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This is WILD! The sentence before the one you quote is > Sometimes versions of the game are also intentionally shipped with debug symbols to generate better e

This is WILD! The sentence before the one you quote is > Sometimes versions of the game are also intentionally shipped with debug symbols to generate better error reports. You remove that context, quote him saying sometimes it's a mistake and criticise him with the preface he already provided!?

jpmoral 3y ago
With context then the quote is > Sometimes versions of the game are also intentionally shipped with debug symbols to generate better error reports. However, sometimes programmers forget to remove the debug symbols from the final binaries of the game. Programmers are humans, and humans make mistakes. It looks like the author is saying shipping final binaries with debug symbols is a mistake, and that's what @ho_schi is criticising.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- karpierz 3y ago
  The author is noting that in this particular case, Valve made a mistake in releasing the debug symbols for a particular build, as noted by them releasing them in a 2017 build, and then removing them in a subsequent build. The author did not say that "shipping with debug symbols is always a mistake", they noted that it can happen unintentionally and provided evidence of that in this case.
nmilo 3y ago
I'm sick of this weird HN trend where readers pick out a single sentence only tangentially related to the rest of the article and then try to prove how smart they are by rebutting it.
- gaucheries 3y ago
  you mean that's not the whole point of posting here?
- bogwog 3y ago
  These Reddit-like comment sections with public vote counters highly incentivize this type of thing. I don't even know why HN has a voting system? I think sorting comment threads by number of replies would be more useful. Vote counters only make sense when you have a massive amount of comments to sort through, which really only happens on posts about Apple afaik. However, those comment threads tend to be filled with useless arguing anyways. Would people stop using this site if it stopped offering dopamine hits in the form of a number next to your name?
  - ajmurmann 3y ago
    Reply count can be more of an indicator of controversy, rather than value. The best comment might provide me deep me deep new insight, but all I have to say is "that's great!". Saying something inflammatory results in lots of replies.
    - Sebb767 3y ago
      In fact, the HN algorithm downranks threads with a high comment-to-point ratio.
  - DANmode 3y ago
    I choose to believe there exists an old guard that use the site without points visible, either through frontend modification or mobile apps.
- Supermancho 3y ago
  This is a good form habit. Discussion is largely about creating narratives and arguments to try to come to a consensus on reality. This is ostensibly useful. When someone makes a statement and that statement is innaccurate or untrue, it is helpful to correct it so that they can change their post/future-posts to ensure they are making the strongest argument/most compelling narrative possible. Sometimes this is misused or misunderstood to be combative, but it is not constructive to approach conversation this way.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
ho_schi 3y ago
I’m sorry. You are right! I missed to quote the sentence before :( As pointed out by jpmoral, I consider debug symbols generally a good thing. Exceptions apply as usual e.g. embedded computing. Another approach is using stuff like debuginfod to ship debug symbols automatically when needed. Archlinux and Fedora do that and it improved debugging and reporting - especially regarding dependencies.

jpmoral 3y ago

With context then the quote is > Sometimes versions of the game are also intentionally shipped with debug symbols to generate better error reports. However, sometimes programmers forget to remove the debug symbols from the final binaries of the game. Programmers are humans, and humans make mistakes. It looks like the author is saying shipping final binaries with debug symbols is a mistake, and that's what @ho_schi is criticising.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
karpierz 3y ago
The author is noting that in this particular case, Valve made a mistake in releasing the debug symbols for a particular build, as noted by them releasing them in a 2017 build, and then removing them in a subsequent build. The author did not say that "shipping with debug symbols is always a mistake", they noted that it can happen unintentionally and provided evidence of that in this case.

nmilo 3y ago

I'm sick of this weird HN trend where readers pick out a single sentence only tangentially related to the rest of the article and then try to prove how smart they are by rebutting it.

gaucheries 3y ago
you mean that's not the whole point of posting here?
bogwog 3y ago
These Reddit-like comment sections with public vote counters highly incentivize this type of thing. I don't even know why HN has a voting system? I think sorting comment threads by number of replies would be more useful. Vote counters only make sense when you have a massive amount of comments to sort through, which really only happens on posts about Apple afaik. However, those comment threads tend to be filled with useless arguing anyways. Would people stop using this site if it stopped offering dopamine hits in the form of a number next to your name?
- ajmurmann 3y ago
  Reply count can be more of an indicator of controversy, rather than value. The best comment might provide me deep me deep new insight, but all I have to say is "that's great!". Saying something inflammatory results in lots of replies.
  - Sebb767 3y ago
    In fact, the HN algorithm downranks threads with a high comment-to-point ratio.
- DANmode 3y ago
  I choose to believe there exists an old guard that use the site without points visible, either through frontend modification or mobile apps.
Supermancho 3y ago
This is a good form habit. Discussion is largely about creating narratives and arguments to try to come to a consensus on reality. This is ostensibly useful. When someone makes a statement and that statement is innaccurate or untrue, it is helpful to correct it so that they can change their post/future-posts to ensure they are making the strongest argument/most compelling narrative possible. Sometimes this is misused or misunderstood to be combative, but it is not constructive to approach conversation this way.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

ho_schi 3y ago

I’m sorry. You are right! I missed to quote the sentence before :( As pointed out by jpmoral, I consider debug symbols generally a good thing. Exceptions apply as usual e.g. embedded computing. Another approach is using stuff like debuginfod to ship debug symbols automatically when needed. Archlinux and Fedora do that and it improved debugging and reporting - especially regarding dependencies.