10 ms·

WhatsApp had a major disruption

72 points by foobarbazprod 3y ago

foobarbazprod 3y ago
Noticed WhatsApp messages are stuck on sending to server. They don't have a public API status page besides their business portal as linked above
- coolgoose 3y ago
  I noticed it since I can't send messages to any of my contacts :D
blovescoffee 3y ago
Is it going to be a DNS problem?
c0balt 3y ago
Interesting, looking at the history it appears to be a spotty last few months. "Major" outages every two weeks or so. I wonder what brings instability into such a mature product.
- leesalminen 3y ago
  downdetector.com is also showing a spike of users reporting issues with Instagram around the same time. Assuming both products are hosted with the same infra, perhaps the issue is up-the-chain and not related to any changes in the product per se.
  - capableweb 3y ago
    Meta would be real stupid to host something as vital (in many parts of the world, sadly) as Whatsapp on the same infra as Instagram.
- Sterm 3y ago
  The people who wrote it left and the ones who stayed don't know how the system works.
- brasic 3y ago
  Pre-acquisition WhatsApp was built using Erlang and had an impressively large user-to-server ratio IIRC. I expect that since then things have mostly been rebuilt to use existing meta shared infrastructure which might not be as stable or efficient.
nine_k 3y ago
I suppose the proper spelling should be "WhatsApp is Dawnn".
rs999gti 3y ago
I thought WhatsApp users went to Telegram after the Facebook buy out?
- bombolo 3y ago
  Most users don't even know that happened.
  - wombarly 3y ago
    Depends? I remember WhatsApp being bought by Facebook (and subsequent privacy issues) being in the news a lot in the Netherlands. Most people either don't care or everyone around them only uses WhatsApp for chat making it difficult to switch.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  Not all of them. I use WhatsApp purely to talk with one friend in another country who is only willing to use WhatsApp to communicate.
  - chirau 3y ago
    So you also use Whatsapp. Maybe the 'other' people you know also just use it the same way you do, for that one international friend. Whatsapp usage is quite prevalent in SF.
    - JohnFen 3y ago
      > So you also use Whatsapp. Of course, as I said. > Maybe the 'other' people you know also just use it the same way you do I'm confused about what you're responding to here. What other people? I didn't mention anyone else. That one friend happens to be the only person I know who uses it. Or at least the only person I know who has asked me to use it. I didn't assert that nobody else uses it. In fact, I was providing an example that not everyone has abandoned it.
- lxgr 3y ago
  Only the ones that don't understand the difference between transport and end-to-end encryption.
onion2k 3y ago
TIL WhatsApp has an on-premise product...
- lxgr 3y ago
  I think it's effectively some weird containerized WhatsApp client. The benefit seems to be that it provides end-to-end encryption between the company and the customer, unlike Meta's hosted version.
  - dilly_li 3y ago
    Wait, Facebook's whatsapp is also end-to-end encrypted, right?
    - lxgr 3y ago
      It is, but for B2C messaging, there is a solution hosted by Meta that terminates the encryption at the gateway level (i.e. Meta can see the message content). The alternative to that is the on-premise solution.
- minton 3y ago
  If a system goes down when Meta experiences outages, can it be considered "on-premises"?
  - lxgr 3y ago
    Why not? On-premise and autonomous/decentralized are two completely different aspects.
    - paulddraper 3y ago
      How so?
      - lxgr 3y ago
        You can totally have an on-premise appliance that behaves like a black box, is remotely managed by the vendor and depends on their cloud services for even basic functionality. (Not saying that this is what WhatsApp's solution is – I've never looked into it!)
burgerrito 3y ago
I think I used WhatsApp around that time... I'm pretty sure I was able to use it normally
- baby 3y ago
  yeah same, didn't notice any downtime
7e 3y ago
WhatsApp eventually comes down.
EgregiousCube 3y ago
I haven't used WhatsApp in ages, and a couple hours ago I got a very persistent scammer trying to get me to talk to them. Probably just a coincidence, but it makes me wonder if this is security related.
- Ensorceled 3y ago
  I had the same experience. Also anecdotal but maybe a few more data points….
leesalminen 3y ago
Basically everything I was doing came to a grinding halt for 45 minutes because I live in Latin America, where your entire life runs on WhatsApp. It's infuriating because nobody will consider any other messaging app. My phone's carrier also gives everyone several free GBs of WhatsApp data per month.
- seany 3y ago
  > My phone's carrier also gives everyone several free GBs of WhatsApp data per month. Meta is surely compensating them in some form
  - DanitaBaires 3y ago
    It has been like that before Meta.
  - toast0 3y ago
    I worked on carrier partnerships (among many other things) while I was at WhatsApp, from before FB through 2019. Carriers wanted to setup special pricing (including zero-rating) for WhatsApp with or without our help or approval. Before acquisition, the only compensation we provided was approval to use our brand (which we didn't have resources to litigate around the world over anyway), our list of IPs (and notifications when they changed), and maybe a little bit of guidance/support on how to identify traffic; although from conversations I had, the DPI vendors had ways of doing it anyway without our help. In return, WA got some amount of marketing, and sometimes access to zero cost SMS (used for registration). Additionally, by participating with carriers, rather than letting them do their own thing, we were able to influence them towards providing a good experience for users; WA did not approve of text only special pricing[1], it had to include attachments, and we did our best to keep carriers updated on IPs to reduce the amount of miscategorized usage leading to overage or connectivity problems. To my knowledge, there was only one deal with monetary compensation, but it theoretically flowed to WA, not to the carrier. My understanding is the carriers wanted to run these deals because they attract customers who often convert to full internet plans. Messaging is nice, but customers eventually get outside links and want to experience the web or other applications. Post acquisition, deals moved into Facebook's mobile partner portal, and afaik, there was still no compensation for WhatsApp deals, but the MPP does also offer analytics (audience insights) to carriers, and I'm not sure if it's a requirement to have a special pricing deal to get that or not. It's been several years, so it's possible the program has changed. [1] If you've seen that on planes, it wasn't authorized when I was there, and I don't think it's authorized now, but it doesn't stop a motivated network from providing the service.
notorandit 3y ago
[flagged]
cpursley 3y ago
Did they switch from Erlang to Ruby or JavaScript?
jmrm 3y ago
I don't have anything to support this, but I think WhatsApp get down every time they make a major server side update. IIRC there was a major down just before they added calls. Maybe I'll check up later the dates
ajhai 3y ago
This status page is for WhatsApp Business API (https://developers.facebook.com/docs/whatsapp/cloud-api/ https://developers.facebook.com/docs/whatsapp/cloud-api/) and not for the consumer product that most of us depend on.
- lxgr 3y ago
  Arguably businesses are affected too if none of their customers can message anybody, including them.

72 points by foobarbazprod 3y ago

Noticed WhatsApp messages are stuck on sending to server. They don't have a public API status page besides their business portal as linked above

coolgoose 3y ago
I noticed it since I can't send messages to any of my contacts :D

blovescoffee 3y ago

Is it going to be a DNS problem?

c0balt 3y ago

Interesting, looking at the history it appears to be a spotty last few months. "Major" outages every two weeks or so. I wonder what brings instability into such a mature product.

leesalminen 3y ago
downdetector.com is also showing a spike of users reporting issues with Instagram around the same time. Assuming both products are hosted with the same infra, perhaps the issue is up-the-chain and not related to any changes in the product per se.
- capableweb 3y ago
  Meta would be real stupid to host something as vital (in many parts of the world, sadly) as Whatsapp on the same infra as Instagram.
Sterm 3y ago
The people who wrote it left and the ones who stayed don't know how the system works.
brasic 3y ago
Pre-acquisition WhatsApp was built using Erlang and had an impressively large user-to-server ratio IIRC. I expect that since then things have mostly been rebuilt to use existing meta shared infrastructure which might not be as stable or efficient.

nine_k 3y ago

I suppose the proper spelling should be "WhatsApp is Dawnn".

rs999gti 3y ago

I thought WhatsApp users went to Telegram after the Facebook buy out?

bombolo 3y ago
Most users don't even know that happened.
- wombarly 3y ago
  Depends? I remember WhatsApp being bought by Facebook (and subsequent privacy issues) being in the news a lot in the Netherlands. Most people either don't care or everyone around them only uses WhatsApp for chat making it difficult to switch.
JohnFen 3y ago
Not all of them. I use WhatsApp purely to talk with one friend in another country who is only willing to use WhatsApp to communicate.
- chirau 3y ago
  So you also use Whatsapp. Maybe the 'other' people you know also just use it the same way you do, for that one international friend. Whatsapp usage is quite prevalent in SF.
  - JohnFen 3y ago
    > So you also use Whatsapp. Of course, as I said. > Maybe the 'other' people you know also just use it the same way you do I'm confused about what you're responding to here. What other people? I didn't mention anyone else. That one friend happens to be the only person I know who uses it. Or at least the only person I know who has asked me to use it. I didn't assert that nobody else uses it. In fact, I was providing an example that not everyone has abandoned it.
lxgr 3y ago
Only the ones that don't understand the difference between transport and end-to-end encryption.

onion2k 3y ago

TIL WhatsApp has an on-premise product...

lxgr 3y ago
I think it's effectively some weird containerized WhatsApp client. The benefit seems to be that it provides end-to-end encryption between the company and the customer, unlike Meta's hosted version.
- dilly_li 3y ago
  Wait, Facebook's whatsapp is also end-to-end encrypted, right?
  - lxgr 3y ago
    It is, but for B2C messaging, there is a solution hosted by Meta that terminates the encryption at the gateway level (i.e. Meta can see the message content). The alternative to that is the on-premise solution.
minton 3y ago
If a system goes down when Meta experiences outages, can it be considered "on-premises"?
- lxgr 3y ago
  Why not? On-premise and autonomous/decentralized are two completely different aspects.
  - paulddraper 3y ago
    How so?
    - lxgr 3y ago
      You can totally have an on-premise appliance that behaves like a black box, is remotely managed by the vendor and depends on their cloud services for even basic functionality. (Not saying that this is what WhatsApp's solution is – I've never looked into it!)

burgerrito 3y ago

I think I used WhatsApp around that time... I'm pretty sure I was able to use it normally

baby 3y ago
yeah same, didn't notice any downtime

7e 3y ago

WhatsApp eventually comes down.

EgregiousCube 3y ago

I haven't used WhatsApp in ages, and a couple hours ago I got a very persistent scammer trying to get me to talk to them. Probably just a coincidence, but it makes me wonder if this is security related.

Ensorceled 3y ago
I had the same experience. Also anecdotal but maybe a few more data points….

leesalminen 3y ago

Basically everything I was doing came to a grinding halt for 45 minutes because I live in Latin America, where your entire life runs on WhatsApp. It's infuriating because nobody will consider any other messaging app. My phone's carrier also gives everyone several free GBs of WhatsApp data per month.

seany 3y ago
> My phone's carrier also gives everyone several free GBs of WhatsApp data per month. Meta is surely compensating them in some form
- DanitaBaires 3y ago
  It has been like that before Meta.
- toast0 3y ago
  I worked on carrier partnerships (among many other things) while I was at WhatsApp, from before FB through 2019. Carriers wanted to setup special pricing (including zero-rating) for WhatsApp with or without our help or approval. Before acquisition, the only compensation we provided was approval to use our brand (which we didn't have resources to litigate around the world over anyway), our list of IPs (and notifications when they changed), and maybe a little bit of guidance/support on how to identify traffic; although from conversations I had, the DPI vendors had ways of doing it anyway without our help. In return, WA got some amount of marketing, and sometimes access to zero cost SMS (used for registration). Additionally, by participating with carriers, rather than letting them do their own thing, we were able to influence them towards providing a good experience for users; WA did not approve of text only special pricing[1], it had to include attachments, and we did our best to keep carriers updated on IPs to reduce the amount of miscategorized usage leading to overage or connectivity problems. To my knowledge, there was only one deal with monetary compensation, but it theoretically flowed to WA, not to the carrier. My understanding is the carriers wanted to run these deals because they attract customers who often convert to full internet plans. Messaging is nice, but customers eventually get outside links and want to experience the web or other applications. Post acquisition, deals moved into Facebook's mobile partner portal, and afaik, there was still no compensation for WhatsApp deals, but the MPP does also offer analytics (audience insights) to carriers, and I'm not sure if it's a requirement to have a special pricing deal to get that or not. It's been several years, so it's possible the program has changed. [1] If you've seen that on planes, it wasn't authorized when I was there, and I don't think it's authorized now, but it doesn't stop a motivated network from providing the service.

notorandit 3y ago

[flagged]

cpursley 3y ago

Did they switch from Erlang to Ruby or JavaScript?

jmrm 3y ago

I don't have anything to support this, but I think WhatsApp get down every time they make a major server side update. IIRC there was a major down just before they added calls. Maybe I'll check up later the dates

ajhai 3y ago

This status page is for WhatsApp Business API (https://developers.facebook.com/docs/whatsapp/cloud-api/ https://developers.facebook.com/docs/whatsapp/cloud-api/) and not for the consumer product that most of us depend on.

lxgr 3y ago
Arguably businesses are affected too if none of their customers can message anybody, including them.