5 ms·

More like 18 months or less based on the height and weight limit, completely impractical pricing

dumpster_fire 3y ago
You totally underestimate how much baby fever tax first time parents are willing to pay using the logic "once in a lifetime only".
- esalman 3y ago
  This is exactly what I meant when I said the price is justifiable. It is designed to be advertised as a premium product to an exclusive set of customers.
foooorsyth 3y ago
Lots of couples stair-step their kids. It’s not 18 months for a lot of families. It’s 4-6 years with hand-me-downs.
- remote_phone 3y ago
  Baby seats have expiration dates and it’s scary how many parents fall for the emotional manipulation around that. It makes the used car seat market dead as well as hand-me-downs
  - foooorsyth 3y ago
    >it’s scary how many parents fall for the emotional manipulation around that Are you saying that the expiration dates are bogus? I knew that rated sports helmets and similar products had expirations, but not car seats. Maybe I'll go check the handed-down seat my son is using...
    - bombcar 3y ago
      They're basically bogus but put out because people don't bother inspecting the components and the makers really like selling additional ones. And basically all thrift stores and other used good dealers won't touch them because of the perceived liability.
  - jagtstronaut 3y ago
    I wouldn't care about an expiration date, but I avoid the hand-me-down car seat market for the wreck reason. The carseats are only designed to be in one. I personally wouldn't know how to definitively say it had never been in one.
    - LeifCarrotson 3y ago
      Hand-me-down, to me, connotes reuse within the same (possibly extended) family. I'm fine sharing our used carseat with my 6yo only child's grandparents so that they can more easily help with my nieces and nephews (2 weeks, 1yo, 3yo, 4yo, and 5yo - oof!). My wife and I know it's not been in an accident, we would not misrepresent that to the detriment of our own family. But I would not buy one from even the most trustworthy Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace listing imaginable. I personally would love tamper-evident components within a carseat - think "Tip and Tell" [1] but for 3-axis accelerations. Impact-sensitive product labels exist such as those at [2], but I'm not convinced that the same accelerations and crashes that would damage polystyrene impact-absorbing foam would set off a glass ampule designed to break when you drop a rental camera lens or something like that. 1: https://www.uline.com/Product/Detail/S-866/Damage-Indicators/Tip-N-Tell-Indicators https://www.uline.com/Product/Detail/S-866/Damage-Indicators... 2: https://spotsee.io/impact https://spotsee.io/impact
    - aquaphile 3y ago
      NHTSA guidelines on re-use post crash are at https://www.nhtsa.gov/car-seats-and-booster-seats/car-seat-use-after-crash https://www.nhtsa.gov/car-seats-and-booster-seats/car-seat-u...
- esalman 3y ago
  We actually sold our 2 year old nuna for nearly 75% of it's original price to another family. It had 10 year warranty and not recall/accident. I doubt how much these would go for secondhand. Which is not an issue if you stair-step the seat.
aquaphile 3y ago
Sizing > Realistically, the seat fits average kids up to 3 years. At the 95% percentile on height most kids will outgrow a rear-facing car seat at 18 months (the growth of the torso is the limiting factor). From a labeling perspective we have to be careful, though, because the US regs on sizing are really terrible. Keep in mind the regs were written in the 1970s when we were still teaching Americans to wear seat belts. So there are 2 "options" in the US regs: 22 lbs 12-month test dummy, and 39 lbs 3-yr old test dummy. Lots of manufacturers claim their seats fit the 39 lbs mark, but they squash the test dummy's legs into an unrealistic position for a child (passes the test by the letter of the law, but misses the spirit of the law). Basically, we designed this seat to fit kids until they are ready for a front-facing seat. Pricing > It isn't for everyone. The Kioma seat is like a Maserati, but some people prefer a Ford Taurus. We have to charge a price to cover our production and design costs, and there is a quantitative and qualitative difference in the materials and performance of a Kioma car seat.
- wlesieutre 3y ago
  > The Kioma seat is like a Maserati Perhaps not the best brand to invoke for a product where reliability is paramount. If you want to convey both luxury and reliability I'd go with Lexus (fancy Toyota).
  - aquaphile 3y ago
    ;) Point taken.
fsckboy 3y ago
$1000 is too much for Target and Walmart, but for Beverly Hills, the Hamptons, etc. that's nothing. If your living room has space for a Peleton bike, this will fit right in.
- benburleson 3y ago
  You don't put your Peloton in your living room like some peasant if you're buying a $1000 car seat.
  - Firmwarrior 3y ago
    What if you live in a $9000/month 900 square foot condo in the bay area?
  - fsckboy 3y ago
    "room" for the bike was metonymic for "room" in your budget
o_m 3y ago
I'm the kind of guy that thinks I might be able to sell it for a good price, if it is high quality, after the use. Making the total money spent way less. But that begs the question, why not rent these out for 18 months at a time?
- abfan1127 3y ago
  renting assumes previous users properly maintained these seats. Car seats are "supposed" to be disposed of in the event of a collision due to possible cracks or other fatigues in the structure not necessarily visible to the end user. If you rent, you have to assume the seat was not in a structurally significant event. That's a lot of trust.
  - esalman 3y ago
    Given how these car seats are advertised as having high-tech materials, I wonder if the manufacturer can install a crash detection module in them.
- benburleson 3y ago
  Most likely because you can't guarantee how it has been used once the first customer has used it. And that will lead to major legal problems if e.g. it has been in a crash and is now compromised, but nobody noticed, then failed to protect the 2nd child.
- roland35 3y ago
  The foam doesn't stay good for long, I think the car seats we had expired after 6-7 years? Also car seats can't be used after a crash, even if visually they looked ok. Maybe they could be refurbished (new foam, etc), but obviously this is a liability concern and probably isn't worth it.

You totally underestimate how much baby fever tax first time parents are willing to pay using the logic "once in a lifetime only".

esalman 3y ago
This is exactly what I meant when I said the price is justifiable. It is designed to be advertised as a premium product to an exclusive set of customers.

foooorsyth 3y ago

Lots of couples stair-step their kids. It’s not 18 months for a lot of families. It’s 4-6 years with hand-me-downs.

remote_phone 3y ago
Baby seats have expiration dates and it’s scary how many parents fall for the emotional manipulation around that. It makes the used car seat market dead as well as hand-me-downs
- foooorsyth 3y ago
  >it’s scary how many parents fall for the emotional manipulation around that Are you saying that the expiration dates are bogus? I knew that rated sports helmets and similar products had expirations, but not car seats. Maybe I'll go check the handed-down seat my son is using...
  - bombcar 3y ago
    They're basically bogus but put out because people don't bother inspecting the components and the makers really like selling additional ones. And basically all thrift stores and other used good dealers won't touch them because of the perceived liability.
- jagtstronaut 3y ago
  I wouldn't care about an expiration date, but I avoid the hand-me-down car seat market for the wreck reason. The carseats are only designed to be in one. I personally wouldn't know how to definitively say it had never been in one.
  - LeifCarrotson 3y ago
    Hand-me-down, to me, connotes reuse within the same (possibly extended) family. I'm fine sharing our used carseat with my 6yo only child's grandparents so that they can more easily help with my nieces and nephews (2 weeks, 1yo, 3yo, 4yo, and 5yo - oof!). My wife and I know it's not been in an accident, we would not misrepresent that to the detriment of our own family. But I would not buy one from even the most trustworthy Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace listing imaginable. I personally would love tamper-evident components within a carseat - think "Tip and Tell" [1] but for 3-axis accelerations. Impact-sensitive product labels exist such as those at [2], but I'm not convinced that the same accelerations and crashes that would damage polystyrene impact-absorbing foam would set off a glass ampule designed to break when you drop a rental camera lens or something like that. 1: https://www.uline.com/Product/Detail/S-866/Damage-Indicators/Tip-N-Tell-Indicators https://www.uline.com/Product/Detail/S-866/Damage-Indicators... 2: https://spotsee.io/impact https://spotsee.io/impact
  - aquaphile 3y ago
    NHTSA guidelines on re-use post crash are at https://www.nhtsa.gov/car-seats-and-booster-seats/car-seat-use-after-crash https://www.nhtsa.gov/car-seats-and-booster-seats/car-seat-u...
esalman 3y ago
We actually sold our 2 year old nuna for nearly 75% of it's original price to another family. It had 10 year warranty and not recall/accident. I doubt how much these would go for secondhand. Which is not an issue if you stair-step the seat.

aquaphile 3y ago

Sizing > Realistically, the seat fits average kids up to 3 years. At the 95% percentile on height most kids will outgrow a rear-facing car seat at 18 months (the growth of the torso is the limiting factor). From a labeling perspective we have to be careful, though, because the US regs on sizing are really terrible. Keep in mind the regs were written in the 1970s when we were still teaching Americans to wear seat belts. So there are 2 "options" in the US regs: 22 lbs 12-month test dummy, and 39 lbs 3-yr old test dummy. Lots of manufacturers claim their seats fit the 39 lbs mark, but they squash the test dummy's legs into an unrealistic position for a child (passes the test by the letter of the law, but misses the spirit of the law). Basically, we designed this seat to fit kids until they are ready for a front-facing seat. Pricing > It isn't for everyone. The Kioma seat is like a Maserati, but some people prefer a Ford Taurus. We have to charge a price to cover our production and design costs, and there is a quantitative and qualitative difference in the materials and performance of a Kioma car seat.

wlesieutre 3y ago
> The Kioma seat is like a Maserati Perhaps not the best brand to invoke for a product where reliability is paramount. If you want to convey both luxury and reliability I'd go with Lexus (fancy Toyota).
- aquaphile 3y ago
  ;) Point taken.

fsckboy 3y ago

$1000 is too much for Target and Walmart, but for Beverly Hills, the Hamptons, etc. that's nothing. If your living room has space for a Peleton bike, this will fit right in.

benburleson 3y ago
You don't put your Peloton in your living room like some peasant if you're buying a $1000 car seat.
- Firmwarrior 3y ago
  What if you live in a $9000/month 900 square foot condo in the bay area?
- fsckboy 3y ago
  "room" for the bike was metonymic for "room" in your budget

o_m 3y ago

I'm the kind of guy that thinks I might be able to sell it for a good price, if it is high quality, after the use. Making the total money spent way less. But that begs the question, why not rent these out for 18 months at a time?

abfan1127 3y ago
renting assumes previous users properly maintained these seats. Car seats are "supposed" to be disposed of in the event of a collision due to possible cracks or other fatigues in the structure not necessarily visible to the end user. If you rent, you have to assume the seat was not in a structurally significant event. That's a lot of trust.
- esalman 3y ago
  Given how these car seats are advertised as having high-tech materials, I wonder if the manufacturer can install a crash detection module in them.
benburleson 3y ago
Most likely because you can't guarantee how it has been used once the first customer has used it. And that will lead to major legal problems if e.g. it has been in a crash and is now compromised, but nobody noticed, then failed to protect the 2nd child.
roland35 3y ago
The foam doesn't stay good for long, I think the car seats we had expired after 6-7 years? Also car seats can't be used after a crash, even if visually they looked ok. Maybe they could be refurbished (new foam, etc), but obviously this is a liability concern and probably isn't worth it.