4 ms·

Yeah, my design problem is the language I'm using, the language version I'm using, the outdated framework I'm using, and the 3! frontend frameworks I'm using on

Yeah, my design problem is the language I'm using, the language version I'm using, the outdated framework I'm using, and the 3! frontend frameworks I'm using on my job.

mgaunard 3y ago
Stop using them? A good craftsman crafts his own tools.
- Toutouxc 3y ago
  Both this post and the one two levels back honestly sound like someone who's never worked in a SW company. Craft my own tools? When? Who's paying for that? Too much boilerplate? Tell that to the 20+ people who built this thing and are long gone. You really have to work for a specific kind of company to be able to change any of that.
  - mgaunard 3y ago
    I have about 15 years experience professionally as a software engineer, in all kinds of companies, at all kinds of different seniority levels. I call bullshit. Your task is to deliver a project that does what it's supposed to, all in a timely fashion. You do whatever it takes, including getting rid of old code and rewriting stuff if it makes you more productive overall. Writing code that does what you want is much faster than taking someone else's code and twist it to do something it was not written to do. You should always be very careful about what dependencies you use, as most often you will have to deal with their limitations and bugs, and they could kill your project. If you had 20 separate people who contributed to the same thing and left then you most likely have huge code debt. Managing that sort of thing is a daily task for any software engineer. Apparently your strategy is to just add debt onto the pile and put your head in the sand pretending it's not your problem. Instead you should plan tactical refactoring moves to make the codebase leaner and better able to adapt to the business needs, all without breaking any existing functionality and workflows. You're asking "when". That's the wrong question. It's up to you to manage your time and invest it into tasks that help you save time later on. A software engineer is usually not paid by the hour either, so you just do the work until you're satisfied with the effort you've put in.
- sgarland 3y ago
  My father-in-law is a woodworker who makes chairs that cost five digits, and canoes that run into six digits. He is the epitome of a good craftsman. He does not make his own tools. He buys them, because there are already extremely talented tool-makers who are very good at their craft.
  - mgaunard 3y ago
    But I'm sure he carefully reviews what tools are available and most likely still modifies them to fit his workflow. Certainly a lot of youtube woodworkers do that, can't say I work wood myself.
    - sgarland 3y ago
      That depends what your definition of tool is. He custom-makes jigs all the time, as those are bespoke for whatever particular shape of thing he’s making. But saws, blades, chisels… maybe he could make them, but why? Metalworking is its own subject of mastery. AFAIK, he doesn’t often modify any tools of that sort. He spends time selecting the one he wants, yes.
      - mgaunard 3y ago
        Making a tool doesn't mean making every component of the tool.
  - qzw 3y ago
    How many hours does it take him to make a canoe? I imagine it must run into the high hundreds, if not more.
    - sgarland 3y ago
      A full canoe can take him up to a year, depending on the wood species. He made one once from ebony, which is extremely difficult to work. Also if it wasn’t clear, these aren’t intended for use. They all do (except for the ebony - he said the heat absorption from the dark color would delaminate the fiberglass coat within hours) float and work extremely well if you want, but given the cost, most people use them as art. He also makes paddles, which are still expensive (I think the cheapest starts at about $1000), but some people actually use those.
tuyiown 3y ago
Don’t hesitate to be more specific on your boiler plate problem, because after 19 years career I’m yet to have or see, or even being counted a case where it has any significance on productivity loss. It is at worse questionable yet somewhat healthy warm up.
zero_shift 3y ago
I worry that our reliance on LLMs (or rather, their reliance on these languages) will make it harder to adopt new technology Imagine, a vision of the future... A thousand million chatbots, all outputting 2018 JavaScript

Yeah, my design problem is the language I'm using, the language version I'm using, the outdated framework I'm using, and the 3! frontend frameworks I'm using on my job.

mgaunard 3y ago

Stop using them? A good craftsman crafts his own tools.

Toutouxc 3y ago
Both this post and the one two levels back honestly sound like someone who's never worked in a SW company. Craft my own tools? When? Who's paying for that? Too much boilerplate? Tell that to the 20+ people who built this thing and are long gone. You really have to work for a specific kind of company to be able to change any of that.
- mgaunard 3y ago
  I have about 15 years experience professionally as a software engineer, in all kinds of companies, at all kinds of different seniority levels. I call bullshit. Your task is to deliver a project that does what it's supposed to, all in a timely fashion. You do whatever it takes, including getting rid of old code and rewriting stuff if it makes you more productive overall. Writing code that does what you want is much faster than taking someone else's code and twist it to do something it was not written to do. You should always be very careful about what dependencies you use, as most often you will have to deal with their limitations and bugs, and they could kill your project. If you had 20 separate people who contributed to the same thing and left then you most likely have huge code debt. Managing that sort of thing is a daily task for any software engineer. Apparently your strategy is to just add debt onto the pile and put your head in the sand pretending it's not your problem. Instead you should plan tactical refactoring moves to make the codebase leaner and better able to adapt to the business needs, all without breaking any existing functionality and workflows. You're asking "when". That's the wrong question. It's up to you to manage your time and invest it into tasks that help you save time later on. A software engineer is usually not paid by the hour either, so you just do the work until you're satisfied with the effort you've put in.
sgarland 3y ago
My father-in-law is a woodworker who makes chairs that cost five digits, and canoes that run into six digits. He is the epitome of a good craftsman. He does not make his own tools. He buys them, because there are already extremely talented tool-makers who are very good at their craft.
- mgaunard 3y ago
  But I'm sure he carefully reviews what tools are available and most likely still modifies them to fit his workflow. Certainly a lot of youtube woodworkers do that, can't say I work wood myself.
  - sgarland 3y ago
    That depends what your definition of tool is. He custom-makes jigs all the time, as those are bespoke for whatever particular shape of thing he’s making. But saws, blades, chisels… maybe he could make them, but why? Metalworking is its own subject of mastery. AFAIK, he doesn’t often modify any tools of that sort. He spends time selecting the one he wants, yes.
    - mgaunard 3y ago
      Making a tool doesn't mean making every component of the tool.
- qzw 3y ago
  How many hours does it take him to make a canoe? I imagine it must run into the high hundreds, if not more.
  - sgarland 3y ago
    A full canoe can take him up to a year, depending on the wood species. He made one once from ebony, which is extremely difficult to work. Also if it wasn’t clear, these aren’t intended for use. They all do (except for the ebony - he said the heat absorption from the dark color would delaminate the fiberglass coat within hours) float and work extremely well if you want, but given the cost, most people use them as art. He also makes paddles, which are still expensive (I think the cheapest starts at about $1000), but some people actually use those.

tuyiown 3y ago

Don’t hesitate to be more specific on your boiler plate problem, because after 19 years career I’m yet to have or see, or even being counted a case where it has any significance on productivity loss. It is at worse questionable yet somewhat healthy warm up.

zero_shift 3y ago

I worry that our reliance on LLMs (or rather, their reliance on these languages) will make it harder to adopt new technology Imagine, a vision of the future... A thousand million chatbots, all outputting 2018 JavaScript