5 ms·

Disappointing to see such a 180 on 'don't be evil'. I'm recommending Mozilla Firefox to all friends and family.

fps_doug 3y ago
I do, and I keep having those tiring conversations, but it's really hard to get the point across in layman's terms. I have enough friends in tech who stick with Chrome out of convenience instead of just falling back on it in case something actually doesn't work in Firefox. how do I convince tech illiterate people of doing this?
- erklik 3y ago
  It's faster. The same old justification that was used to switch to Chrome can now be used for Firefox.
- AdamN 3y ago
  For the tech illiterate recommend Safari. For tech people, appeal to their privileged position and the importance of defending the web by choosing any other browser (or Safari). Both users can keep Chrome installed as a fallback - that will help with convincing too.
  - suslik 3y ago
    And drop my Ublock origin, bypass paywall clean, etc? Hell no.
    - timeon 3y ago
      > Ublock origin At least there is Adguard.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    > For the tech illiterate recommend Safari. That's only applicable to Apple users, though.
    - AdamN 3y ago
      Tech illiterate people should be using MacOS anyway. Windows just gets worse every year. MacOS is actually more like classic Windows than Windows 11 is so it's actually easier to use for tech illiterate people.
  - freedomben 3y ago
    Didn't Apple implement this same type of thing in Safari a year or so ago?
- jckahn 3y ago
  You can’t, realistically. I don’t think there’s any repeatable or effective way to make non-nerds (AKA most people) care about this sort of thing.
- Buttons840 3y ago
  Start referring to them as "Chrome developers" -- what's this "web" thing you keep talking about?
- _urvc 3y ago
  Whenever a new device needs to be setup for my parents, I just install whatever I use (Firefox in this case). Then I show them the things they need on a day by day basis. The problem are people who did grow up with tech. They will say things like it will take too long. In cases like this you need to manipulate them based on their personality.
baybal2 3y ago
[dead]
maxloh 3y ago
Unfortunately Firefox doesn't have a good UI/UX after all. The last time I checked, multiple profiles support is somehow half-baked.
- wsgeorge 3y ago
  Not sure why you're getting downvoted, but this is a big deal IMO. We're here because Chrome has been the better product for a long time. Firefox not doing things people want well enough will hurt its adoption, which will impact its capacity to influence the Web. Add to Mozilla's perceived not-very-good management and you have a death spiral on your hands, and more power to Google and Apple to shape the Web towards their interests. FWIW, first-class profiles support matters a lot: https://medium.com/sort-of-like-a-tech-diary/profiles-the-one-thing-firefox-needs-to-get-right-a769dcfb124f https://medium.com/sort-of-like-a-tech-diary/profiles-the-on...
  - pndy 3y ago
    Mozilla in the past ignored the criticism users had regarding UI/UX changes and went with deploying this bulky mobile-oriented interface for desktops. And here we are. This itself is one issue; there are also all sorts of adventures they decide to go for little to not at all related to the browser development, and which are conducted to convince people all around the world that they're a good humane corporation that cares. Igh.
- mozball 3y ago
  Multiple profiles is fully supported. It's just hidden behind a clunky UX. Also check out firefox containers which is to profiles what docker is to virtual machines.
  - luuurker 3y ago
    Containers are useful, but it's like having a few similar terminal windows open. Eventually you'll type something on the wrong window... at least I found myself searching for personal stuff on my work Google container. With profiles I can have different bookmarks, extensions, and even a different theme so I'm aware I'm on my personal profile, not on a work profile. Since switching profiles on Firefox + macOS is a pain in the butt, I use 2 different Firefox channels (stable + dev). Anyway, containers are nice, but they're not a replacement for profiles.
slowmovintarget 3y ago
I was just able to finally move my wife back to Firefox. Chrome just stopped working on her Mac. Wouldn't pull up a page. Everything else worked. She's now happily using Firefox with a non-hobbled version of uBlock Origin.
- smolyeet 3y ago
  I don’t think this indicative of chrome being bad on Mac. What did you try to resolve the issue? Because I could say chrome always works for me (which would be true in my experience), but that doesn’t mean it always does.
  - slowmovintarget 3y ago
    Clearing all state (all saved data and cookies), Incognito mode, disabling the few extensions she was running. When it got to the point where the only thing left to do was reinstall Chrome, we installed Firefox instead.

I do, and I keep having those tiring conversations, but it's really hard to get the point across in layman's terms. I have enough friends in tech who stick with Chrome out of convenience instead of just falling back on it in case something actually doesn't work in Firefox. how do I convince tech illiterate people of doing this?

erklik 3y ago
It's faster. The same old justification that was used to switch to Chrome can now be used for Firefox.
AdamN 3y ago
For the tech illiterate recommend Safari. For tech people, appeal to their privileged position and the importance of defending the web by choosing any other browser (or Safari). Both users can keep Chrome installed as a fallback - that will help with convincing too.
- suslik 3y ago
  And drop my Ublock origin, bypass paywall clean, etc? Hell no.
  - timeon 3y ago
    > Ublock origin At least there is Adguard.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > For the tech illiterate recommend Safari. That's only applicable to Apple users, though.
  - AdamN 3y ago
    Tech illiterate people should be using MacOS anyway. Windows just gets worse every year. MacOS is actually more like classic Windows than Windows 11 is so it's actually easier to use for tech illiterate people.
- freedomben 3y ago
  Didn't Apple implement this same type of thing in Safari a year or so ago?
jckahn 3y ago
You can’t, realistically. I don’t think there’s any repeatable or effective way to make non-nerds (AKA most people) care about this sort of thing.
Buttons840 3y ago
Start referring to them as "Chrome developers" -- what's this "web" thing you keep talking about?
_urvc 3y ago
Whenever a new device needs to be setup for my parents, I just install whatever I use (Firefox in this case). Then I show them the things they need on a day by day basis. The problem are people who did grow up with tech. They will say things like it will take too long. In cases like this you need to manipulate them based on their personality.

baybal2 3y ago

[dead]

maxloh 3y ago

Unfortunately Firefox doesn't have a good UI/UX after all. The last time I checked, multiple profiles support is somehow half-baked.

wsgeorge 3y ago
Not sure why you're getting downvoted, but this is a big deal IMO. We're here because Chrome has been the better product for a long time. Firefox not doing things people want well enough will hurt its adoption, which will impact its capacity to influence the Web. Add to Mozilla's perceived not-very-good management and you have a death spiral on your hands, and more power to Google and Apple to shape the Web towards their interests. FWIW, first-class profiles support matters a lot: https://medium.com/sort-of-like-a-tech-diary/profiles-the-one-thing-firefox-needs-to-get-right-a769dcfb124f https://medium.com/sort-of-like-a-tech-diary/profiles-the-on...
- pndy 3y ago
  Mozilla in the past ignored the criticism users had regarding UI/UX changes and went with deploying this bulky mobile-oriented interface for desktops. And here we are. This itself is one issue; there are also all sorts of adventures they decide to go for little to not at all related to the browser development, and which are conducted to convince people all around the world that they're a good humane corporation that cares. Igh.
mozball 3y ago
Multiple profiles is fully supported. It's just hidden behind a clunky UX. Also check out firefox containers which is to profiles what docker is to virtual machines.
- luuurker 3y ago
  Containers are useful, but it's like having a few similar terminal windows open. Eventually you'll type something on the wrong window... at least I found myself searching for personal stuff on my work Google container. With profiles I can have different bookmarks, extensions, and even a different theme so I'm aware I'm on my personal profile, not on a work profile. Since switching profiles on Firefox + macOS is a pain in the butt, I use 2 different Firefox channels (stable + dev). Anyway, containers are nice, but they're not a replacement for profiles.

slowmovintarget 3y ago

I was just able to finally move my wife back to Firefox. Chrome just stopped working on her Mac. Wouldn't pull up a page. Everything else worked. She's now happily using Firefox with a non-hobbled version of uBlock Origin.

smolyeet 3y ago
I don’t think this indicative of chrome being bad on Mac. What did you try to resolve the issue? Because I could say chrome always works for me (which would be true in my experience), but that doesn’t mean it always does.
- slowmovintarget 3y ago
  Clearing all state (all saved data and cookies), Incognito mode, disabling the few extensions she was running. When it got to the point where the only thing left to do was reinstall Chrome, we installed Firefox instead.