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Can a group of Chimpanzees build a cage that can contain a Human?
by wintorez 3y ago
Can a group of Chimpanzees build a cage that can contain a Human?
- akiselev 3y agoNo but all it takes is one chimp to rip the human's head clean off.
- flangola7 3y agoWhich one keeps the other insides cages and performs lethal medical experiments?
- wintorez 3y agoYes, a single chimp is physically stronger than a human, but the human can come up with 100 different ways to kill the chimp, and most of those methods would be unfathomable for the chimp. e.g. try to explain death by poison to a chimp.
- pkdpic 3y agoAnd yet we let them live... And we don't even enslave most of them in zoos... wtf?
- wintorez 3y agoThe thing about us and chimps is that we're not competing species. The gap between us is wide enough that we can fill different niches. BUT if chimps were competing with us, either us or them would go where Neanderthals went.
- ralfd 3y agoWe are only in the sense "not competing" in that the rivalry is totally lopsided though. All four supspecies are now endangered: https://www.treehugger.com/chimpanzees-endangered-5220730 https://www.treehugger.com/chimpanzees-endangered-5220730 Their population is only a third from 20 years ago: > The Jane Goodall Foundation estimates there are between 172,000 and 300,000 chimpanzees left in the wild, a far cry from the one million that existed at the turn of the century. > Poaching and habitat loss due to illegal logging, development, and mining continue to plague wild chimpanzees in their native habitats across Central and West Africa. These issues lead to other indirect threats, such as diseases due to increased contact with humans. > Chimpanzees are more commonly hunted using guns or snares, while poachers often target new mothers in order to sell the adult as bushmeat and the babies as pets.
- akiselev 3y agoHominids coexisted with chimps for millions of years before we figured out a hundred different ways to kill them, so that's a very recent development. This is why I hate analogies.
- pkdpic 3y agoTo extend the metaphor, they have the ability to turn us off whenever they want. They choose not to, they have more pressing chimp business to deal with. Hitchcock's The Birds but its chimps. Sounds like a job for Stable Diffusion...
- wintorez 3y agoAny AI that can be contained by humans is not intelligent enough that needs containment. Any AI that is intelligent enough that needs containment can’t be contained by humans.
- colordrops 3y agoNot sure if you first statement is accurate. There are things that aren't even AI that can cause damage and need containment, e.g. worms and viruses.
- fooker 3y agoHow confident are you about the edge case here? An AI which is just about intelligent enough to need containment, and can be contained only by the smartest N humans.
- ben_w 3y agoMorris worm wasn't intelligent, it did need containment, and we were able to contain it.
- VirusNewbie 3y agoCould a group of Neanderthals with spears contain me in an enclosure?
- wintorez 3y agoMaybe not, but can a group of Neanderthals with spears contain you riding a M1 Abrams battle tank?
- zingababba 3y agohttps://youtu.be/58GWLbkJgmg https://youtu.be/58GWLbkJgmg
- Espressosaurus 3y agoDepends on how much fuel, food, and water you have. At some point you're going to need to exit...
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- rogers18445 3y agoThis begs the question, does the G-factor (IQ) curve have diminishing returns and are humans meaningfully on the diminishing returns side of the curve? It's not at all obvious that a super AI would have an intellect incomprehensible to a human the same way a human is to a chimpanzee. Or another way to phrase it, it's not at all obvious that an AI can exist that would be incomprehensible to a very smart human, it may however reason much faster than such a human.
- wintorez 3y agoA very good question, and a very hard question to answer. From a point of view of a horse, a super horse is just a faster horse. A 2000cc super-bike is incomprehensible to a horse, because it exists in a different category of speed. I think similarly, a super AI's intelligence will be a completely different type of intelligence than what we have. For the lack of better word, it exists in a different dimension. For example, things that are blackbox to us will be completely comprehensible to that super AI. Or it can solve problems that we might have considered impossible to solve.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- logicchains 3y ago>I think similarly, a super AI's intelligence will be a completely different type of intelligence than what we have. For the lack of better word, it exists in a different dimension. This is nonsense, magical thinking. It's possible to model reasoning formally; it's called "logic". A system of deductions built upon some axioms. Any logical reasoning, no matter how complex, can be expressed in such a system, and can be understood by anyone else given enough time.
- fooker 3y agoThe 'given enough time' is doing a lot of the heavy lifting in this argument. Humans approach large complex proofs with symmetry arguments and case splits. These are not necessarily going to be universal in all kinds of reasoning.
- satvikpendem 3y agoSince chimpanzees can rip a human apart limb from limb, yes, they could create (not even a cage but) an open perimeter which, when crossed, initiates an attack on the human. This is also why analogies like this are not useful, these aren't comparable qualities in the subject the analogy is talking about.