5 ms·

Most swattings aren't the actual swat team but the police. A lot of streamers don't go to deep into it to not draw attention to it, but both ludwig and summits

Most swattings aren't the actual swat team but the police. A lot of streamers don't go to deep into it to not draw attention to it, but both ludwig and summits swattings were just cops. Sometimes the cop does pull a gun, but it's honestly why this should be attempted murder. How do you blame the cop for pulling the gun on someone who was reported to already have killed 4 people and said they were going to kill another. The alternative is basically ignoring all threats pretending they're fake, putting the cops lives in danger in a real situation.

paxys 3y ago
Which is even worse. Regular police officers with a high school diploma and a few weeks worth of training (if even that) showing up at your door with military surplus equipment wanting to play hero.
- lockhouse 3y ago
  > Regular police officers with a high school diploma That's an odd take. What would a college degree bring to the table for a regular beat cop/patrolman? > showing up at your door with military surplus equipment wanting to play hero What education level do you think a typical military service member has to wield the same equipment? https://www.statista.com/statistics/232726/education-levels-of-active-duty-us-defense-force-personnel/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/232726/education-levels-... Also, US Army Infantry training is only 22 weeks long.
  - alistairSH 3y ago
    Mississippi requires only 10 weeks. Many states are around 20. Soldiers aren’t armed in the normal course of a day on base. Massive difference. Fact is American police are under-trained and over-armed.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
  - tbrownaw 3y ago
    > What would a college degree bring to the table for a regular beat cop/patrolman? Because Reasons, it's become expected that anyone capable of getting a college degree will get one. Which in turn means that not having one gets used as a signal of not being able to get one. The push to stop listing a degree in job postings that don't actually use one is partly intended to correct this.
  - bawolff 3y ago
    > That's an odd take. What would a college degree bring to the table for a regular beat cop/patrolman? Cops are expected to be able to descalate situations, identify suspicious situations, in theory behave in accordancd with the rule of law and limitations on police force, and much more. These all seem like things that could be in a degree program.
    - Gud 3y ago
      And why would a degree program be better than on the job training? I’m not saying the theory is not important - I just don’t see how years of theoretical study is warranted
      - tourmalinetaco 3y ago
        Okay, now replace “police” with “doctor” or “lawyer”. In a job that is mostly theory, having theoretical study is important. Because otherwise lives are ruined. It also helps to filter deadbeats who just want to abuse the system, which is unfortunately a non-zero percentage of police. I’m not saying we need 10+ years of study, but at least a bachelors focused on civics and humane treatment + a psych evaluation would do wonders to clearing out abusers.
        Gud 3y ago
        That’s because those jobs are highly theoretical. Being a street cop is not.
        bawolff 3y ago
        I think fundamentally i don't agree with that.
        orwin 3y ago
        Being a painter/woodworker/upholsterer is way less theoretical than being a street cop. But if you hire an untrained one, or one that only learned on the job, you'll have a way, way worse end result than if you hire a formed one (or it will take trice the time and double the materials, if I listen to my father's stories). Two years is enough for low-level workers, i'd guess 3 to 4 should do the work for the police (considering it's 6 to 8 years and a masterwork for compagnons, pro woodworkers/upholsterers would still be better trained than police).
  - eftychis 3y ago
    In Greece it is 3 years of studies to become a patrol police officer. To be a ranking officer it is 4 years and counts as a bachelor. There is also a 2 year special force which supposedly catches up to the same standard, that's a different discussion. And all that to get on the street without a gun. To get a gun you need another half to one year of on the street training. But the problem is the gun ho culture. Here are some on the news examples. a) there is an armed robbery with an ak-47: US go in and start a gun fight, EU/Greece: tell everyone to let the robbers go and note the license plate, catching them a few hours later with no shots fired; b) person wants to commit suicide by cop, everyone else has left the building: U.S. cops rush in blind, get shot and kill the guy; Greece: there is nothing really equivalent, cops just try to get a psychologist and stay away; And if the cops shoot someone the public disagrees with, expect weeks of lynching and rioting. c) mental I'll person with a gun: U.S.: full escalation and long gunfight; Greece: in front of the parliament: chat de-escalation no shot fired by anyone. Comments are yours. P.S. (And gun ownership has nothing to do with it. Where I am from there is practically WWII weaponry -- minus the tanks -- everywhere. People learn to shoot really young and keep it up.)
    - Our_Benefactors 3y ago
      Your impression of policing in the USA is a caricature of reality. B) and C) are particularly offensive to make as unsupported claims. Policing in the USA is handled at a state level, and the policing product varies widely between localities. Bad policing in the USA gets attention from around the world. Good policing in the USA gets none. Your comments betray a deep ignorance of policing challenges in the USA. As a word of advice, commenting on domestic political issues of foreign nations often causes one to appear quite foolish, due to a lack of understanding the constituent factors.
      - alistairSH 3y ago
        US resident here. Policing in the US does vary by municipality, which is part of the problem. Regardless, policing in the US is broken. I live in one of the wealthiest counties in the nation and our police still kill people with disturbing frequency.
  - stjohnswarts 3y ago
    For one it would prove that they have at least -some- self control and self discipline. Also the military basically keeps 19 year olds in tight reign with an clean line of command and a lot of training to do what you're told with relatively very rare combat situtations and when they get in those situations they are surrounded by others doing exactly the same thing, rather than alone (or at most a partner) in a community that hates cops.
- petesergeant 3y ago
  > Regular police officers with a high school diploma and a few weeks worth of training Meanwhile, the UK is moving to a model that requires the equivalent of a three-year undergraduate in policing[0]. Also the po-po there generally don't have guns. 0: https://www.prospects.ac.uk/jobs-and-work-experience/job-sectors/law-enforcement-and-security/joining-the-police https://www.prospects.ac.uk/jobs-and-work-experience/job-sec...
  - defrost 3y ago
    For 'Basic Bobby' it reads more like a three year trade apprenticeship: You can choose to undertake a three-year Level 6 degree apprenticeship, which involves both on and off-the-job training. As with other apprenticeships, you'll earn while you learn and upon successful completion of the programme, you'll have finished your probation as a police constable and will have achieved the BSc Professional Policing Practice. Undergrad degrees don't have on the job training + probationary. Looks appopriate though. Basic Constable here is two years - six month coursework, 18 month probie. https://www.jobsandskills.wa.gov.au/jobs-and-careers/occupations/police-officer https://www.jobsandskills.wa.gov.au/jobs-and-careers/occupat...
    - petesergeant 3y ago
      I’m not disagreeing, but note that what you’ve quoted does in fact confer an accredited undergrad degree
      - defrost 3y ago
        Sure .. but typically for centuries in commonwealth countries undergrad university degrees don't include paid on the job training. Sure, medical degrees include time in hospitals after the basics are completed, etc .. all that aside this really does read like a (good) trade apprenticeship program - time split between course work and supervised practice, which I agree with. But a Bachelor of Science equivilent undergrad degree? Apparently technically yes .. but that does seem a stretch.
  - Zpalmtree 3y ago
kevin_thibedeau 3y ago
Lots of podunk towns have police who engage in paramilitary cosplay [1]. All reinforced by surplus sales of military equipment they don't need. [1] https://youtu.be/0bNy7XO-SCI?t=23 https://youtu.be/0bNy7XO-SCI?t=23
- lockhouse 3y ago
  None of this changes the fact that some jerk is putting a household in harms way by maliciously calling the police on them.
  - pas 3y ago
    so? where's the deterrence?
- rcurry 3y ago
  And lots of podunk towns also have officers who live in the community, hang out with you and your family at the Saturday Fish Fry, and know that when some new neighbors from the city call 911 because they see me crossing the road at 0200 in full camouflage it’s probably just Rusty out huntin’ yotes. There are always one-offs, for sure, but most country cops are good folks who usually give the town drunk a ride home and will probably just give you a warning the first you decide to act like an idiot.

paxys 3y ago

Which is even worse. Regular police officers with a high school diploma and a few weeks worth of training (if even that) showing up at your door with military surplus equipment wanting to play hero.

lockhouse 3y ago
> Regular police officers with a high school diploma That's an odd take. What would a college degree bring to the table for a regular beat cop/patrolman? > showing up at your door with military surplus equipment wanting to play hero What education level do you think a typical military service member has to wield the same equipment? https://www.statista.com/statistics/232726/education-levels-of-active-duty-us-defense-force-personnel/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/232726/education-levels-... Also, US Army Infantry training is only 22 weeks long.
- alistairSH 3y ago
  Mississippi requires only 10 weeks. Many states are around 20. Soldiers aren’t armed in the normal course of a day on base. Massive difference. Fact is American police are under-trained and over-armed.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- tbrownaw 3y ago
  > What would a college degree bring to the table for a regular beat cop/patrolman? Because Reasons, it's become expected that anyone capable of getting a college degree will get one. Which in turn means that not having one gets used as a signal of not being able to get one. The push to stop listing a degree in job postings that don't actually use one is partly intended to correct this.
- bawolff 3y ago
  > That's an odd take. What would a college degree bring to the table for a regular beat cop/patrolman? Cops are expected to be able to descalate situations, identify suspicious situations, in theory behave in accordancd with the rule of law and limitations on police force, and much more. These all seem like things that could be in a degree program.
  - Gud 3y ago
    And why would a degree program be better than on the job training? I’m not saying the theory is not important - I just don’t see how years of theoretical study is warranted
    - tourmalinetaco 3y ago
      Okay, now replace “police” with “doctor” or “lawyer”. In a job that is mostly theory, having theoretical study is important. Because otherwise lives are ruined. It also helps to filter deadbeats who just want to abuse the system, which is unfortunately a non-zero percentage of police. I’m not saying we need 10+ years of study, but at least a bachelors focused on civics and humane treatment + a psych evaluation would do wonders to clearing out abusers.
      - Gud 3y ago
        That’s because those jobs are highly theoretical. Being a street cop is not.
        bawolff 3y ago
        I think fundamentally i don't agree with that.
        orwin 3y ago
        Being a painter/woodworker/upholsterer is way less theoretical than being a street cop. But if you hire an untrained one, or one that only learned on the job, you'll have a way, way worse end result than if you hire a formed one (or it will take trice the time and double the materials, if I listen to my father's stories). Two years is enough for low-level workers, i'd guess 3 to 4 should do the work for the police (considering it's 6 to 8 years and a masterwork for compagnons, pro woodworkers/upholsterers would still be better trained than police).
- eftychis 3y ago
  In Greece it is 3 years of studies to become a patrol police officer. To be a ranking officer it is 4 years and counts as a bachelor. There is also a 2 year special force which supposedly catches up to the same standard, that's a different discussion. And all that to get on the street without a gun. To get a gun you need another half to one year of on the street training. But the problem is the gun ho culture. Here are some on the news examples. a) there is an armed robbery with an ak-47: US go in and start a gun fight, EU/Greece: tell everyone to let the robbers go and note the license plate, catching them a few hours later with no shots fired; b) person wants to commit suicide by cop, everyone else has left the building: U.S. cops rush in blind, get shot and kill the guy; Greece: there is nothing really equivalent, cops just try to get a psychologist and stay away; And if the cops shoot someone the public disagrees with, expect weeks of lynching and rioting. c) mental I'll person with a gun: U.S.: full escalation and long gunfight; Greece: in front of the parliament: chat de-escalation no shot fired by anyone. Comments are yours. P.S. (And gun ownership has nothing to do with it. Where I am from there is practically WWII weaponry -- minus the tanks -- everywhere. People learn to shoot really young and keep it up.)
  - Our_Benefactors 3y ago
    Your impression of policing in the USA is a caricature of reality. B) and C) are particularly offensive to make as unsupported claims. Policing in the USA is handled at a state level, and the policing product varies widely between localities. Bad policing in the USA gets attention from around the world. Good policing in the USA gets none. Your comments betray a deep ignorance of policing challenges in the USA. As a word of advice, commenting on domestic political issues of foreign nations often causes one to appear quite foolish, due to a lack of understanding the constituent factors.
    - alistairSH 3y ago
      US resident here. Policing in the US does vary by municipality, which is part of the problem. Regardless, policing in the US is broken. I live in one of the wealthiest counties in the nation and our police still kill people with disturbing frequency.
- stjohnswarts 3y ago
  For one it would prove that they have at least -some- self control and self discipline. Also the military basically keeps 19 year olds in tight reign with an clean line of command and a lot of training to do what you're told with relatively very rare combat situtations and when they get in those situations they are surrounded by others doing exactly the same thing, rather than alone (or at most a partner) in a community that hates cops.
petesergeant 3y ago
> Regular police officers with a high school diploma and a few weeks worth of training Meanwhile, the UK is moving to a model that requires the equivalent of a three-year undergraduate in policing[0]. Also the po-po there generally don't have guns. 0: https://www.prospects.ac.uk/jobs-and-work-experience/job-sectors/law-enforcement-and-security/joining-the-police https://www.prospects.ac.uk/jobs-and-work-experience/job-sec...
- defrost 3y ago
  For 'Basic Bobby' it reads more like a three year trade apprenticeship: You can choose to undertake a three-year Level 6 degree apprenticeship, which involves both on and off-the-job training. As with other apprenticeships, you'll earn while you learn and upon successful completion of the programme, you'll have finished your probation as a police constable and will have achieved the BSc Professional Policing Practice. Undergrad degrees don't have on the job training + probationary. Looks appopriate though. Basic Constable here is two years - six month coursework, 18 month probie. https://www.jobsandskills.wa.gov.au/jobs-and-careers/occupations/police-officer https://www.jobsandskills.wa.gov.au/jobs-and-careers/occupat...
  - petesergeant 3y ago
    I’m not disagreeing, but note that what you’ve quoted does in fact confer an accredited undergrad degree
    - defrost 3y ago
      Sure .. but typically for centuries in commonwealth countries undergrad university degrees don't include paid on the job training. Sure, medical degrees include time in hospitals after the basics are completed, etc .. all that aside this really does read like a (good) trade apprenticeship program - time split between course work and supervised practice, which I agree with. But a Bachelor of Science equivilent undergrad degree? Apparently technically yes .. but that does seem a stretch.
- Zpalmtree 3y ago

kevin_thibedeau 3y ago

Lots of podunk towns have police who engage in paramilitary cosplay [1]. All reinforced by surplus sales of military equipment they don't need. [1] https://youtu.be/0bNy7XO-SCI?t=23 https://youtu.be/0bNy7XO-SCI?t=23

lockhouse 3y ago
None of this changes the fact that some jerk is putting a household in harms way by maliciously calling the police on them.
- pas 3y ago
  so? where's the deterrence?
rcurry 3y ago
And lots of podunk towns also have officers who live in the community, hang out with you and your family at the Saturday Fish Fry, and know that when some new neighbors from the city call 911 because they see me crossing the road at 0200 in full camouflage it’s probably just Rusty out huntin’ yotes. There are always one-offs, for sure, but most country cops are good folks who usually give the town drunk a ride home and will probably just give you a warning the first you decide to act like an idiot.