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This was posted when it was published in May. To use an analogy their argument is: Vaping is bad for you, don't do it. While ignoring that a ton of people quit

This was posted when it was published in May. To use an analogy their argument is: Vaping is bad for you, don't do it. While ignoring that a ton of people quit smoking using vapes and that they're letting the perfect be the enemy of good. Same thing with NSS. While NSS are a useful tool for sugar reduction, studies have shown that over the medium-long term, you'll want to reduce artificially sweat foods and even sweat food substitutes, to create a "new normal" or new baseline where an e.g. strawberry is sweat again. Which has been shown to be more sustainable. The WHO aren't wrong, but everyone jumps on this with their own agenda. They are claiming that switching to NSS isn't a sustainable way to reduce BMI (and associated negative health outcomes) over the long term, hard to find data that disagrees with that. That's all they're claiming.

carabiner 3y ago
Well, if you eat an actual ripe strawberry they're incredibly sweet. The ones at the grocery store with the bitter white center are not ripe. But I get your point.
meindnoch 3y ago
Sweat food? Yuck!
- gattilorenz 3y ago
  Honeydew! Well, that’s actually worse than sweat…
  - nashashmi 3y ago
    Sweaty strawberries are amazing.
    - LeifCarrotson 3y ago
      I have a few memories of picking blueberries with my mom as a kid - sweat dripped off my eyebrows, down the back of my neck and onto the strap that held the tray. She tried to get us out early, but there was a period around 10:00 just after the dew burned off when the humidity was still 100% and the sun was high enough to bake you. As a 7yo wishing I could stay home on my "hard-earned" summer vacation, most of the hardship was purely imagined. And maybe the flavor of those sweaty blueberries was imagined: I've not been able to replicate the taste for some time, even if I drag dragging my own boy to the U-Pick field. I wonder what they taste like to him.
zouhair 3y ago
If you read the guideline[0] it is way more circumspect. There are a lot of "probably" all over it. There is a need for way more research for a definitive guideline as it is stated in this guideline. [0]: https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/9789240073616 https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/9789240073616
- user_7832 3y ago
  Thanks for your comment. Having read the conclusion, it is more of the authors saying "NSS could be responsible for hypertension/T2 Diabetes etc but it's not really conclusive". I'll likely still consume some NSS'es though that is more due to my preexisting condition.
  - zouhair 3y ago
    They are following the science where it's going. The guideline will change when new science arise. But still we have ways to go in popularization of science.
DrThunder 3y ago
Eh I get what you're saying but I don't think most people who switch to vaping actually stop quit nicotine all together, they just continue vaping with often higher levels of nicotine. I guess they have the advantage of getting rid of second-hand smoke and the permeating smell of cigarettes. I think a similar thing happens with "diet" "sugar-free" products. Almost all of the people who use these products neglect every other aspect of their health thinking they're really going to tackle obesity by swapping out processed sugar for sweeteners. Anecdotally, I've never seen someone using copious amounts of these sweeteners look healthy. They continue on being obese and out of shape. I think if your goal is to be healthy then your mind set has got to change and using an option like artificial sweeteners is just a "have your cake and eat it too" position that won't result in making you healthier.
- dmix 3y ago
  > they just continue vaping with often higher levels of nicotine Source?
  - DrThunder 3y ago
    Here's a start - feel free to go off on your own and learn. https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-prevention/5-truths-you-need-to-know-about-vaping https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-preventi... "What’s worse, says Blaha, many e-cigarette users get even more nicotine than they would from a combustible tobacco product: Users can buy extra-strength cartridges, which have a higher concentration of nicotine, or increase the e-cigarette’s voltage to get a greater hit of the substance."
  - ryeights 3y ago
    I can’t speak to OP’s claim about former smokers. However as a younger person who knows many younger never-smoker vape users, I can attest that they all consume vastly more nicotine than would ever be practical with cigarettes. Vape pods are highly concentrated and you can use them anywhere, any time. No more need to bother with sneaking out of the house or taking smoke breaks.
- mike10921 3y ago
mike10921 3y ago
I fully agree. The main argument is that if you use sweeteners you will eat more sugar, so it is worse than sugar. So basically don't eat the non-poison because it will cause you to eat poison, so instead eat the poison itself. Also, there is no concrete evidence that sweeteners are bad for one's health, it's more the feeling of 'chemicals' are always bad. Sugar is clearly bad and causes obesity and diabetes. The choice seems pretty clear between the two.
- anonymouskimmer 3y ago
  This depends on the sweetener. There have been recent articles linking bad health effects to erythritol and sucralose that I am aware of.
  - unethical_ban 3y ago
    Damn, I thought erythritol was downside-free. Looks like it is associated with a nontrivial risk of heart attack and stroke https://www.realsimple.com/study-links-stevia-and-monk-fruit-sweeteners-with-heart-disease-7152629 https://www.realsimple.com/study-links-stevia-and-monk-fruit...
    - anonymouskimmer 3y ago
      On the positive side, while researching my comment, apparently that old boogieman of artificial sweeteners, saccharine, may be fine for humans (as the cancer-causing in rats is because of a unique rat feature that humans don't share).
      - orwin 3y ago
        I heard it was because the species of rat they used tend to get cancers anyway when they got older, and shouldn't be used in any long-term study. I love scientists, loved working with them, best clients i ever had (if you're a devops or automate dev/scientists tools, and have to regularly explain stuff to scientists and to other devs, we don't compare advantageously at all), but sometimes there is too much noise.
fredgrott 3y ago
Vaping is wrong for a very different reason, i.e. because the amount and quality of nicotine is unregulated which means the standard vape has an overdose of nicotine which can result in death in a single vape. 6 deaths by vaping in my state of Indiana alone last year, and all of them teenagers.
- Semaphor 3y ago
  That’s not a general vaping thing, that’s about certain nicotine containing liquids or pods or whatever kids use these days. There are people like me who have zero nicotine in their vapes.
- Veen 3y ago
  I find that very hard to believe unless these people are making their own vape juice with hundreds of times the recommended amount of pure nicotine. For example, a standard Juul pod contains about 40 mg of nicotine, each puff gives you a max of 160 µg, which is significantly less than a 2000th of the commonly believed lethal dose (500 mg orally for a 80KG person). https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33762429/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33762429/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotine_poisoning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotine_poisoning Btw, there's in interesting story attached to mistaken view about what constitutes a lethal dose of nicotine. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3880486/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3880486/
- flaviut 3y ago
  That's not vaping nicotine. These kids are vaping THC adulterated with vitamin E[1]. Vitamin E is added because it makes a cut product thicker, and thickness is thought of as an indicator of quality. My guess here is that marijuana still has a stigma/is illegal, so these kids are finding it easier to just blame nicotine vapes to try and get themselves out of trouble. There's no reason to cut nicotine vape liquid since the base ingredients (vegetable glycerin + propylene glycol) are absurdly cheap. [1]: https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/basic_information/e-cigarettes/severe-lung-disease.html https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/basic_information/e-cigarettes/s...
doxeddaily 3y ago
I'm super dubious about their conclusions here. Fat people drink diet soda because they are trying to avoid sugar. Diet soda actually tastes damn good these days, there isn't really a reason to drink regular soda.
- hangonhn 3y ago
  > Diet soda actually tastes damn good these days, there isn't really a reason to drink regular soda. I've been wondering about that. I wasn't sure if my memory has faded or maybe drinking it often made me like the taste but these days I find Diet Coke/Coke Zero to be equally enjoyable as Coke. Have the taste of the non-sugar Coke been steadily modified?
  - taeric 3y ago
    You also will change your tastes as you get older. So, could be a change in the sodas, could be a change in you.
  - doxeddaily 3y ago
    Coke Zero has been reformulated multiple times. I think "diet coke" is still the same crap and still tastes bad.
    - aezart 3y ago
      The last time I tried Coke Zero, it tasted like Diet RC. I didn't like it at all. Diet Coke has huge differences in flavor between sources and packaging options. It's universally bad out of a can or bottle, and the stuff from soda fountains varies by restaurant.
- gambiting 3y ago
  >>Diet soda actually tastes damn good these days, there isn't really a reason to drink regular soda. Oh god I couldn't disagree more. I literally can't stand the taste of diet pepsi/coke, the sweeteners leave such an awful aftertaste on my tongue.
busyant 3y ago
> to create a "new normal" or new baseline where an e.g. strawberry is sweat again. Just an interesting story. About 5 years ago, I tried to cut out all processed carbs from my diet. After several months, I was away from home and I had to eat something---the only thing open was a Dunkin Donuts. I ordered an egg-white sandwich on a plain English muffin, and for kicks I took a bite out of the English muffin. Holy shit. It tasted super sweet!! I can't be sure, but I assume it had refined sugar added to it to improve its palatability. Made me think about everything that goes into fast foods...
- beezlebroxxxxxx 3y ago
  I had the same experience when I went from peanut butter that is just ground peanuts to some peanut butter from some of the big brands. The big brand PB tastes like cake icing.
- jrmg 3y ago
  I’m sure it did have added sugar. Basically all American supermarket bread products (including most bread!) do, and are are super sweet to Europeans. It extends shelf life though. European supermarket bread will mould in usually less than a week, but it’s really unusual for an American bread to go mouldy.
  - Truupe 3y ago
    I think Twinkies last forever and they have tons of sugar.
  - uranium 3y ago
    American bread certainly does go moldy, but the sugar absorbs moisture and keeps the bread softer longer. That being said, I'd much rather they used less. At this point it's pretty hard to buy a hamburger bun around here [SF] that doesn't taste like a brioche to me.
    - stevenwoo 3y ago
      I started making baking at home when pandemic lockdowns started and with only flour, yeast, salt, oil and sugar my bread grows mold within one to two days (2 cups of flour with 1 teaspoon of sugar) I speculate my home humidity might be high without air conditioning or heat but it seems a lot of something is necessary to prevent commercial bread products from molding for a long time.
hendersoon 3y ago
Well, exactly right. I'm not choosing between putting a packet of splenda in my coffee or drinking it black. I'm choosing between a packet of splenda or two packets of sucrose. I'd find a study telling me which one of those is the better choice to be very helpful.
- redundantly 3y ago
  Try cold brew coffee. I've found I can drink cold brew black and it's perfectly palatable, whereas that's never been the case with hot brewed coffee. If you'd like an easy way to try check out SToK. Fairly inexpensive, can be found at large store chains like Walmart.
- hackerlight 3y ago
  > I'm choosing between a packet of splenda or two packets of sucrose. The claim is that that's not what you're choosing between, because if that were the real choice, then the people who chose splenda would lose more weight than the people who chose sucrose, but that's apparently not the finding. So maybe the real choice is between two packets of sucrose, or splenda+two packets of sucrose, because the splenda causes you to eat more sucrose (or other trash) without your conscious realization.
  - hendersoon 3y ago
    I'm pretty sure I remember how I take my coffee! I've never done that. Now you could argue that maybe I'm more likely to order a muffin alongside my coffee when I take splenda? Could be. I don't think so, but maybe.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
YeGoblynQueenne 3y ago
From the article: "Replacing free sugars with NSS does not help with weight control in the long term. People need to consider other ways to reduce free sugars intake, such as consuming food with naturally occurring sugars, like fruit, or unsweetened food and beverages,” says Francesco Branca, WHO Director for Nutrition and Food Safety. "NSS are not essential dietary factors and have no nutritional value. People should reduce the sweetness of the diet altogether, starting early in life, to improve their health." If I read that correctly, the WHO is recommending that the overall amount of sweet foods consumed should be reduced and that replacing sugar with other sweeteners will not cut it.
irthomasthomas 3y ago
I'm afraid you might be wrong about that. Why do they keep inventing new sweeteners, now, every few years? After all, they're all sweet, and zero calories. But they keep investing money inventing new ones, when the customers are happy with the old ones. Perhaps because the public research eventually catches up to them. E.g. "sucralose ingestion caused 1) a greater incremental increase in peak plasma glucose concentrations (4.2 ± 0.2 vs. 4.8 ± 0.3 mmol/L; P = 0.03), 2) a 20 ± 8% greater incremental increase in insulin area under the curve (AUC) (P < 0.03), 3) a 22 ± 7% greater peak insulin secretion rate (P < 0.02), 4) a 7 ± 4% decrease in insulin clearance (P = 0.04), and 5) a 23 ± 20% decrease in SI (P = 0.01)." https://diabetesjournals.org/care/article/36/9/2530/37872/Sucralose-Affects-Glycemic-and-Hormonal-Responses https://diabetesjournals.org/care/article/36/9/2530/37872/Su... NNTs, sweet on the tongue, sweet on the liver! Yep, they trigger the same deleterious hormonal response that sugar does. They produce a cascading chemical chain reaction in the body leading to the over-production of insulin, the hunger-hormone, which signals your fat cells to begin absorbing glucose (triglycerides) from the blood stream. Removing the sugar from the bloodstream would normally cause insulin production to drop, but in this case, it's not the sugar triggering the productions, it's the NNT chemicals that are still circulating in your body..
- wrp 3y ago
  > Why do they keep inventing new sweeteners... Because nothing so far tastes as good as real sugar. The common practice in employing artificial sweeteners is to combine two or more in an effort to avoid the bitter aftertaste that you get from relying on just one.
  - irthomasthomas 3y ago
    More likely it's because they cannot claim their product is helpful to dieters, after there is mounting evidence that it may actually be worse for them.

carabiner 3y ago

Well, if you eat an actual ripe strawberry they're incredibly sweet. The ones at the grocery store with the bitter white center are not ripe. But I get your point.

meindnoch 3y ago

Sweat food? Yuck!

gattilorenz 3y ago
Honeydew! Well, that’s actually worse than sweat…
- nashashmi 3y ago
  Sweaty strawberries are amazing.
  - LeifCarrotson 3y ago
    I have a few memories of picking blueberries with my mom as a kid - sweat dripped off my eyebrows, down the back of my neck and onto the strap that held the tray. She tried to get us out early, but there was a period around 10:00 just after the dew burned off when the humidity was still 100% and the sun was high enough to bake you. As a 7yo wishing I could stay home on my "hard-earned" summer vacation, most of the hardship was purely imagined. And maybe the flavor of those sweaty blueberries was imagined: I've not been able to replicate the taste for some time, even if I drag dragging my own boy to the U-Pick field. I wonder what they taste like to him.

zouhair 3y ago

If you read the guideline[0] it is way more circumspect. There are a lot of "probably" all over it. There is a need for way more research for a definitive guideline as it is stated in this guideline. [0]: https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/9789240073616 https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/9789240073616

user_7832 3y ago
Thanks for your comment. Having read the conclusion, it is more of the authors saying "NSS could be responsible for hypertension/T2 Diabetes etc but it's not really conclusive". I'll likely still consume some NSS'es though that is more due to my preexisting condition.
- zouhair 3y ago
  They are following the science where it's going. The guideline will change when new science arise. But still we have ways to go in popularization of science.

DrThunder 3y ago

Eh I get what you're saying but I don't think most people who switch to vaping actually stop quit nicotine all together, they just continue vaping with often higher levels of nicotine. I guess they have the advantage of getting rid of second-hand smoke and the permeating smell of cigarettes. I think a similar thing happens with "diet" "sugar-free" products. Almost all of the people who use these products neglect every other aspect of their health thinking they're really going to tackle obesity by swapping out processed sugar for sweeteners. Anecdotally, I've never seen someone using copious amounts of these sweeteners look healthy. They continue on being obese and out of shape. I think if your goal is to be healthy then your mind set has got to change and using an option like artificial sweeteners is just a "have your cake and eat it too" position that won't result in making you healthier.

dmix 3y ago
> they just continue vaping with often higher levels of nicotine Source?
- DrThunder 3y ago
  Here's a start - feel free to go off on your own and learn. https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-prevention/5-truths-you-need-to-know-about-vaping https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-preventi... "What’s worse, says Blaha, many e-cigarette users get even more nicotine than they would from a combustible tobacco product: Users can buy extra-strength cartridges, which have a higher concentration of nicotine, or increase the e-cigarette’s voltage to get a greater hit of the substance."
- ryeights 3y ago
  I can’t speak to OP’s claim about former smokers. However as a younger person who knows many younger never-smoker vape users, I can attest that they all consume vastly more nicotine than would ever be practical with cigarettes. Vape pods are highly concentrated and you can use them anywhere, any time. No more need to bother with sneaking out of the house or taking smoke breaks.
mike10921 3y ago

mike10921 3y ago

I fully agree. The main argument is that if you use sweeteners you will eat more sugar, so it is worse than sugar. So basically don't eat the non-poison because it will cause you to eat poison, so instead eat the poison itself. Also, there is no concrete evidence that sweeteners are bad for one's health, it's more the feeling of 'chemicals' are always bad. Sugar is clearly bad and causes obesity and diabetes. The choice seems pretty clear between the two.

anonymouskimmer 3y ago
This depends on the sweetener. There have been recent articles linking bad health effects to erythritol and sucralose that I am aware of.
- unethical_ban 3y ago
  Damn, I thought erythritol was downside-free. Looks like it is associated with a nontrivial risk of heart attack and stroke https://www.realsimple.com/study-links-stevia-and-monk-fruit-sweeteners-with-heart-disease-7152629 https://www.realsimple.com/study-links-stevia-and-monk-fruit...
  - anonymouskimmer 3y ago
    On the positive side, while researching my comment, apparently that old boogieman of artificial sweeteners, saccharine, may be fine for humans (as the cancer-causing in rats is because of a unique rat feature that humans don't share).
    - orwin 3y ago
      I heard it was because the species of rat they used tend to get cancers anyway when they got older, and shouldn't be used in any long-term study. I love scientists, loved working with them, best clients i ever had (if you're a devops or automate dev/scientists tools, and have to regularly explain stuff to scientists and to other devs, we don't compare advantageously at all), but sometimes there is too much noise.

fredgrott 3y ago

Vaping is wrong for a very different reason, i.e. because the amount and quality of nicotine is unregulated which means the standard vape has an overdose of nicotine which can result in death in a single vape. 6 deaths by vaping in my state of Indiana alone last year, and all of them teenagers.

Semaphor 3y ago
That’s not a general vaping thing, that’s about certain nicotine containing liquids or pods or whatever kids use these days. There are people like me who have zero nicotine in their vapes.
Veen 3y ago
I find that very hard to believe unless these people are making their own vape juice with hundreds of times the recommended amount of pure nicotine. For example, a standard Juul pod contains about 40 mg of nicotine, each puff gives you a max of 160 µg, which is significantly less than a 2000th of the commonly believed lethal dose (500 mg orally for a 80KG person). https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33762429/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33762429/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotine_poisoning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotine_poisoning Btw, there's in interesting story attached to mistaken view about what constitutes a lethal dose of nicotine. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3880486/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3880486/
flaviut 3y ago
That's not vaping nicotine. These kids are vaping THC adulterated with vitamin E[1]. Vitamin E is added because it makes a cut product thicker, and thickness is thought of as an indicator of quality. My guess here is that marijuana still has a stigma/is illegal, so these kids are finding it easier to just blame nicotine vapes to try and get themselves out of trouble. There's no reason to cut nicotine vape liquid since the base ingredients (vegetable glycerin + propylene glycol) are absurdly cheap. [1]: https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/basic_information/e-cigarettes/severe-lung-disease.html https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/basic_information/e-cigarettes/s...

doxeddaily 3y ago

I'm super dubious about their conclusions here. Fat people drink diet soda because they are trying to avoid sugar. Diet soda actually tastes damn good these days, there isn't really a reason to drink regular soda.

hangonhn 3y ago
> Diet soda actually tastes damn good these days, there isn't really a reason to drink regular soda. I've been wondering about that. I wasn't sure if my memory has faded or maybe drinking it often made me like the taste but these days I find Diet Coke/Coke Zero to be equally enjoyable as Coke. Have the taste of the non-sugar Coke been steadily modified?
- taeric 3y ago
  You also will change your tastes as you get older. So, could be a change in the sodas, could be a change in you.
- doxeddaily 3y ago
  Coke Zero has been reformulated multiple times. I think "diet coke" is still the same crap and still tastes bad.
  - aezart 3y ago
    The last time I tried Coke Zero, it tasted like Diet RC. I didn't like it at all. Diet Coke has huge differences in flavor between sources and packaging options. It's universally bad out of a can or bottle, and the stuff from soda fountains varies by restaurant.
gambiting 3y ago
>>Diet soda actually tastes damn good these days, there isn't really a reason to drink regular soda. Oh god I couldn't disagree more. I literally can't stand the taste of diet pepsi/coke, the sweeteners leave such an awful aftertaste on my tongue.

busyant 3y ago

> to create a "new normal" or new baseline where an e.g. strawberry is sweat again. Just an interesting story. About 5 years ago, I tried to cut out all processed carbs from my diet. After several months, I was away from home and I had to eat something---the only thing open was a Dunkin Donuts. I ordered an egg-white sandwich on a plain English muffin, and for kicks I took a bite out of the English muffin. Holy shit. It tasted super sweet!! I can't be sure, but I assume it had refined sugar added to it to improve its palatability. Made me think about everything that goes into fast foods...

beezlebroxxxxxx 3y ago
I had the same experience when I went from peanut butter that is just ground peanuts to some peanut butter from some of the big brands. The big brand PB tastes like cake icing.
jrmg 3y ago
I’m sure it did have added sugar. Basically all American supermarket bread products (including most bread!) do, and are are super sweet to Europeans. It extends shelf life though. European supermarket bread will mould in usually less than a week, but it’s really unusual for an American bread to go mouldy.
- Truupe 3y ago
  I think Twinkies last forever and they have tons of sugar.
- uranium 3y ago
  American bread certainly does go moldy, but the sugar absorbs moisture and keeps the bread softer longer. That being said, I'd much rather they used less. At this point it's pretty hard to buy a hamburger bun around here [SF] that doesn't taste like a brioche to me.
  - stevenwoo 3y ago
    I started making baking at home when pandemic lockdowns started and with only flour, yeast, salt, oil and sugar my bread grows mold within one to two days (2 cups of flour with 1 teaspoon of sugar) I speculate my home humidity might be high without air conditioning or heat but it seems a lot of something is necessary to prevent commercial bread products from molding for a long time.

hendersoon 3y ago

Well, exactly right. I'm not choosing between putting a packet of splenda in my coffee or drinking it black. I'm choosing between a packet of splenda or two packets of sucrose. I'd find a study telling me which one of those is the better choice to be very helpful.

redundantly 3y ago
Try cold brew coffee. I've found I can drink cold brew black and it's perfectly palatable, whereas that's never been the case with hot brewed coffee. If you'd like an easy way to try check out SToK. Fairly inexpensive, can be found at large store chains like Walmart.
hackerlight 3y ago
> I'm choosing between a packet of splenda or two packets of sucrose. The claim is that that's not what you're choosing between, because if that were the real choice, then the people who chose splenda would lose more weight than the people who chose sucrose, but that's apparently not the finding. So maybe the real choice is between two packets of sucrose, or splenda+two packets of sucrose, because the splenda causes you to eat more sucrose (or other trash) without your conscious realization.
- hendersoon 3y ago
  I'm pretty sure I remember how I take my coffee! I've never done that. Now you could argue that maybe I'm more likely to order a muffin alongside my coffee when I take splenda? Could be. I don't think so, but maybe.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

YeGoblynQueenne 3y ago

From the article: "Replacing free sugars with NSS does not help with weight control in the long term. People need to consider other ways to reduce free sugars intake, such as consuming food with naturally occurring sugars, like fruit, or unsweetened food and beverages,” says Francesco Branca, WHO Director for Nutrition and Food Safety. "NSS are not essential dietary factors and have no nutritional value. People should reduce the sweetness of the diet altogether, starting early in life, to improve their health." If I read that correctly, the WHO is recommending that the overall amount of sweet foods consumed should be reduced and that replacing sugar with other sweeteners will not cut it.

irthomasthomas 3y ago

I'm afraid you might be wrong about that. Why do they keep inventing new sweeteners, now, every few years? After all, they're all sweet, and zero calories. But they keep investing money inventing new ones, when the customers are happy with the old ones. Perhaps because the public research eventually catches up to them. E.g. "sucralose ingestion caused 1) a greater incremental increase in peak plasma glucose concentrations (4.2 ± 0.2 vs. 4.8 ± 0.3 mmol/L; P = 0.03), 2) a 20 ± 8% greater incremental increase in insulin area under the curve (AUC) (P < 0.03), 3) a 22 ± 7% greater peak insulin secretion rate (P < 0.02), 4) a 7 ± 4% decrease in insulin clearance (P = 0.04), and 5) a 23 ± 20% decrease in SI (P = 0.01)." https://diabetesjournals.org/care/article/36/9/2530/37872/Sucralose-Affects-Glycemic-and-Hormonal-Responses https://diabetesjournals.org/care/article/36/9/2530/37872/Su... NNTs, sweet on the tongue, sweet on the liver! Yep, they trigger the same deleterious hormonal response that sugar does. They produce a cascading chemical chain reaction in the body leading to the over-production of insulin, the hunger-hormone, which signals your fat cells to begin absorbing glucose (triglycerides) from the blood stream. Removing the sugar from the bloodstream would normally cause insulin production to drop, but in this case, it's not the sugar triggering the productions, it's the NNT chemicals that are still circulating in your body..

wrp 3y ago
> Why do they keep inventing new sweeteners... Because nothing so far tastes as good as real sugar. The common practice in employing artificial sweeteners is to combine two or more in an effort to avoid the bitter aftertaste that you get from relying on just one.
- irthomasthomas 3y ago
  More likely it's because they cannot claim their product is helpful to dieters, after there is mounting evidence that it may actually be worse for them.