4 ms·

They are toxic. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_ferrocyanide https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_ferrocyanide The amount is small enough, that it is

They are toxic. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_ferrocyanide https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_ferrocyanide The amount is small enough, that it is supposed to do no harm, but I just prefer my salt without cyanide.

amelius 3y ago
I guess you will still get it in most restaurants.
- hutzlibu 3y ago
  As well as in any processed food I am buying, yes I am aware of that. But when I have the choice, I prefer the non toxic salt (and it is still mindblowing to me, how it became normal to add cyanide to salt in the first place).
  - Rediscover 3y ago
    Same boat (non-toxic salt). I've mostly switched to MSG (except for paella), and much prefer it.
  - smallerfish 3y ago
    I mean, table salt in general carries pollutants from its source, e.g. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/microplastics-found-90-percent-table-salt-sea-salt https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/micro...
    - hutzlibu 3y ago
      Yup, there are cheap salts with their own toxins and even expensive Himalaya salt can probably contain bad stuff. But at least here in germany, there are (non government) organisations that test food for their poisons and you can buy their test results, also for salt, in the shape of a magazine. And even they can be wrong, sure, but I can still avoid poison where possible, so if I see no reason to voluntarily add cyanide on top of all the other shit for no good reason, I simply won't.
NovemberWhiskey 3y ago
>They are toxic. If you ate enough salt to reach a toxic dose of sodium ferrocyanide, you’d already be dead from hypernatremia though? The dose makes the poison.
- hutzlibu 3y ago
  "The dose makes the poison." Yes it does and it all adds up. So why would I add more things, that are poisenous even at small doses, when I can easily avoid it?
  - NovemberWhiskey 3y ago
    >Yes it does and it all adds up. No, it doesn't, because sodium ferrocyanide is poorly absorbed in the first place and not bioaccumulative in humans. I suppose you also don't each spinach or almonds either?
    - hutzlibu 3y ago
      "spinach" nope and of almonds not too many either. But my point is, sodium ferrocyanide intake is not beneficial, (unlike ordinary sodium). Even if it might do no harm, why should I risk even little harm? And with adding up, well there is a whole libary of other toxic or potentially toxic additives in the normal food you can buy. I prefer to minimize the potential bad intake, that's all.
      - oniony 3y ago
        Also watch out for the arsenic in rice. Some people don't each rice for this reason, but I just eat around it.
        verall 3y ago
        It adds to the richness IMO.
  - coldtea 3y ago
wumms 3y ago
Me too - though the LD50s (rat, oral) of both are quite close: NaCl: 3.000 mg·kg−1 [0] Na4[Fe(CN)6]: 1600–3200 mg·kg−1 [1] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_chloride https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_chloride [1] (german, as the english version has no LD50) https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natriumhexacyanidoferrat(II) https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natriumhexacyanidoferrat(II)
xkcd-sucks 3y ago
With ferrocyanide in particular ([Fe(CN)6]4−), the reason cyanide (CN-) is such bad news is also the reason it's safe complexed to iron: Iron-Cyanide coordination is very strongly favored by thermodynamics and kinetics, so it likes to stick to iron, sticks very quickly, and un-sticks itself very slowly. When cyanide is not already coordinated to iron, it coordinates to the iron in hemoglobin (+ COX enzymes in mitochondria, and other less immediately important enzymes) and makes them not work, basically forever. But when CN- is already stuck coordinated to free iron, it doesn't really fall off enough to stick itself to enzymes in any meaningful amount. It would be more of a problem if CN- accumulated, but it's metabolized and excreted quickly enough to not be a big deal. The LD50 values basically reflect this.

amelius 3y ago

I guess you will still get it in most restaurants.

hutzlibu 3y ago
As well as in any processed food I am buying, yes I am aware of that. But when I have the choice, I prefer the non toxic salt (and it is still mindblowing to me, how it became normal to add cyanide to salt in the first place).
- Rediscover 3y ago
  Same boat (non-toxic salt). I've mostly switched to MSG (except for paella), and much prefer it.
- smallerfish 3y ago
  I mean, table salt in general carries pollutants from its source, e.g. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/microplastics-found-90-percent-table-salt-sea-salt https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/micro...
  - hutzlibu 3y ago
    Yup, there are cheap salts with their own toxins and even expensive Himalaya salt can probably contain bad stuff. But at least here in germany, there are (non government) organisations that test food for their poisons and you can buy their test results, also for salt, in the shape of a magazine. And even they can be wrong, sure, but I can still avoid poison where possible, so if I see no reason to voluntarily add cyanide on top of all the other shit for no good reason, I simply won't.

NovemberWhiskey 3y ago

>They are toxic. If you ate enough salt to reach a toxic dose of sodium ferrocyanide, you’d already be dead from hypernatremia though? The dose makes the poison.

hutzlibu 3y ago
"The dose makes the poison." Yes it does and it all adds up. So why would I add more things, that are poisenous even at small doses, when I can easily avoid it?
- NovemberWhiskey 3y ago
  >Yes it does and it all adds up. No, it doesn't, because sodium ferrocyanide is poorly absorbed in the first place and not bioaccumulative in humans. I suppose you also don't each spinach or almonds either?
  - hutzlibu 3y ago
    "spinach" nope and of almonds not too many either. But my point is, sodium ferrocyanide intake is not beneficial, (unlike ordinary sodium). Even if it might do no harm, why should I risk even little harm? And with adding up, well there is a whole libary of other toxic or potentially toxic additives in the normal food you can buy. I prefer to minimize the potential bad intake, that's all.
    - oniony 3y ago
      Also watch out for the arsenic in rice. Some people don't each rice for this reason, but I just eat around it.
      - verall 3y ago
        It adds to the richness IMO.
- coldtea 3y ago

wumms 3y ago

Me too - though the LD50s (rat, oral) of both are quite close: NaCl: 3.000 mg·kg−1 [0] Na4[Fe(CN)6]: 1600–3200 mg·kg−1 [1] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_chloride https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_chloride [1] (german, as the english version has no LD50) https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natriumhexacyanidoferrat(II) https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natriumhexacyanidoferrat(II)

xkcd-sucks 3y ago

With ferrocyanide in particular ([Fe(CN)6]4−), the reason cyanide (CN-) is such bad news is also the reason it's safe complexed to iron: Iron-Cyanide coordination is very strongly favored by thermodynamics and kinetics, so it likes to stick to iron, sticks very quickly, and un-sticks itself very slowly. When cyanide is not already coordinated to iron, it coordinates to the iron in hemoglobin (+ COX enzymes in mitochondria, and other less immediately important enzymes) and makes them not work, basically forever. But when CN- is already stuck coordinated to free iron, it doesn't really fall off enough to stick itself to enzymes in any meaningful amount. It would be more of a problem if CN- accumulated, but it's metabolized and excreted quickly enough to not be a big deal. The LD50 values basically reflect this.