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I agree with you but that sentiment is unpopular in tech circles. I would go further and say porn should be decriminalized but regulated like drugs. Adults shou

by _8j50 3y ago

I agree with you but that sentiment is unpopular in tech circles. I would go further and say porn should be decriminalized but regulated like drugs. Adults should be allowed to use it but their use should be only to allowed dispenseries/sites and monitored for "overdose" with addiction/rehab help provided at the dispensery/site and a large warning text about its harm like cigarettes. With the exception of small audience live videos or screenshots (onlyfans and sexting) being unregulated.

erenyeager 3y ago
Curious where would social media sites that are used sometimes for pornographic purposes fall under this? Obviously something like PHub only serves to distribute porn. But things like Twitter, Reddit, etc. are well known for their “secondary” purposes. For example there are many chat apps aimed towards teenagers that are prolifically used for exchanging videos and pictures between adults and minors (at least de facto, even if de jure it is against terms). Of course there’s a big difference between a porn production company versus an individual, but often social platforms are conduits for more “black hat” behavior.
- _8j50 3y ago
  That's what I was addressing with the "small audience" or one-to-one messaging. So long as the sender is sending to a small number of specific individuals (i.e.: small subreddit or DMing small number of people) it should be unregulated. The consensus is that humans just can't maintain meaningful relationships with more than 150 people so that should be the "small" threshold. The moment the number of viewers/receivers is more than that, it becomes a felony if they fail to follow regulations and notices to users. So if a private group chat grows to have 151 users then everyone sending nudes in that chat is criminally liable unless the group chat has the neccesary warnings and links to where people can get help and moderation to make sure shared content is consensual and legal as well as making sure participants are of legal age. For "children", the solution is enabling parents to regulate what content kids consume (not just porn but anything really).
LocalH 3y ago
What right do you have to decide what I look at? I reject your desire to control the content intake of others. Choose what you want to view, and leave other people alone.
- _8j50 3y ago
  What right does the government have to control what people smoke, drink or inject into themselves? If porn is harmless then I am with you there but it is addictive and harmful.
  - LocalH 3y ago
    > but it is addictive and harmful That's not at all a given.
  - Shaanie 3y ago
    So is social media, and social media is likely worse, but hopefully you apply the same logic to that?
  - shortcake27 3y ago
    > If porn is harmless then I am with you there but it is addictive and harmful. You keep spouting this nonsense to the point you’re confusing opinion and fact. There is little evidence to suggest porn is harmful to teenagers, let alone adults. The majority of discourse around porn is opinionated. Porn has NOT been widely proved (as in, not just studies funded by groups with agendas) to be addictive and harmful in adults. Check yourself.
weard_beard 3y ago
What behaviors or socially impacting outcomes do you see from current standards and lack of regulation? What makes pornography different from corn syrup is that over indulgence in corn syrup leads to fewer suitable recruits for our military and over indulgence in porn leads to fewer rapes. Jesus, if he saw our culture, would be burning corn fields and flipping tables at fast food restaurants. Pornography wouldn't even make his top 10. Why do we need to regulate it?
- erenyeager 3y ago
  Any evidence for fewer rapes due to porn availability? I’ve seen evidence of porn encouraging violent behaviors in men towards women.
  - shrimp_emoji 3y ago
    Here's an article saying that both retrospective and prospective trials, flawed as they are, show that porn consumption decreases sexual assault: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/all-about-sex/201707/more-porn-less-rape-the-controversy-revisited https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/all-about-sex/201707...
    - weard_beard 3y ago
      Here’s a u/militaryporn link talking about the same thing every Iraq veteran talks about, everyone’s favorite Burger King, how they call it a royale with cheese, and dumpster diving for burgers after hours: https://www.reddit.com/r/MilitaryPorn/comments/vwjoax/us_soldiers_having_lunch_at_a_burger_king_in_a/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MilitaryPorn/comments/vwjoax/us_sol...
- _8j50 3y ago
  I am gonna ignore most of what you said since it is strawman argumenting and whataboutism. But corn syrup is not addictive but porn is. How about this though: The government should either regulate porn or stop regulating things that are harmful and addictive entirely. I am fine with either outcome but I would prefer if porn was regulated. And fwiw, I never made the argument that porn should be regulated for moral or social-harm reasons. It harms the individual's mind and affects their lives long term. Also, porn production itself can be harmful to the sex workers. Look at it differently, brothels are regulated right? Same thing, except I added that the brothels and porn sites also have warnings and help for both sex workers and users. Of course you people only care about whatever extreme political spectrum you're clinging on to. Nothing I said prevents anyone from accessing legally produced porn. You just get a warning and help if you want it. If you don't think there is harm or that people want help, look at r/nofap So typical, sacrifice people at the altar of political conformity.
shortcake27 3y ago
It’s unpopular because you’re advocating to oppress people based on your own personal opinion.
- _8j50 3y ago
  In the same way cigarettes,alchol and hard drugs being controlled is opressing people?
  - shrimp_emoji 3y ago
    Oppressing people over human expression and totally endogenous mental/bodily processes in reaction to those expressions seems a little further down the slippery slope of some dystopic panoptiprison than controlling addictive drugs. If you think porn is on the same order of harm as alcohol, you need to lay off the sauce.
    - erenyeager 3y ago
      Addictive drugs are also only amplifying existing human brain connections. And you can very easily liken porn to an exogenous substance that distorts how sex actually is and promotes fantasy. Measuring harm really depends on the context also. Porn production is often linked with human trafficking and exploitation of disadvantaged people.
      - omniglottal 3y ago
        Some of these things are illegal. Some are legal. When shutting down illegal things, it's a bad idea to target legal things.
        erenyeager 3y ago
        Porn is illegal for minors
      - predictabl3 3y ago
        "promotes fantasy". Gasp! Dear folks, if you have an honest, open relationship with your partner, and communicate about the kind of fantasy you enjoy, you can in fact achieve "fantasy" as well. I'm sorry, this is losing the point a bit, but there really is something so telling about the projection behind "fantasy [bad]" and "you might have fantastical thoughts". Yup, some of it's a bit wild, and I hope everyone has the joy of a partner to safely explore and experience that with, sans judgement.
jen20 3y ago
I can get behind this for porn if you can get behind the same for bibles.
- _8j50 3y ago
  Are you saying bibles are addictive or holding a belief of some sort in itself is harmful? There is emprical proof of the addicticveness and harm for porn, I didn't call for regulating morality.
  - defrost 3y ago
    I'm pretty sure Jim Jones wasn't reading Playboy and suicide bombers aren't shouting Praise Hefner. There's some empirical evidence for you re: harmful effects of religion. Per capita what's the comparison with porn in terms of number and severity of extreme responses?
    - _8j50 3y ago
      And stalin was atheist so atheism should be banned because it isn't protected asa religion right? And islam should be banned right. You changed to this strawman argument so let's have it. People are responsible for their own actions. You can't blame information people consume because sane people have the ability to accept or reject information as correct or incorrect and killing people is one the most basic wrongs a sane person can discern. In effect your childish argument is that if a person uses some text as their reason for murdering then it is no longer that person who is responsible but the text that is bypassing their ability to tell apart from right and wrong and therefor that text should be banned? Tell me, what belief system or lack of it do you accept where people who share that belief never harm anyone ever? > Per capita what's the comparison with porn in terms of number and severity of extreme responses? Again, strawmam! You yourself made the claim that porn is harmful to society, not I. But your asking me to defend your assertion lol. While we are at, let's compare how many conservatives vs democrats are school shooters and pedophiles and I'm sure conservatives are more so let's ban the republican party and conservatism right? If uninformed childish people like you had their way I am sure you would end up genociding everyone that looks thinks or believes in any way different than you. You mistake the fact that your belief is popular and tolerated to mean you have the right to persecute others or use persecution as an argument or threat to fend off any disagreement. Please try to argue in good faith and using sound arguments. My argument is simple: porn is addicting, sex workers that make porn are not always in good conditions and porn overuse has a harmful effect to the user. So, much like drugs and prostitution people should be allowed to access it but in a way that is regulated and where rehabilitation and help is readily available. You still get your porn, but your argument is that others shouldn't do it safely or be informed because... you hate bibles? Come on! Maybe you could have said to me that bibles should have similar warnings and all that to which I would say unlike porn, religion is protected from such things but even if it wasn't, freedom of speech and religion exists and you are able to warn/discourse against the bible or any religion freely. So, unless the platforms that make the bible available to Christians (e.g.: the internet) don't allow your disagreeing belief to be made available (never mind the fact that schools teach things that disagree with thr bible but can't teach the bible!) then all you're doing is displaying your hate in bad faith here.

by _8j50 3y ago

erenyeager 3y ago

Curious where would social media sites that are used sometimes for pornographic purposes fall under this? Obviously something like PHub only serves to distribute porn. But things like Twitter, Reddit, etc. are well known for their “secondary” purposes. For example there are many chat apps aimed towards teenagers that are prolifically used for exchanging videos and pictures between adults and minors (at least de facto, even if de jure it is against terms). Of course there’s a big difference between a porn production company versus an individual, but often social platforms are conduits for more “black hat” behavior.

_8j50 3y ago
That's what I was addressing with the "small audience" or one-to-one messaging. So long as the sender is sending to a small number of specific individuals (i.e.: small subreddit or DMing small number of people) it should be unregulated. The consensus is that humans just can't maintain meaningful relationships with more than 150 people so that should be the "small" threshold. The moment the number of viewers/receivers is more than that, it becomes a felony if they fail to follow regulations and notices to users. So if a private group chat grows to have 151 users then everyone sending nudes in that chat is criminally liable unless the group chat has the neccesary warnings and links to where people can get help and moderation to make sure shared content is consensual and legal as well as making sure participants are of legal age. For "children", the solution is enabling parents to regulate what content kids consume (not just porn but anything really).

LocalH 3y ago

What right do you have to decide what I look at? I reject your desire to control the content intake of others. Choose what you want to view, and leave other people alone.

_8j50 3y ago
What right does the government have to control what people smoke, drink or inject into themselves? If porn is harmless then I am with you there but it is addictive and harmful.
- LocalH 3y ago
  > but it is addictive and harmful That's not at all a given.
- Shaanie 3y ago
  So is social media, and social media is likely worse, but hopefully you apply the same logic to that?
- shortcake27 3y ago
  > If porn is harmless then I am with you there but it is addictive and harmful. You keep spouting this nonsense to the point you’re confusing opinion and fact. There is little evidence to suggest porn is harmful to teenagers, let alone adults. The majority of discourse around porn is opinionated. Porn has NOT been widely proved (as in, not just studies funded by groups with agendas) to be addictive and harmful in adults. Check yourself.

weard_beard 3y ago

What behaviors or socially impacting outcomes do you see from current standards and lack of regulation? What makes pornography different from corn syrup is that over indulgence in corn syrup leads to fewer suitable recruits for our military and over indulgence in porn leads to fewer rapes. Jesus, if he saw our culture, would be burning corn fields and flipping tables at fast food restaurants. Pornography wouldn't even make his top 10. Why do we need to regulate it?

erenyeager 3y ago
Any evidence for fewer rapes due to porn availability? I’ve seen evidence of porn encouraging violent behaviors in men towards women.
- shrimp_emoji 3y ago
  Here's an article saying that both retrospective and prospective trials, flawed as they are, show that porn consumption decreases sexual assault: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/all-about-sex/201707/more-porn-less-rape-the-controversy-revisited https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/all-about-sex/201707...
  - weard_beard 3y ago
    Here’s a u/militaryporn link talking about the same thing every Iraq veteran talks about, everyone’s favorite Burger King, how they call it a royale with cheese, and dumpster diving for burgers after hours: https://www.reddit.com/r/MilitaryPorn/comments/vwjoax/us_soldiers_having_lunch_at_a_burger_king_in_a/ https://www.reddit.com/r/MilitaryPorn/comments/vwjoax/us_sol...
_8j50 3y ago
I am gonna ignore most of what you said since it is strawman argumenting and whataboutism. But corn syrup is not addictive but porn is. How about this though: The government should either regulate porn or stop regulating things that are harmful and addictive entirely. I am fine with either outcome but I would prefer if porn was regulated. And fwiw, I never made the argument that porn should be regulated for moral or social-harm reasons. It harms the individual's mind and affects their lives long term. Also, porn production itself can be harmful to the sex workers. Look at it differently, brothels are regulated right? Same thing, except I added that the brothels and porn sites also have warnings and help for both sex workers and users. Of course you people only care about whatever extreme political spectrum you're clinging on to. Nothing I said prevents anyone from accessing legally produced porn. You just get a warning and help if you want it. If you don't think there is harm or that people want help, look at r/nofap So typical, sacrifice people at the altar of political conformity.

shortcake27 3y ago

It’s unpopular because you’re advocating to oppress people based on your own personal opinion.

_8j50 3y ago
In the same way cigarettes,alchol and hard drugs being controlled is opressing people?
- shrimp_emoji 3y ago
  Oppressing people over human expression and totally endogenous mental/bodily processes in reaction to those expressions seems a little further down the slippery slope of some dystopic panoptiprison than controlling addictive drugs. If you think porn is on the same order of harm as alcohol, you need to lay off the sauce.
  - erenyeager 3y ago
    Addictive drugs are also only amplifying existing human brain connections. And you can very easily liken porn to an exogenous substance that distorts how sex actually is and promotes fantasy. Measuring harm really depends on the context also. Porn production is often linked with human trafficking and exploitation of disadvantaged people.
    - omniglottal 3y ago
      Some of these things are illegal. Some are legal. When shutting down illegal things, it's a bad idea to target legal things.
      - erenyeager 3y ago
        Porn is illegal for minors
    - predictabl3 3y ago
      "promotes fantasy". Gasp! Dear folks, if you have an honest, open relationship with your partner, and communicate about the kind of fantasy you enjoy, you can in fact achieve "fantasy" as well. I'm sorry, this is losing the point a bit, but there really is something so telling about the projection behind "fantasy [bad]" and "you might have fantastical thoughts". Yup, some of it's a bit wild, and I hope everyone has the joy of a partner to safely explore and experience that with, sans judgement.

jen20 3y ago

I can get behind this for porn if you can get behind the same for bibles.

_8j50 3y ago
Are you saying bibles are addictive or holding a belief of some sort in itself is harmful? There is emprical proof of the addicticveness and harm for porn, I didn't call for regulating morality.
- defrost 3y ago
  I'm pretty sure Jim Jones wasn't reading Playboy and suicide bombers aren't shouting Praise Hefner. There's some empirical evidence for you re: harmful effects of religion. Per capita what's the comparison with porn in terms of number and severity of extreme responses?
  - _8j50 3y ago
    And stalin was atheist so atheism should be banned because it isn't protected asa religion right? And islam should be banned right. You changed to this strawman argument so let's have it. People are responsible for their own actions. You can't blame information people consume because sane people have the ability to accept or reject information as correct or incorrect and killing people is one the most basic wrongs a sane person can discern. In effect your childish argument is that if a person uses some text as their reason for murdering then it is no longer that person who is responsible but the text that is bypassing their ability to tell apart from right and wrong and therefor that text should be banned? Tell me, what belief system or lack of it do you accept where people who share that belief never harm anyone ever? > Per capita what's the comparison with porn in terms of number and severity of extreme responses? Again, strawmam! You yourself made the claim that porn is harmful to society, not I. But your asking me to defend your assertion lol. While we are at, let's compare how many conservatives vs democrats are school shooters and pedophiles and I'm sure conservatives are more so let's ban the republican party and conservatism right? If uninformed childish people like you had their way I am sure you would end up genociding everyone that looks thinks or believes in any way different than you. You mistake the fact that your belief is popular and tolerated to mean you have the right to persecute others or use persecution as an argument or threat to fend off any disagreement. Please try to argue in good faith and using sound arguments. My argument is simple: porn is addicting, sex workers that make porn are not always in good conditions and porn overuse has a harmful effect to the user. So, much like drugs and prostitution people should be allowed to access it but in a way that is regulated and where rehabilitation and help is readily available. You still get your porn, but your argument is that others shouldn't do it safely or be informed because... you hate bibles? Come on! Maybe you could have said to me that bibles should have similar warnings and all that to which I would say unlike porn, religion is protected from such things but even if it wasn't, freedom of speech and religion exists and you are able to warn/discourse against the bible or any religion freely. So, unless the platforms that make the bible available to Christians (e.g.: the internet) don't allow your disagreeing belief to be made available (never mind the fact that schools teach things that disagree with thr bible but can't teach the bible!) then all you're doing is displaying your hate in bad faith here.