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I hate the prevailing sentiment around here that if you are not paying then you deserve all harm to comes to you. If I get free food sample from a brand I fully

I hate the prevailing sentiment around here that if you are not paying then you deserve all harm to comes to you. If I get free food sample from a brand I fully expect that it should comply with the same sanitary/health standards as a paid product, food makers can't just shrug a harmful contamination/spoiling in free samples and then just go "they are not paying so not my problem". We must hold free tech services to the same high standards. Not to this specific case, it is not as you imply a case of a single person having a problem and not having timely support, it is a widespread problem or policy somewhere (purposeful or accidental) that collectively harmed many free-tier users.

subw00f 3y ago
Not a fair comparison, one is a health risk to human beings, the other is a business nuisance.
- toolz 3y ago
  not necessarily true...imagine you're a kid with tech skills and you've made the local news for making a free to use website that tracks public transport buses that over the course of a month or two disadvantaged people come to rely on...then that service goes away suddenly while some disadvantaged person is out doing something in extreme weather...now that disadvantaged person has to go wait for the bus in extreme weather for a substantially longer period of time which could easily make them sick which could easily be a life altering experience for them.
horsawlarway 3y ago
I mean... I also expect the people handing out the free samples to be able to say "no more" to me. I'm not paying them, and they can stop being "nice" at any point without doing anything wrong. I don't see how this is any different? He wasn't harmed in the sense that netlify drove to his house and stabbed him. He lost access to a free food platter.
- john-radio 3y ago
  Say what you will about Netlify, they have never driven to my house and stabbed me.
  - brewdad 3y ago
    I caught them on my porch through my doorbell camera looking menacing. Fortunately, the door was locked so they left.
    - ganoushoreilly 3y ago
      Open the Noor!
- toolz 3y ago
  A possibly better analogy would be if a ride-share gave you a free ride to a concert and all of your friends have used that free ride without issue but then the ride-share company forced you out of the ride halfway to the concert without warning and said "should've read the fine print not our problem!" - now you're possibly in a bad neighborhood with a dead phone battery in a much worse place than you would've been if you never trusted the free service to begin with (and I would suggests it's not hard at all to imagine a scenario with more dire consequences in this situation) If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible.
  - barry-cotter 3y ago
    > If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible. If you’re not paying for it you’re not owed anything. Someone was doing you a favour at their expense and then they stopped. If you want something you can rely on pay for it.
  - 3y ago
welfare 3y ago
That's not a fair comparison, it would be more like if they run out of samples you can't demand more, or if you've already had 10 you might have to expect them to say no, or if you don't like the toppings, you can't really ask for substitutions.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
benatkin 3y ago
So the word shouldn't get out that their public image is false? They and the other players are part of a trend that discourages people from setting up their own VPSes, saying it's a pain in the ass. Well so is Netlify, Vercel, and fly.io only you're also learning skills you can't use when you decide to leave one of these vendors. I got locked out of the Vercel dashboard for a couple weeks due to a bug. For a $20/user/month paid account, mind you. This support thread feels similar, though unlike what happened to me with Vercel, it appears to be deliberate on Netlify's part. Cloudflare seems more reliable but https://www.politico.eu/article/sap-cloudflare-enable-russia-war-effort-ukraine-digital-minister-fedorov/ https://www.politico.eu/article/sap-cloudflare-enable-russia...
themagician 3y ago
If you are not paying you literally deserve nothing.
- jasonlotito 3y ago
  The consideration here is the exchange of personal information for services, as covered by the ToS. The belief that money is the only acceptable form of consideration is foolish and not realistic. Just because you don't exchange money doesn't mean nothing of value is being exchanged. Netlify does owe people certain things for that exchange. "Nothing" is absolutely and factually false.
smohare 3y ago
[dead]
DropInIn 3y ago
Got some news for you: Free/Charity food is exempt from safe food policies in many jurisdictions. That's why so many homeless avoid the local soup kitchens, as they consistently give them food poisoning.

subw00f 3y ago

Not a fair comparison, one is a health risk to human beings, the other is a business nuisance.

toolz 3y ago
not necessarily true...imagine you're a kid with tech skills and you've made the local news for making a free to use website that tracks public transport buses that over the course of a month or two disadvantaged people come to rely on...then that service goes away suddenly while some disadvantaged person is out doing something in extreme weather...now that disadvantaged person has to go wait for the bus in extreme weather for a substantially longer period of time which could easily make them sick which could easily be a life altering experience for them.

horsawlarway 3y ago

I mean... I also expect the people handing out the free samples to be able to say "no more" to me. I'm not paying them, and they can stop being "nice" at any point without doing anything wrong. I don't see how this is any different? He wasn't harmed in the sense that netlify drove to his house and stabbed him. He lost access to a free food platter.

john-radio 3y ago
Say what you will about Netlify, they have never driven to my house and stabbed me.
- brewdad 3y ago
  I caught them on my porch through my doorbell camera looking menacing. Fortunately, the door was locked so they left.
  - ganoushoreilly 3y ago
    Open the Noor!
toolz 3y ago
A possibly better analogy would be if a ride-share gave you a free ride to a concert and all of your friends have used that free ride without issue but then the ride-share company forced you out of the ride halfway to the concert without warning and said "should've read the fine print not our problem!" - now you're possibly in a bad neighborhood with a dead phone battery in a much worse place than you would've been if you never trusted the free service to begin with (and I would suggests it's not hard at all to imagine a scenario with more dire consequences in this situation) If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible.
- barry-cotter 3y ago
  > If people are planning their near future based on what you've said you would likely be giving them, then at some point there is probably some inherited responsibility to at least give the user of that service a heads up so they can make other plans if possible. If you’re not paying for it you’re not owed anything. Someone was doing you a favour at their expense and then they stopped. If you want something you can rely on pay for it.
- 3y ago

welfare 3y ago

That's not a fair comparison, it would be more like if they run out of samples you can't demand more, or if you've already had 10 you might have to expect them to say no, or if you don't like the toppings, you can't really ask for substitutions.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

benatkin 3y ago

So the word shouldn't get out that their public image is false? They and the other players are part of a trend that discourages people from setting up their own VPSes, saying it's a pain in the ass. Well so is Netlify, Vercel, and fly.io only you're also learning skills you can't use when you decide to leave one of these vendors. I got locked out of the Vercel dashboard for a couple weeks due to a bug. For a $20/user/month paid account, mind you. This support thread feels similar, though unlike what happened to me with Vercel, it appears to be deliberate on Netlify's part. Cloudflare seems more reliable but https://www.politico.eu/article/sap-cloudflare-enable-russia-war-effort-ukraine-digital-minister-fedorov/ https://www.politico.eu/article/sap-cloudflare-enable-russia...

themagician 3y ago

If you are not paying you literally deserve nothing.

jasonlotito 3y ago
The consideration here is the exchange of personal information for services, as covered by the ToS. The belief that money is the only acceptable form of consideration is foolish and not realistic. Just because you don't exchange money doesn't mean nothing of value is being exchanged. Netlify does owe people certain things for that exchange. "Nothing" is absolutely and factually false.

smohare 3y ago

[dead]

DropInIn 3y ago

Got some news for you: Free/Charity food is exempt from safe food policies in many jurisdictions. That's why so many homeless avoid the local soup kitchens, as they consistently give them food poisoning.