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What's missing is the culture of respecting other nations' IP, on both commercial level and individual level. Their laws on enforcing IP are practically unilate
by daneel_w 3y ago
What's missing is the culture of respecting other nations' IP, on both commercial level and individual level. Their laws on enforcing IP are practically unilateral in the context of intl. relations.
- civilitty 3y agoHmmm where might have they learned that strategy? [1][2] [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cotton_gin https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cotton_gin [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_Revolution_in_the_United_States https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_Revolution_in_the...
- daneel_w 3y ago[flagged]
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- civilitty 3y agoI'm not apologetic, I'm just not accusatory.
- daneel_w 3y agoYou say that as if you've been living under a rock, completely unaware of China's operations against practically every nation on the planet.
- civilitty 3y agoYou mean all the developed nations’ operation to export almost all production capabilities to China for profit? Cause everyone knew exactly what they were doing when they signed onto those joint ventures that were barely disguised force tech transfers. We made our bed. No point in accusing China when we made it ourselves. Invest that jingoist energy into doing something about it!
- c1ccccc1 3y agoSo I'm not a moral relativist, like, at all. But in this case, it seems like we westerners have constructed one particular set of norms for encouraging innovation, where we decide that it's possible for ideas to be owned. It's not like there's anything intrinsically wrong with copy-pasting code, it's just that we have a legal framework where we've traded away the right to freely copy-paste code so that we can grant a temporary monopoly to its author. We do this in the hope that more useful code will be written than otherwise. But if the people of China decide that that's not a trade-off they want to make, then I don't think we westerners get to say that they've committed a moral wrong in making that decision. It's just that they have a different way of doing things. Like I said, I'm not a moral relativist at all. Murder is still wrong in China, imprisoning people not convicted of any crime is still wrong in China, lying is still wrong in China. But I just don't see how copyright infringement is universally an immoral act.
- trinsic2 3y agoGetting downvoted by the group-think majority. Just know I tend to agree with you. Our country does not get to dictate how the world operates no matter what our beliefs are. And the idea of intellectual property is just a belief, and a bad one at that.
- kevinh456 3y agoOperating under a different set of rules doesn't change the fact that they violate ours. They can be simultaneously right under their own standards and wrong under ours. We can and should judge them under our moral standards.
- senko 3y agoAbsolutely. The gun culture in the US is barbaric. The lack of a social safety net is downright evil, to say nothing about the healthcare costs. -signed, a European
- kevinh456 3y agoI, too, judge Americans who support the current gun culture, oppose a safety net, and fight against socialized medicine. - a reasonable American
- flir 3y agoIt's one of the ways countries bootstrap. Not right or wrong, just is. Once they've climbed the ladder the US climbed, they'll suddenly start caring about IP too.
- varjag 3y agoBootstrap? They had their nuke and launched a satellite by 1970.
- mc32 3y agoSo the argument is somewhere someone did it before we had international conventions and agreed upon bylaws like WTO, etc., but nevermind, someone some time ago did it, so it's okay? Indentured servitude is still openly practiced in some countries, so that would make it okay for every country to do it now? Amazing!
- civilitty 3y agoWay to equate indentured servitude with copying. There's no arguing with such ridiculous histrionics.
- trinsic2 3y agopeople do not get that copying does not equate to stealing. The copyright trolls have done their work well.
- laserdancepony 3y ago[flagged]
- michaelbrave 3y agoI believe the problem is that it's expected of a developing nation, but once a nation is considered developed it's looked down on. Similar to a person acting childish when an adult. China want's to have their cake and eat it too in almost everything, it's "look how powerful we are, how strong our economy", until it's time to respect patents then it's "no we are still developing, you can't hold that against us".
- birdyrooster 3y agoIt’s because China has two faces which are often being viewed simultaneously by foreigners and locals alike. It wants to project peace through power outwardly and put on its best diplomatic display but internally they are training their children to want to kill Americans.
- 3y ago
- some_random 3y ago[flagged]
- toyg 3y agoCome on, parent poster is not supporting anything. He's just pointing out that nobody is innocent, which is fair.
- inconceivable 3y agoso what happens when chinese investors discover patent trolling and start purchasing western IP portfolios to sue american and european companies over in western courts? and what if they start winning? "wait, no, not like that"
- TheLoafOfBread 3y agoWhat happens when western government will demand level playing field regarding IP, either by China upholding the IP protection, or by West dropping all the IP protection of Chinese companies?
- inconceivable 3y ago> West dropping all the IP protection of Chinese companies what IP? don't they just steal everything?
- TheLoafOfBread 3y agoAnd that's going to be exact reasoning to get this level playing field going.
- inconceivable 3y agoso in other words, the state of things being how they are, is the reason they are going to be different? this is amazingly devoid of any meaning, even for the dumb smart people on HN.
- axus 3y agoA way to test the hypotheses are, check if Chinese companies generally respect other Chinese companies IP? Seems like that would be the most convenient to copy, so if they DO respect their peers then it IS targeted at foreign people.
- causality0 3y agoDon't forget Rule of Acquisition #17.
- secondcoming 3y agoI’ve always wondered if the Ferengi were based on the Chinese
- VK538FY 3y agoWell... some have speculated differently. https://gamerant.com/star-trek-ferengi-anti-semitic-stereotype/ https://gamerant.com/star-trek-ferengi-anti-semitic-stereoty...
- surgical_fire 3y agoCan you give an example of powerful country that respects other nations?
- daneel_w 3y agoIs this a stupid trick question where, if I respond with a list of nations not known to engage in industrial espionage and IP theft, you respond by saying "well country X once did something-unrelated-to-this-topic to country Y, so your argument falls flat"? I'll humor you. Germany and France are not known to engage in systematic industrial espionage and IP theft. Not towards China, not towards European peers, not towards the USA. Please don't move the goalpost by talking about France' colonial epoch and stay away from WW2 and Hitler.
- hindsightbias 3y agoEven French media would disagree with that https://www.france24.com/en/20110104-france-industrial-espionage-economy-germany-russia-china-business https://www.france24.com/en/20110104-france-industrial-espio... Austinites have joked about the French Ligation being a spy base for 50 years.
- usefulcat 3y agoThat's weird, I've lived in Austin a long time and never heard that. Not saying you're wrong, though I am curious where you heard that? I'm also generally curious about bits of obscure local history.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- some_random 3y agoYou're not wrong in the general case, but France does/did a lot of industrial espionage in recent history
- profile53 3y ago