y ago
    It takes a couple of minutes to setup services like these (be it netlify, vercel, Cloudflare, etc.) You connect your repo, tell it what command to run, and then which directory to grab. If you’re using a popular framework like Hugo they’ll often auto detect all of those settings for you.

remram 3y ago

More like if you walk away with your free sample, and suddenly someone walks up to you and yanks it from your hands. Those are not people who need support. They were locked out with no warning and no explanation.

eddythompson80 3y ago
Not really. OPs analogy is closer. It’s more like you’ve been getting free samples and eating them, then they said “ok, no more” without prior warning. You wouldn’t expect them to have to give you a discontinue warning and a grace period for you to find another free sample provider
- remram 3y ago
  I definitely would, and I have received such warning from more professional providers. Even my local grocery store sends an email when canceling tasting and marketing events. I don't know why you think otherwise. Netlify's own EULA states (https://www.netlify.com/pdf/self-serve-subscription-agreement.pdf/ https://www.netlify.com/pdf/self-serve-subscription-agreemen...): > While we always make an effort to communicate clearly and well in advance if we decide a particular website project is not a good fit for our Free Usage Tier, we reserve the right to disable or remove any website project on Netlify’s Free Usage Tier without notice at our sole discretion so every free user should very much expect "an effort to communicate clearly and well in advance". They were explicitly told they should.
  - horsawlarway 3y ago
    See - I read that exact same message, and applying my "contract legalese" filter I come away with the utter opposite opinion. "we reserve the right to disable or remove any website project on Netlify’s Free Usage Tier without notice at our sole discretion" That's the promise. Full stop. Everything else is filler words to make that seem more palatable to people. You are being misled because you are not reading the contract as "a list of things netlify MUST do". Making assumptions based on anything else is folly - you are trusting a commercial entity to be "nice" and that's a really, really bad thing to trust them to do.