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Agree, but having the battery on a long umbilical cord that gets in your way, instead of strapped to the back of the headset to equalize weight distribution and

Agree, but having the battery on a long umbilical cord that gets in your way, instead of strapped to the back of the headset to equalize weight distribution and remove the long cord, feels like a huge oversight. Mounting an external battery pack to the back strap of the Quest headsets has always been a common mod and it feels bizarre for Apple to ship theirs with an external battery on an umbilical cord that you have to manage as a user, as it's an extra hassle that ruins immersion and portability, especially that since I live in a warm climate, my pairs of underwear and shorts I wear in my house have no pockets as I don't need to carry my wallet, phone or keys in my house. What then? Do I hold the battery pack with my teeth or between my ass cheeks while I slice cubs in beat saber? It feels like they prioritized some superficial design goals for the sake of looks, and didn't really think this through enough in terms of ergonomics by actually dogfooding this in users homes, just like their sleek good looking but uncomfortable and stupid wireless mouse that's the only one I know with the charging port on the bottom instead of at the front so you can't use it while charging like every other rechargeable mouse because of Apple's bizarre design choices. I wish I were a fly on the wall in the boardrooms when such design decisions are green lit. Is it the product designers that have the final call? Is it the engineers? Is it a vote by committee or is it one person who has the decision power?

digitalengineer 3y ago
“I want a 3.5K Apple Vision Pro but I can’t wear it naked” is something Apple didn’t think through? Maybe they can sell you an Apple Fanny pack to place the the battery in.
- ChuckNorris89 3y ago
  >“I want a 3.5K Apple Vision Pro but I can’t wear it naked” is something Apple didn’t think through? Well yes, they obviously didn't think through apparently, because, and this might come as a shock to Apple designers in Cupertino, but not all of us are Californians sitting in our air conditioned homes wearing long jeans pants and Patagonia jackets indoor in high summer because our home AC is set to a frosty 20C (68F). In my part of Europe, July and August are unbearable and there's no residential AC in apartments here, so sitting naked at home or in underwear is the only way to make it through these torrid summer months.
  - throwaway675309 3y ago
    Not to be snarky, but you have $3500 of disposable income to blow on a pair of fancy VR goggles... but not enough money to afford a window AC unit?
    - ChuckNorris89 3y ago
      European windows don't slide up like Americana ones to support cubic window mounted AC units, and many offices in the old town don't have AC and everyone is peak summer sweating bullets in t-shirts instead of wearing 2 layers and a jacket like in US offices. Also, I wasn't being snaky at all, Apple is not the only Bay Are corporation to designing consumer products around the climate and lifestyle of the people working for them, omitting the other global demographics that face different climate challenges and lifestyles of those in California. How much are you willing to bet, that the second gen will feature a better battery support as the first gen will get criticized for this?
      - StrictDabbler 3y ago
        Imagine walking in to your boss and saying "boss, the battery pack works, but some sweaty Europeans may be forced to sit naked in their uncooled apartments without a belt to hang it on. I think we should delay the launch." This is a very odd take. Southeast Asians and Louisianans work in conditions that are technically considered "uninhabitable" by OSHA. The response isn't working naked. It is not a use case that any company would consider primary. Also, you know, you can always put on a belt without clothing.
        as_bntd 3y ago
        Not only Europeans... It is simply more comfortable, AC or not. But honestly I imagine I can just leave the battery pack lying besides me or wear some shorts or even buy some underwear with pockets (no way I'm doing this last one though) so it shouldn't be a big issue.
dmak 3y ago
Have you tried the Vision Pro?
- ChuckNorris89 3y ago
  Can't I voice a personal opinion otherwise based on my own usage of other VR headsets in my home?
- prawn 3y ago
  Have you tried their shorts? Future of computing! :) I don’t think the demo was pushing fitness games. I reckon Apple are comfortable leaving the $500 end of this opportunity for Meta and co. I bet they included the power brick as a last resort and after thoroughly testing the weight of other mounted options. Insane to think otherwise.
ElFitz 3y ago
I’d say it probably makes sense for the intended use cases; the ones they have shown in their videos. Mostly sitting on a couch, or leisurely strolling in your huge, mostly empty, living room while discussing with your colleagues or family. Instead of, say, wildly moving your arms around to slice a cube in beat saber, or shoot down a face hugger in Alyx. The other big difference being the supposed ability to clearly see your environnement. But then, this is all suppositions. And they have screwed up more than a few times. Wait and see, I guess.
- ChuckNorris89 3y ago
  Then I guess, I'm not a target customer and Apple doesn't want my money. Fair enough, more money for me for other things. Yay!
  - dwaite 3y ago
    Indeed, taking over control of a market is more trouble than it is really worth. Apple wants alternatives. They're happy just taking the lion's share of profits.
- ChuckNorris89 3y ago
  >Mostly sitting on a couch, or leisurely strolling in your huge, mostly empty, living room while discussing with your colleagues or family. So, 3500$ for a VR Zoom call machine?
  - ElFitz 3y ago
    … Yes? Considering some people’s use cases, the same could be said of a MacBook Pro or an iMac. I mean, have you seen their introduction video? [1] It’s basically watching movies on a huge screen and chatting with heads embedded in floating windows. [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX9qSaGXFyg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX9qSaGXFyg
Abroszka 3y ago
I like the external battery. It's easy to replace and I don't have to strap a large and heavy battery to my head.
- adrian_b 3y ago
  Whether something strapped on your head is balanced or not matters much more for your comfort than its weight. In the past, but even today in some parts of the world, it was a common practice to carry great weights on the head for a long time, with the condition of them being well balanced (because it was more comfortable than carrying them in an unbalanced way, in the arms or on the back).
rjh29 3y ago
That's a whole lot of words for something you can solve by buying a new pair of shorts...
- ChuckNorris89 3y ago
  Ah, the classics Apple "you're holding it wrong", but now it's "your clothes are wrong". Brilliant! I don't want to have a battery pack in my pocket and dangling cable while I'm in VR. Oculus could solve this on a $350 device. Surely paying 10x more could also have this groundbreaking feature.
  - rjh29 3y ago
    I agree with you! But it's a weird hill to die on. Assuming you really want an Apple headset, it can be solved in lots of ways including aftermarket straps or tools or just a roll of sticky tape. Or a shirt with a pocket... I will stick with my Oculus Quest and aftermarket rear battery pack though.
    - ChuckNorris89 3y ago
      >Assuming you really want an Apple headset, it can be solved in lots of ways including aftermarket straps or tools or just a roll of sticky tape. Of course it can be solved with some ducktape, but for $3500 do you fell that's a great UX for your money? That's like buying a Mercedes S-Class and having to manually wind the windows.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
ThalesX 3y ago
> feels like a huge oversight Maybe I'm giving Apple a bit too much credit here, but it feels like they've given this some thought and decided to not go with that based on some sort of rationale, not oversight.
- ChuckNorris89 3y ago
  >but it feels like they've given this some thought and decided to not go with that based on some sort of rationale Was it the same rationale they used to ship the broken butterfly keyboard for 4 years straight, or for the uncomfortable bottom charging mouse that even hardcore Apple fans don't use? It's always funny to see people making excuses for the poor decisions of their favorite corporation as if Apple can do no wrong and it isn't capable of making stupid decisions just like any other big corporation subject to the same internal turf wars and power struggles.
  - acdha 3y ago
    Nobody is saying that they don’t make mistakes but the reason we remembered the butterfly keyboard is that it was a rare high-profile mistake. It seems reasonable to bet that this will be like one of the many thousands of decisions they’ve made well rather than the few memorable failures.
- programmarchy 3y ago
  Don’t batteries get hot? My Mac Air gets hot enough to be too uncomfortable to keep on my lap so there’s no way I’d want one sitting on my head. Seems like most consumers perceive a degree of danger associated with batteries, and don’t want them anywhere near their head.
swader999 3y ago
I ran a similar weight setup on my ebike for night lighting. Not more than a pound but it was pretty hard on my neck after a few months. Putting the battery not on the head is wise imo.
DonHopkins 3y ago
I'm looking forward to Kyle Machulis's third party high capacity butt plug battery and wireless charging seat cushion. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23094477 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23094477 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36377954 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36377954
dfinninger 3y ago
Yes, but why not also sell an iClip that lets you attach the battery to the back of the headset for $99? I might wait for the Belkin one, personally.
throwaway675309 3y ago
I mean it's gonna take all of 10 seconds before third-party headband systems allow you to attach the battery to the back of the headset, so this feels like a non-issue to me. Both the Vive and oculus had lots of third-party support - I don't see that this is gonna be any different.
clnq 3y ago
> but having the battery on a long umbilical cord that gets in your way PC gamers have had to deal with umbilicals for a long time, and it isn’t that bad so long as you don’t move much. Of course, Apple would never say “it’s fine because PC gamers do it”. But it is probably fine.

digitalengineer 3y ago

“I want a 3.5K Apple Vision Pro but I can’t wear it naked” is something Apple didn’t think through? Maybe they can sell you an Apple Fanny pack to place the the battery in.

ChuckNorris89 3y ago
>“I want a 3.5K Apple Vision Pro but I can’t wear it naked” is something Apple didn’t think through? Well yes, they obviously didn't think through apparently, because, and this might come as a shock to Apple designers in Cupertino, but not all of us are Californians sitting in our air conditioned homes wearing long jeans pants and Patagonia jackets indoor in high summer because our home AC is set to a frosty 20C (68F). In my part of Europe, July and August are unbearable and there's no residential AC in apartments here, so sitting naked at home or in underwear is the only way to make it through these torrid summer months.
- throwaway675309 3y ago
  Not to be snarky, but you have $3500 of disposable income to blow on a pair of fancy VR goggles... but not enough money to afford a window AC unit?
  - ChuckNorris89 3y ago
    European windows don't slide up like Americana ones to support cubic window mounted AC units, and many offices in the old town don't have AC and everyone is peak summer sweating bullets in t-shirts instead of wearing 2 layers and a jacket like in US offices. Also, I wasn't being snaky at all, Apple is not the only Bay Are corporation to designing consumer products around the climate and lifestyle of the people working for them, omitting the other global demographics that face different climate challenges and lifestyles of those in California. How much are you willing to bet, that the second gen will feature a better battery support as the first gen will get criticized for this?
    - StrictDabbler 3y ago
      Imagine walking in to your boss and saying "boss, the battery pack works, but some sweaty Europeans may be forced to sit naked in their uncooled apartments without a belt to hang it on. I think we should delay the launch." This is a very odd take. Southeast Asians and Louisianans work in conditions that are technically considered "uninhabitable" by OSHA. The response isn't working naked. It is not a use case that any company would consider primary. Also, you know, you can always put on a belt without clothing.
      - as_bntd 3y ago
        Not only Europeans... It is simply more comfortable, AC or not. But honestly I imagine I can just leave the battery pack lying besides me or wear some shorts or even buy some underwear with pockets (no way I'm doing this last one though) so it shouldn't be a big issue.

dmak 3y ago

Have you tried the Vision Pro?

ChuckNorris89 3y ago
Can't I voice a personal opinion otherwise based on my own usage of other VR headsets in my home?
prawn 3y ago
Have you tried their shorts? Future of computing! :) I don’t think the demo was pushing fitness games. I reckon Apple are comfortable leaving the $500 end of this opportunity for Meta and co. I bet they included the power brick as a last resort and after thoroughly testing the weight of other mounted options. Insane to think otherwise.

ElFitz 3y ago

I’d say it probably makes sense for the intended use cases; the ones they have shown in their videos. Mostly sitting on a couch, or leisurely strolling in your huge, mostly empty, living room while discussing with your colleagues or family. Instead of, say, wildly moving your arms around to slice a cube in beat saber, or shoot down a face hugger in Alyx. The other big difference being the supposed ability to clearly see your environnement. But then, this is all suppositions. And they have screwed up more than a few times. Wait and see, I guess.

ChuckNorris89 3y ago
Then I guess, I'm not a target customer and Apple doesn't want my money. Fair enough, more money for me for other things. Yay!
- dwaite 3y ago
  Indeed, taking over control of a market is more trouble than it is really worth. Apple wants alternatives. They're happy just taking the lion's share of profits.
ChuckNorris89 3y ago
>Mostly sitting on a couch, or leisurely strolling in your huge, mostly empty, living room while discussing with your colleagues or family. So, 3500$ for a VR Zoom call machine?
- ElFitz 3y ago
  … Yes? Considering some people’s use cases, the same could be said of a MacBook Pro or an iMac. I mean, have you seen their introduction video? [1] It’s basically watching movies on a huge screen and chatting with heads embedded in floating windows. [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX9qSaGXFyg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX9qSaGXFyg

Abroszka 3y ago

I like the external battery. It's easy to replace and I don't have to strap a large and heavy battery to my head.

adrian_b 3y ago
Whether something strapped on your head is balanced or not matters much more for your comfort than its weight. In the past, but even today in some parts of the world, it was a common practice to carry great weights on the head for a long time, with the condition of them being well balanced (because it was more comfortable than carrying them in an unbalanced way, in the arms or on the back).

rjh29 3y ago

That's a whole lot of words for something you can solve by buying a new pair of shorts...

ChuckNorris89 3y ago
Ah, the classics Apple "you're holding it wrong", but now it's "your clothes are wrong". Brilliant! I don't want to have a battery pack in my pocket and dangling cable while I'm in VR. Oculus could solve this on a $350 device. Surely paying 10x more could also have this groundbreaking feature.
- rjh29 3y ago
  I agree with you! But it's a weird hill to die on. Assuming you really want an Apple headset, it can be solved in lots of ways including aftermarket straps or tools or just a roll of sticky tape. Or a shirt with a pocket... I will stick with my Oculus Quest and aftermarket rear battery pack though.
  - ChuckNorris89 3y ago
    >Assuming you really want an Apple headset, it can be solved in lots of ways including aftermarket straps or tools or just a roll of sticky tape. Of course it can be solved with some ducktape, but for $3500 do you fell that's a great UX for your money? That's like buying a Mercedes S-Class and having to manually wind the windows.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

ThalesX 3y ago

> feels like a huge oversight Maybe I'm giving Apple a bit too much credit here, but it feels like they've given this some thought and decided to not go with that based on some sort of rationale, not oversight.

ChuckNorris89 3y ago
>but it feels like they've given this some thought and decided to not go with that based on some sort of rationale Was it the same rationale they used to ship the broken butterfly keyboard for 4 years straight, or for the uncomfortable bottom charging mouse that even hardcore Apple fans don't use? It's always funny to see people making excuses for the poor decisions of their favorite corporation as if Apple can do no wrong and it isn't capable of making stupid decisions just like any other big corporation subject to the same internal turf wars and power struggles.
- acdha 3y ago
  Nobody is saying that they don’t make mistakes but the reason we remembered the butterfly keyboard is that it was a rare high-profile mistake. It seems reasonable to bet that this will be like one of the many thousands of decisions they’ve made well rather than the few memorable failures.
programmarchy 3y ago
Don’t batteries get hot? My Mac Air gets hot enough to be too uncomfortable to keep on my lap so there’s no way I’d want one sitting on my head. Seems like most consumers perceive a degree of danger associated with batteries, and don’t want them anywhere near their head.

swader999 3y ago

I ran a similar weight setup on my ebike for night lighting. Not more than a pound but it was pretty hard on my neck after a few months. Putting the battery not on the head is wise imo.

DonHopkins 3y ago

I'm looking forward to Kyle Machulis's third party high capacity butt plug battery and wireless charging seat cushion. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23094477 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23094477 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36377954 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36377954

dfinninger 3y ago

Yes, but why not also sell an iClip that lets you attach the battery to the back of the headset for $99? I might wait for the Belkin one, personally.

throwaway675309 3y ago

I mean it's gonna take all of 10 seconds before third-party headband systems allow you to attach the battery to the back of the headset, so this feels like a non-issue to me. Both the Vive and oculus had lots of third-party support - I don't see that this is gonna be any different.

clnq 3y ago

> but having the battery on a long umbilical cord that gets in your way PC gamers have had to deal with umbilicals for a long time, and it isn’t that bad so long as you don’t move much. Of course, Apple would never say “it’s fine because PC gamers do it”. But it is probably fine.