8 ms·

Unpopular opinion but technically correct answer: you can fly any plane without a pilots license. In fact I just saw a Quora question with this exact question

Unpopular opinion but technically correct answer: you can fly any plane without a pilots license. In fact I just saw a Quora question with this exact question and the answer came from a 60 year old pilot that has been flying without a license for 30 years. If you never fly out of a major airport where an FAA inspector can ramp check you, who will ever find out? Please don’t do this.

userbinator 3y ago
and the answer came from a 60 year old pilot that has been flying without a license for 30 years. More precisely, someone who claims to be one online.
- serf 3y ago
  it's not an uncommon story, so I don't really doubt it. lots of history with older crop-duster or other utility-craft pilots who sort of passively ignore the FAA.
- grepfru_it 3y ago
  Think about people in the Midwest who flew with their parents and inherited a Cessna. They may have never gotten a pilots license but racked up thousands of hours. They take off and land on a grass strip or their own private paved runway. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? How about a kid who loved planes but parents did not or could not afford lessons. They found simulators and cut their teeth on 20 years of Microsoft flight simulator and x-plane. Then they fly with some friends who comment on their remarkable flying skills. This emboldened pilot continues to fly without a license without an incident. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? How about a drug runner in Columbia or Mexico who learned to fly on his or her own to make $10k per flight. Mastering extreme short field takeoffs/landings and abandoning the plane afterwards. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? Please do not do this.
  - civilitty 3y ago
    > How about a drug runner in Columbia who learned to fly on his or her own to make $10k per flight. Mastering extreme short field landings and abandoning the plane afterwards. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? > Please do not do this. Seriously, you should never do this. Narco subs are much more effective than planes nowadays.
  - seanmcdirmid 3y ago
    > How about a kid who loved planes but parents did not or could not afford lessons. They found simulators and cut their teeth on 20 years of Microsoft flight simulator and x-plane. That reminds me of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colton_Harris_Moore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colton_Harris_Moore, but he stole the plane so it doesn't really count.
- digi59404 3y ago
  FWIW, I’ve personally met someone who this exact scenario applied too. His father flew planes in WW2 then came back and flew crop dusters. As a kid his father would let him fly and taught him how. He never went and got his FAA License. He just flew small planes like Cessnas to/from private areas. No one ever bothered him or asked him for his license.
  - sugarkjube 3y ago
    He probably didn't tell you the whole story. Of course, if one has learned to fly, one can. And a license is just paperwork. But there is more to flying, like getting an aircraft, and getting insurance. Want to rent an aircraft? you'll not only need a license but also a check out. You don't always have to show your license, but sometimes they do ask. Also no license, means no insurance.
    - travisjungroth 3y ago
      I was a pilot and have personally known about situations such as these, in detail. It happens. They don’t rent airplanes, they buy them. Sellers usually don’t check licenses. They don’t get insurance. If you don’t get ramp checked (random FAA check of pilot) or crash, there’s no reason it will get checked.
    - grepfru_it 3y ago
      You do not need a license for liability insurance. Liability insurance does not cover the pilot
- taneq 3y ago
  What do you want GP poster to do, check their license? :P
Dalewyn 3y ago
In the same vein, the only reason you need a license is because you use publicly owned space. For a mundane example, consider your driver's license. You only need it because you drive on public roads and highways; a driver's license is a license stating you are competent enough to not ruin the shared public roads and highways. Likewise, a pilot's license is a license stating you are competent enough to not ruin the skies shared by all. Commercial equivalents for those licenses also detail how you are competent enough to be entrusted with other peoples' lives or things, but I digress. So if you take your car on a drive on your own, private land, you don't need a driver's license. Hell, you probably don't even need to register that car. Likewise, if you own a chunk of airspace and fly strictly within it, you don't need a license and you probably don't need to register the plane either. Of course, nobody's going to be owning chunks of airspace like that so this is all theoretical. Also IANAL, please don't do shit based off what some random hooligan spews on the intertubez.
- 8note 3y ago
  It's kinda silly though, compared to driving, there's very little public space that somebody else would be using
  - all2 3y ago
    You also need to consider what ground you're over. If you do this (and you definitely shouldn't) stick to airspace above uninhabited areas like national parks, BLM areas, etc.
- amluto 3y ago
  > Hell, you probably don't even need to register that car. In California at least, you are required to file for “planned non-operation”, which is inexpensive but not free.
  - taneq 3y ago
    Is that the same as de-registering the car? In Australia if you have a car that you don't intend to drive on the road, you can just hand the number plates back. They refund the remainder of your licensing fees and you're done. The car can still be driven (even without a driver's license) on private land, just not public roads. If you want to drive it on the road again, you have to re-register it and get it inspected.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
paulddraper 3y ago
I'm a private pilot. This is basically correct. If your airport is small and you never get in trouble with ATC or have an emergency situation, you will probably not get caught. However, if you do get caught, it is a criminal charge with (IIRC) up to $250,000 fine and 6 years prison time. Or worse, you overestimate your ability and die/kill people. I wouldn't take that risk. If you want to fly a lot, get a license. If you want to fly a little, make friends with a pilot. You can even get a student license with relatively few requirements, and fly solo (no passengers) during the day. --- That said, I do sympathize with people wanting to opt out of the FAA's draconian rules. (E.g. If you have been professionally diagnosed with ADHD, the FAA bans you from any pilot's license ever, even a student license. :/ Lovely)
- chrisweekly 3y ago
  > "E.g. If you have been professionally diagnosed with ADHD, the FAA bans you from any pilot's license ever, even a student license. :/" What?! That's incredible. If more people were trying to get their licenses I bet the ACLU would fix that nonsensical bigotry and embarrass the FAA in court.
  - paulddraper 3y ago
    You have no idea how many professional pilots avoid seeking mental health treatment. Because it would literally destroy their career. Kinda scary actually.
    - operatingthetan 3y ago
      That's a huge perverse incentive. Doesn't make me feel safer!
      - godelski 3y ago
        Same is true for a lot of government jobs, especially things that require a security clearance. Ironically this makes people vulnerable to exactly what these institutions are most afraid of: blackmail.
sugarkjube 3y ago
You can fly a plane without a licence just like you can drive a car without a licence. No problem at all. Until you're caught or in a crash. You can't however, unlike a car, fly a plane without having been taught. If you try, you may be able to get in the air, but the difficult part is getting back on the ground alive.
- Dalewyn 3y ago
  We can't drive a car without having been taught either. Granted, the amount of training required to drive a car pales in comparison to flying an aircraft, but it's not like humans can just drive a car straight out of the womb.
  - OJFord 3y ago
    If it's an automatic, you only really need a vague cultural awareness of what a car is and how it works I think. (Ignoring driving well, fuel efficiently, understanding road markings, etc. - just enough to get around and improve as you go.) Push this to go, steer direction with this. Quite like a boat (motor) - certainly don't need lessons to get going with a wheel and a lever, or directing an outboard motor or rudder.

userbinator 3y ago

and the answer came from a 60 year old pilot that has been flying without a license for 30 years. More precisely, someone who claims to be one online.

serf 3y ago
it's not an uncommon story, so I don't really doubt it. lots of history with older crop-duster or other utility-craft pilots who sort of passively ignore the FAA.
grepfru_it 3y ago
Think about people in the Midwest who flew with their parents and inherited a Cessna. They may have never gotten a pilots license but racked up thousands of hours. They take off and land on a grass strip or their own private paved runway. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? How about a kid who loved planes but parents did not or could not afford lessons. They found simulators and cut their teeth on 20 years of Microsoft flight simulator and x-plane. Then they fly with some friends who comment on their remarkable flying skills. This emboldened pilot continues to fly without a license without an incident. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? How about a drug runner in Columbia or Mexico who learned to fly on his or her own to make $10k per flight. Mastering extreme short field takeoffs/landings and abandoning the plane afterwards. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? Please do not do this.
- civilitty 3y ago
  > How about a drug runner in Columbia who learned to fly on his or her own to make $10k per flight. Mastering extreme short field landings and abandoning the plane afterwards. Why (in their eyes) would they need a license? > Please do not do this. Seriously, you should never do this. Narco subs are much more effective than planes nowadays.
- seanmcdirmid 3y ago
  > How about a kid who loved planes but parents did not or could not afford lessons. They found simulators and cut their teeth on 20 years of Microsoft flight simulator and x-plane. That reminds me of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colton_Harris_Moore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colton_Harris_Moore, but he stole the plane so it doesn't really count.
digi59404 3y ago
FWIW, I’ve personally met someone who this exact scenario applied too. His father flew planes in WW2 then came back and flew crop dusters. As a kid his father would let him fly and taught him how. He never went and got his FAA License. He just flew small planes like Cessnas to/from private areas. No one ever bothered him or asked him for his license.
- sugarkjube 3y ago
  He probably didn't tell you the whole story. Of course, if one has learned to fly, one can. And a license is just paperwork. But there is more to flying, like getting an aircraft, and getting insurance. Want to rent an aircraft? you'll not only need a license but also a check out. You don't always have to show your license, but sometimes they do ask. Also no license, means no insurance.
  - travisjungroth 3y ago
    I was a pilot and have personally known about situations such as these, in detail. It happens. They don’t rent airplanes, they buy them. Sellers usually don’t check licenses. They don’t get insurance. If you don’t get ramp checked (random FAA check of pilot) or crash, there’s no reason it will get checked.
  - grepfru_it 3y ago
    You do not need a license for liability insurance. Liability insurance does not cover the pilot
taneq 3y ago
What do you want GP poster to do, check their license? :P

Dalewyn 3y ago

In the same vein, the only reason you need a license is because you use publicly owned space. For a mundane example, consider your driver's license. You only need it because you drive on public roads and highways; a driver's license is a license stating you are competent enough to not ruin the shared public roads and highways. Likewise, a pilot's license is a license stating you are competent enough to not ruin the skies shared by all. Commercial equivalents for those licenses also detail how you are competent enough to be entrusted with other peoples' lives or things, but I digress. So if you take your car on a drive on your own, private land, you don't need a driver's license. Hell, you probably don't even need to register that car. Likewise, if you own a chunk of airspace and fly strictly within it, you don't need a license and you probably don't need to register the plane either. Of course, nobody's going to be owning chunks of airspace like that so this is all theoretical. Also IANAL, please don't do shit based off what some random hooligan spews on the intertubez.

8note 3y ago
It's kinda silly though, compared to driving, there's very little public space that somebody else would be using
- all2 3y ago
  You also need to consider what ground you're over. If you do this (and you definitely shouldn't) stick to airspace above uninhabited areas like national parks, BLM areas, etc.
amluto 3y ago
> Hell, you probably don't even need to register that car. In California at least, you are required to file for “planned non-operation”, which is inexpensive but not free.
- taneq 3y ago
  Is that the same as de-registering the car? In Australia if you have a car that you don't intend to drive on the road, you can just hand the number plates back. They refund the remainder of your licensing fees and you're done. The car can still be driven (even without a driver's license) on private land, just not public roads. If you want to drive it on the road again, you have to re-register it and get it inspected.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

paulddraper 3y ago

I'm a private pilot. This is basically correct. If your airport is small and you never get in trouble with ATC or have an emergency situation, you will probably not get caught. However, if you do get caught, it is a criminal charge with (IIRC) up to $250,000 fine and 6 years prison time. Or worse, you overestimate your ability and die/kill people. I wouldn't take that risk. If you want to fly a lot, get a license. If you want to fly a little, make friends with a pilot. You can even get a student license with relatively few requirements, and fly solo (no passengers) during the day. --- That said, I do sympathize with people wanting to opt out of the FAA's draconian rules. (E.g. If you have been professionally diagnosed with ADHD, the FAA bans you from any pilot's license ever, even a student license. :/ Lovely)

chrisweekly 3y ago
> "E.g. If you have been professionally diagnosed with ADHD, the FAA bans you from any pilot's license ever, even a student license. :/" What?! That's incredible. If more people were trying to get their licenses I bet the ACLU would fix that nonsensical bigotry and embarrass the FAA in court.
- paulddraper 3y ago
  You have no idea how many professional pilots avoid seeking mental health treatment. Because it would literally destroy their career. Kinda scary actually.
  - operatingthetan 3y ago
    That's a huge perverse incentive. Doesn't make me feel safer!
    - godelski 3y ago
      Same is true for a lot of government jobs, especially things that require a security clearance. Ironically this makes people vulnerable to exactly what these institutions are most afraid of: blackmail.

sugarkjube 3y ago

You can fly a plane without a licence just like you can drive a car without a licence. No problem at all. Until you're caught or in a crash. You can't however, unlike a car, fly a plane without having been taught. If you try, you may be able to get in the air, but the difficult part is getting back on the ground alive.

Dalewyn 3y ago
We can't drive a car without having been taught either. Granted, the amount of training required to drive a car pales in comparison to flying an aircraft, but it's not like humans can just drive a car straight out of the womb.
- OJFord 3y ago
  If it's an automatic, you only really need a vague cultural awareness of what a car is and how it works I think. (Ignoring driving well, fuel efficiently, understanding road markings, etc. - just enough to get around and improve as you go.) Push this to go, steer direction with this. Quite like a boat (motor) - certainly don't need lessons to get going with a wheel and a lever, or directing an outboard motor or rudder.