5 ms·

Radio on the TV

49 points by ecliptik 3y ago

PopAlongKid 3y ago
> Stingray does seem to still exist on a handful of smaller US cable carriers, It's on AT&T U-verse (although U-verse is considered legacy product by AT&T)
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
My first exposure to Radio on the TV was also my first exposure to cable television. In the early 1970s, a motel in Chincoteague Virginia featured the island's cable TV provider. One station consisted of a b&w camera that swiveled between showing a thermometer, barometer, clock and a written board with the local forecast. It played an audio feed of the island's radio station. Grade school me was so fascinated by all tech in action, it became a permanent memory.
- breput 3y ago
  Hackaday did a story[0] on this type of proto-weather channel. [0] https://hackaday.com/2022/10/20/retrotechtacular-the-original-weather-channel/ https://hackaday.com/2022/10/20/retrotechtacular-the-origina...
  - WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
    Dang. That's really cool. I had always assumed this was the cable operator's homebrewed invention.
Gualdrapo 3y ago
Not sure if this is happening in other countries, but as here in Colombia it seems we won't ever have nice things like DAB radio, they just assigned some frequencies to state-owned radio stations to broadcast to all the territory (plus some additional frequencies on several regions) via DVB-T2. Said TV radio stations are broadcasting with no image whatsoever. https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Televisión_digital_terrestre_en_Colombia https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Televisión_digital_terrestre_e...
- hulitu 3y ago
  The only "nice" thing about DAB is that it allows for a lot of channels in the same frequency band. The quality, however, is absymal.
open-source-ux 3y ago
The BBC also broadcast radio on...the TV. It's a TV app for "connected TVs": https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/help/questions/getting-started-with-bbc-sounds/use-tv https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/help/questions/getting-started-...
- fredoralive 3y ago
  The radio channels are carried as audio only channels on basic digital satellite and terrestrial, you don't need a "smart" TV. They're all at the back end of the EPG. I think Sky Digital had them from the start, but On/ITV Digital DTT might not have, I think they were added when Freeview launched. Sky used to have the Music Choice service this article mentions as well IIRC. I think back in the day various BBC Radio channels were alternate sound channels on UK Gold (which BBC Worldwide had a stake in) on analogue Sky, but I might be wrong about that. Annoyingly, BBC Sounds app isn't available on Apple TV boxes, although I can just use AirPlay I guess...
MrRadar 3y ago
Some broadcast TV stations in my area have audio-only subchannels. Unfortunately they're not worth listening to (they're Christian talk stations) but it's neat to see.
vel0city 3y ago
I wonder why more TVs which support OTA signals don't also include some FM radio (and now, HDRadio) mode. It seems it would be a pretty easy feature to support. Most OTA antennas are decently sensitive near FM radio frequencies, so the signal is probably already there for those who watch OTA. These days though since practically all TVs sold are smart TVs I guess its largely seen as a moot feature as the TVs are probably sold with a Pandora app and maybe even an iHeartRadio internet app. I'd still prefer to just be able to tune to the FM radio stations themselves, and not all of them in my area are available by app (or, easily by app).
Scoundreller 3y ago
Not radio on the TV, but radio through the TV (cable): Rogers Cable in Ontario Canada used to push AM and FM signals through their coaxiale lines and you could run a splitter into your stereo to get clean strong signal. Great for large buildings, fringe areas and basements. That ended ~ 15 years ago: https://www.digitalhome.ca/threads/fm-am-radio-over-rogers-cable.60162/ https://www.digitalhome.ca/threads/fm-am-radio-over-rogers-c...
taldo 3y ago
Cool trip through digital audio broadcast, but I'm left bit puzzled by the last bit about cable vs PON networks. How are coax networks fundamentally better than PON fiber networks? Sure, in a lot of places they have the very tangible benefit of actually existing and covering tons of (potential) customers. But they're often old, require upgrades and retrofits to be DOCSIS 4 compliant. And in places where coax networks don't already exist, I very much suspect that PON fiber is way cheaper to deploy and operate [citation needed].
TheAceOfHearts 3y ago
Just yesterday I learned that the inverse of this also existed: TV Radio [0], where you could listen to TV broadcasts (audio only of course) using your radio. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_radio https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_radio
- flyinghamster 3y ago
  The North American transition to digital TV also had another little oddity. Analog TV channel 6's audio signal was placed in such a way that some FM receivers (with analog tuners) could tune into its audio at the edge of the dial. A station that broadcast an analog TV signal on channel 6 in Chicago (to direct viewers to rescan/get a digital tuner) put music on the audio, and newer tuners have had the FM band extended to cover this signal. It's labeled "87.7" on digital tuners but if you tune it on an SDR it's actually 87.75 MHz.
  - krackers 3y ago
    It's known as Franken FM: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channel_6_radio_stations_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channel_6_radio_stations_in_th...
    - basementcat 3y ago
      Franken FM is preserved in ATSC 3.0! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATSC_3.0 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATSC_3.0
veave 3y ago
No, DOCSIS is not better than PON. PON has been flawlessly delivering 10/10 Gbps for years. What is DOCSIS doing? DOCSIS networks are much more expensive to maintain (in terms of electricity expenditure, copper literally rotting away...) and the technology is lagging and will be lagging behind in speeds and latency forever.

49 points by ecliptik 3y ago

> Stingray does seem to still exist on a handful of smaller US cable carriers, It's on AT&T U-verse (although U-verse is considered legacy product by AT&T)

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

WarOnPrivacy 3y ago

My first exposure to Radio on the TV was also my first exposure to cable television. In the early 1970s, a motel in Chincoteague Virginia featured the island's cable TV provider. One station consisted of a b&w camera that swiveled between showing a thermometer, barometer, clock and a written board with the local forecast. It played an audio feed of the island's radio station. Grade school me was so fascinated by all tech in action, it became a permanent memory.

breput 3y ago
Hackaday did a story[0] on this type of proto-weather channel. [0] https://hackaday.com/2022/10/20/retrotechtacular-the-original-weather-channel/ https://hackaday.com/2022/10/20/retrotechtacular-the-origina...
- WarOnPrivacy 3y ago
  Dang. That's really cool. I had always assumed this was the cable operator's homebrewed invention.

Gualdrapo 3y ago

Not sure if this is happening in other countries, but as here in Colombia it seems we won't ever have nice things like DAB radio, they just assigned some frequencies to state-owned radio stations to broadcast to all the territory (plus some additional frequencies on several regions) via DVB-T2. Said TV radio stations are broadcasting with no image whatsoever. https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Televisión_digital_terrestre_en_Colombia https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Televisión_digital_terrestre_e...

hulitu 3y ago
The only "nice" thing about DAB is that it allows for a lot of channels in the same frequency band. The quality, however, is absymal.

open-source-ux 3y ago

The BBC also broadcast radio on...the TV. It's a TV app for "connected TVs": https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/help/questions/getting-started-with-bbc-sounds/use-tv https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/help/questions/getting-started-...

fredoralive 3y ago
The radio channels are carried as audio only channels on basic digital satellite and terrestrial, you don't need a "smart" TV. They're all at the back end of the EPG. I think Sky Digital had them from the start, but On/ITV Digital DTT might not have, I think they were added when Freeview launched. Sky used to have the Music Choice service this article mentions as well IIRC. I think back in the day various BBC Radio channels were alternate sound channels on UK Gold (which BBC Worldwide had a stake in) on analogue Sky, but I might be wrong about that. Annoyingly, BBC Sounds app isn't available on Apple TV boxes, although I can just use AirPlay I guess...

MrRadar 3y ago

Some broadcast TV stations in my area have audio-only subchannels. Unfortunately they're not worth listening to (they're Christian talk stations) but it's neat to see.

vel0city 3y ago

I wonder why more TVs which support OTA signals don't also include some FM radio (and now, HDRadio) mode. It seems it would be a pretty easy feature to support. Most OTA antennas are decently sensitive near FM radio frequencies, so the signal is probably already there for those who watch OTA. These days though since practically all TVs sold are smart TVs I guess its largely seen as a moot feature as the TVs are probably sold with a Pandora app and maybe even an iHeartRadio internet app. I'd still prefer to just be able to tune to the FM radio stations themselves, and not all of them in my area are available by app (or, easily by app).

Scoundreller 3y ago

Not radio on the TV, but radio through the TV (cable): Rogers Cable in Ontario Canada used to push AM and FM signals through their coaxiale lines and you could run a splitter into your stereo to get clean strong signal. Great for large buildings, fringe areas and basements. That ended ~ 15 years ago: https://www.digitalhome.ca/threads/fm-am-radio-over-rogers-cable.60162/ https://www.digitalhome.ca/threads/fm-am-radio-over-rogers-c...

taldo 3y ago

Cool trip through digital audio broadcast, but I'm left bit puzzled by the last bit about cable vs PON networks. How are coax networks fundamentally better than PON fiber networks? Sure, in a lot of places they have the very tangible benefit of actually existing and covering tons of (potential) customers. But they're often old, require upgrades and retrofits to be DOCSIS 4 compliant. And in places where coax networks don't already exist, I very much suspect that PON fiber is way cheaper to deploy and operate [citation needed].

TheAceOfHearts 3y ago

Just yesterday I learned that the inverse of this also existed: TV Radio [0], where you could listen to TV broadcasts (audio only of course) using your radio. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_radio https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_radio

flyinghamster 3y ago
The North American transition to digital TV also had another little oddity. Analog TV channel 6's audio signal was placed in such a way that some FM receivers (with analog tuners) could tune into its audio at the edge of the dial. A station that broadcast an analog TV signal on channel 6 in Chicago (to direct viewers to rescan/get a digital tuner) put music on the audio, and newer tuners have had the FM band extended to cover this signal. It's labeled "87.7" on digital tuners but if you tune it on an SDR it's actually 87.75 MHz.
- krackers 3y ago
  It's known as Franken FM: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channel_6_radio_stations_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channel_6_radio_stations_in_th...
  - basementcat 3y ago
    Franken FM is preserved in ATSC 3.0! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATSC_3.0 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATSC_3.0

veave 3y ago

No, DOCSIS is not better than PON. PON has been flawlessly delivering 10/10 Gbps for years. What is DOCSIS doing? DOCSIS networks are much more expensive to maintain (in terms of electricity expenditure, copper literally rotting away...) and the technology is lagging and will be lagging behind in speeds and latency forever.