4 ms·

Can someone explain why Airline pilots are allowed to go on strike, pretty much at will, without government intervention, but railroad workers, who are paid a t

by jmpman 3y ago

Can someone explain why Airline pilots are allowed to go on strike, pretty much at will, without government intervention, but railroad workers, who are paid a tiny fraction of pilots, are forced back to work? I expect the UPS drivers will be forced back to work just like the railroad workers.

addisonl 3y ago
You want the government to force private employees to work? UPS is not USPS.
- AnimalMuppet 3y ago
  Neither are railroads. Freight railroads, not just Amtrak.
- orwin 3y ago
  US have four railway companies from what i understood a few month ago. Is one of them state-operated?
ecopoesis 3y ago
Because we outlawed railroad strikes but didn't outlaw airline strikes. Doesn't really prevent a strike though: it just makes it cost more. Here in Massachusetts it's illegal for public school teachers to strike, yet it has happened a couple times in the last year. In one case the teacher's union was fined: https://www.bostonherald.com/2023/02/08/woburn-teachers-turn-to-community-support-for-hefty-strike-fines/ https://www.bostonherald.com/2023/02/08/woburn-teachers-turn...
- cool_dude85 3y ago
  Railroad strikes are not outlawed. They are probably more regulated than other strikes in some ways, as there are certain things they can't strike for, and certain times they can't strike. But when they do strike, they have more leeway too, like they can solidarity strike which is illegal under NLRA. The most recent attempt at a railroad strike was stopped by Congress imposing management's contract. But that's not a general prohibition against striking.
  - phone8675309 3y ago
    It's not a general prohibition but what message does it send? "You can't strike because we'll just force you back because we care more about your bosses and Americans getting their cheap shit from China for Christmas presents than we do about you" seems to be the message.
cool_dude85 3y ago
I think a reason Congress is willing to impose a contract on railroad workers is that they genuinely can make a credible threat against the broader economy in a way that airline pilots can't. Just to name a single sector, a railroad strike could jeopardize around 70% of coal electrical production, which makes up 20% of electrical generation in the country. While industrial action by pilots would be devastating for a few industries, the railroads really could hurt large portions of the entire economy. I tend to think UPS is a lot more like pilots than railroad workers, especially since there are alternatives if you really do need to ship something right away.
Ekaros 3y ago
Why do the government target the workers? And not the owners of these companies? Why can't they just tell that they will nationalize them if they don't agree to demands. If they don't and allow strike to happen. Just take over the private ownership resetting both equity and bond holders and give the gains to workers...
- phone8675309 3y ago
  The owners of these companies are also the owners of this country. Do you think the Democratic or Republican candidate gets the nomination and wins the presidency because they do what the people want? They get that nomination and win the presidency because they convince a small constellation of large companies to buy election advertising on their behalf in order to influence the outcome of the election for the candidate that each company in that constellation feels would serve their interests best. So of course the House of Reps, Senate, and President are all going to support the biggest corporations - they don't want to spend their own money campaigning and they don't want to go back to a life where they don't have influence and aren't wined and dined for things.
turrican 3y ago
This is incorrect. Airline pilots also fall under the Railway Labor Act and require federal mediation before authorizing a strike vote. In the past the Feds have usually allowed strikes, but not always. https://simpleflying.com/airline-labor-negotiations-guide/ https://simpleflying.com/airline-labor-negotiations-guide/

by jmpman 3y ago

addisonl 3y ago

You want the government to force private employees to work? UPS is not USPS.

AnimalMuppet 3y ago
Neither are railroads. Freight railroads, not just Amtrak.
orwin 3y ago
US have four railway companies from what i understood a few month ago. Is one of them state-operated?

ecopoesis 3y ago

Because we outlawed railroad strikes but didn't outlaw airline strikes. Doesn't really prevent a strike though: it just makes it cost more. Here in Massachusetts it's illegal for public school teachers to strike, yet it has happened a couple times in the last year. In one case the teacher's union was fined: https://www.bostonherald.com/2023/02/08/woburn-teachers-turn-to-community-support-for-hefty-strike-fines/ https://www.bostonherald.com/2023/02/08/woburn-teachers-turn...

cool_dude85 3y ago
Railroad strikes are not outlawed. They are probably more regulated than other strikes in some ways, as there are certain things they can't strike for, and certain times they can't strike. But when they do strike, they have more leeway too, like they can solidarity strike which is illegal under NLRA. The most recent attempt at a railroad strike was stopped by Congress imposing management's contract. But that's not a general prohibition against striking.
- phone8675309 3y ago
  It's not a general prohibition but what message does it send? "You can't strike because we'll just force you back because we care more about your bosses and Americans getting their cheap shit from China for Christmas presents than we do about you" seems to be the message.

cool_dude85 3y ago

I think a reason Congress is willing to impose a contract on railroad workers is that they genuinely can make a credible threat against the broader economy in a way that airline pilots can't. Just to name a single sector, a railroad strike could jeopardize around 70% of coal electrical production, which makes up 20% of electrical generation in the country. While industrial action by pilots would be devastating for a few industries, the railroads really could hurt large portions of the entire economy. I tend to think UPS is a lot more like pilots than railroad workers, especially since there are alternatives if you really do need to ship something right away.

Ekaros 3y ago

Why do the government target the workers? And not the owners of these companies? Why can't they just tell that they will nationalize them if they don't agree to demands. If they don't and allow strike to happen. Just take over the private ownership resetting both equity and bond holders and give the gains to workers...

phone8675309 3y ago
The owners of these companies are also the owners of this country. Do you think the Democratic or Republican candidate gets the nomination and wins the presidency because they do what the people want? They get that nomination and win the presidency because they convince a small constellation of large companies to buy election advertising on their behalf in order to influence the outcome of the election for the candidate that each company in that constellation feels would serve their interests best. So of course the House of Reps, Senate, and President are all going to support the biggest corporations - they don't want to spend their own money campaigning and they don't want to go back to a life where they don't have influence and aren't wined and dined for things.

turrican 3y ago

This is incorrect. Airline pilots also fall under the Railway Labor Act and require federal mediation before authorizing a strike vote. In the past the Feds have usually allowed strikes, but not always. https://simpleflying.com/airline-labor-negotiations-guide/ https://simpleflying.com/airline-labor-negotiations-guide/