6 ms·

Experiments show knives manufactured from frozen human feces do not work [pdf]

28 points by bigdict 3y ago

metabagel 3y ago
Ignobel Prize contender
- tdeck 3y ago
  It really does seem like that's what they're aiming for, doesn't it?
- hilbert42 3y ago
  Damn! you beat me to it.
- dekhn 3y ago
  They already won! https://improbable.com/ig/winners/#ig2020 https://improbable.com/ig/winners/#ig2020
King-Aaron 3y ago
This directly links to a pdf, maybe want to warn people in the title. I'm not opening a random fkn pdf about poo that just automatically downloads.
- bigdict 3y ago
  Done, thanks. The pdf is of a scientific article.
- defrost 3y ago
  It's literally a one pager; Journal of Archaeological Science: Reports Volume 27, October 2019, 102002 with a hosted web version at https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X19305371 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X1... The Abstract outlines the goal of puncturing a myth: The ethnographic account of an Inuit man manufacturing a knife from his own frozen feces to butcher and disarticulate a dog has permeated both the academic literature and popular culture. To evaluate the validity of this claim, we tested the basis of that account via experimental archaeology. Our experiments assessed the functionality of knives made from human feces in controlled conditions that provided optimal conditions for success. However, they were not functional. While much research has shown foragers to be technologically resourceful, innovative, and savvy, we suggest that this ethnographic account should no longer be used to support that narrative. I'm reminded of our undergrad in-campus physics journal article on the results of several students shaving with razors some of which where kept under pyramids against a control group which were not.
  - bigdict 3y ago
    This is a better link, wish I could update.
    - defrost 3y ago
      It's a good find, not hugely significant but it gave me a chuckle :-)
  - King-Aaron 3y ago
    Appreciate the run-down on it, and may read later. But I tend to be wary when you click a link and suddenly a small file unexpectedly downloads.
    - defrost 3y ago
      Understandable - I pulled it down through a Qubes sandbox and the Convert to Trusted PDF tool https://blog.invisiblethings.org/2013/02/21/converting-untrusted-pdfs-into-trusted.html https://blog.invisiblethings.org/2013/02/21/converting-untru...
black_13 3y ago
The perfect gift for the 1 percent
srcreigh 3y ago
Pictures in the word doc linked to here [1] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X19305371#ec0005 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X1...
blitzar 3y ago
MYTH BUSTED
empiricus 3y ago
"The use of saliva to sharpen a frozen fecal blade, as the original account describes (Davis, 1998), might also be examined. " It seems to me that some Inuit tried to troll the researchers :)
- tut-urut-utut 3y ago
  This just shows “researchers” are happy to research any shit that receives funding.
theflyingelvis 3y ago
Welp, good to know. I guess
TazeTSchnitzel 3y ago
There are a great many other unconventional materials you can make knives out of, though: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCg3qsVzHeUt5_cPpcRtoaJQ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCg3qsVzHeUt5_cPpcRtoaJQ
- somedude895 3y ago
  What a gem of a channel! I watched the meat knife one and was mesmerized by the wonderful weirdness and calm.
  - rkagerer 3y ago
    What was with the spinach / oxalic acid?
    - s1artibartfast 3y ago
      Nitrate, NO−3 which is later used to preserve the chicken along with Carbon monoxide. It was unclear from the video how much the preservatives contributed to the structural properties of the knife, or if they were just used to preserve it during the 2 weeks at 90F, which I assume dessicated the meat.
xaellison 3y ago
A paper claiming that an account about shit is bullshit is, I think, the best representation of Elsevier's presence in academia.
Michelangelo11 3y ago
Two thoughts: - OK, the poop knife claim in the story sounds incredibly weird, but what about using a dog's rib cage as a sled? It would not only be too small, but there's no way it could support a grown man's weight. It amazes me that anybody could ever take this story as anything other than a troll. - I'm fascinated by the fact that, in the discussion section, the authors spend paragraphs justifying this work on the basis of how it affects narratives about the ingenuity of indigenous and prehistoric peoples. Says so much about the state of science.
jwilk 3y ago
Previously: 2019: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20958786 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20958786 (17 comments) 2020: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22686036 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22686036 (4 comments) 2020: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24531654 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24531654 (11 comments)
vogon_laureate 3y ago
Damn! Going to have to bin that startup idea and go back to the drawing board. All that hard work down the toilet...
Dig1t 3y ago
>Knives from the ceramic molds failed to cut or slice the pig hide, leaving only streaks The picture is pretty funny.
Tommah 3y ago
They should have titled it "Cut the Crap."
GJR 3y ago
No shit.
omniglottal 3y ago
"Failed to cut or slice..." This is obviously a stabbing weapon. A spike would also fail to cut or slice. This is bad science.

28 points by bigdict 3y ago

metabagel 3y ago

Ignobel Prize contender

tdeck 3y ago
It really does seem like that's what they're aiming for, doesn't it?
hilbert42 3y ago
Damn! you beat me to it.
dekhn 3y ago
They already won! https://improbable.com/ig/winners/#ig2020 https://improbable.com/ig/winners/#ig2020

King-Aaron 3y ago

This directly links to a pdf, maybe want to warn people in the title. I'm not opening a random fkn pdf about poo that just automatically downloads.

bigdict 3y ago
Done, thanks. The pdf is of a scientific article.
defrost 3y ago
It's literally a one pager; Journal of Archaeological Science: Reports Volume 27, October 2019, 102002 with a hosted web version at https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X19305371 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X1... The Abstract outlines the goal of puncturing a myth: The ethnographic account of an Inuit man manufacturing a knife from his own frozen feces to butcher and disarticulate a dog has permeated both the academic literature and popular culture. To evaluate the validity of this claim, we tested the basis of that account via experimental archaeology. Our experiments assessed the functionality of knives made from human feces in controlled conditions that provided optimal conditions for success. However, they were not functional. While much research has shown foragers to be technologically resourceful, innovative, and savvy, we suggest that this ethnographic account should no longer be used to support that narrative. I'm reminded of our undergrad in-campus physics journal article on the results of several students shaving with razors some of which where kept under pyramids against a control group which were not.
- bigdict 3y ago
  This is a better link, wish I could update.
  - defrost 3y ago
    It's a good find, not hugely significant but it gave me a chuckle :-)
- King-Aaron 3y ago
  Appreciate the run-down on it, and may read later. But I tend to be wary when you click a link and suddenly a small file unexpectedly downloads.
  - defrost 3y ago
    Understandable - I pulled it down through a Qubes sandbox and the Convert to Trusted PDF tool https://blog.invisiblethings.org/2013/02/21/converting-untrusted-pdfs-into-trusted.html https://blog.invisiblethings.org/2013/02/21/converting-untru...

black_13 3y ago

The perfect gift for the 1 percent

srcreigh 3y ago

Pictures in the word doc linked to here [1] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X19305371#ec0005 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352409X1...

blitzar 3y ago

MYTH BUSTED

empiricus 3y ago

"The use of saliva to sharpen a frozen fecal blade, as the original account describes (Davis, 1998), might also be examined. " It seems to me that some Inuit tried to troll the researchers :)

tut-urut-utut 3y ago
This just shows “researchers” are happy to research any shit that receives funding.

theflyingelvis 3y ago

Welp, good to know. I guess

TazeTSchnitzel 3y ago

There are a great many other unconventional materials you can make knives out of, though: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCg3qsVzHeUt5_cPpcRtoaJQ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCg3qsVzHeUt5_cPpcRtoaJQ

somedude895 3y ago
What a gem of a channel! I watched the meat knife one and was mesmerized by the wonderful weirdness and calm.
- rkagerer 3y ago
  What was with the spinach / oxalic acid?
  - s1artibartfast 3y ago
    Nitrate, NO−3 which is later used to preserve the chicken along with Carbon monoxide. It was unclear from the video how much the preservatives contributed to the structural properties of the knife, or if they were just used to preserve it during the 2 weeks at 90F, which I assume dessicated the meat.

xaellison 3y ago

A paper claiming that an account about shit is bullshit is, I think, the best representation of Elsevier's presence in academia.

Michelangelo11 3y ago

Two thoughts: - OK, the poop knife claim in the story sounds incredibly weird, but what about using a dog's rib cage as a sled? It would not only be too small, but there's no way it could support a grown man's weight. It amazes me that anybody could ever take this story as anything other than a troll. - I'm fascinated by the fact that, in the discussion section, the authors spend paragraphs justifying this work on the basis of how it affects narratives about the ingenuity of indigenous and prehistoric peoples. Says so much about the state of science.

jwilk 3y ago

Previously: 2019: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20958786 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20958786 (17 comments) 2020: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22686036 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22686036 (4 comments) 2020: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24531654 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24531654 (11 comments)

vogon_laureate 3y ago

Damn! Going to have to bin that startup idea and go back to the drawing board. All that hard work down the toilet...

Dig1t 3y ago

>Knives from the ceramic molds failed to cut or slice the pig hide, leaving only streaks The picture is pretty funny.

Tommah 3y ago

They should have titled it "Cut the Crap."

GJR 3y ago

No shit.

omniglottal 3y ago

"Failed to cut or slice..." This is obviously a stabbing weapon. A spike would also fail to cut or slice. This is bad science.